Do you care that the NHL isn't going to the olympics

[BigBadBruins7708]

I don't understand how one can be a hockey fan and not wanting to see the best players in the world play against each other.

I, for one, care very much.

I do want to see that...its why I watch the NHL

 

[KingsFan7824]

Always weird when people say it's best on best. It's best on best, from each country, not the absolute best 250-some players or whatever.

I get it from Canada, they're always the favorite. I get it from Sweden, Finland, etc, because the best players from those countries usually play in the US or Canada during a hockey season, so not easy to follow. It's like if McDavid played professionally in Sweden.

If the NHL wasn't as international as it is, the nationalism of the Olympics would make more sense. If Karlsson and Hedman were in Sweden, and the only time they could play against McDavid and Crosby was every 4 years, that would be something special(as an American). Or when the Soviet team was around, they were a mysterious juggernaut. They even played NHL teams. Now it's just Team Russia, and their best players are free to play in the NHL.

 

[Syrinx]

It's just a proven fact the US has the most gifted athletes on earth.

I don't think it's a proven fact that they have the most gifted athletes on earth. That is probably spread evenly across most countries.

I do think the USA puts more money (from all sources) into training and facilities allowing it to find and exploit that talent better than any other country.

 

[sandysan]

i still think its on the players and what they want... i understand everybody wants to make as much money as they can. so when this private league hands out his contracts... there must be some clause to play olympic hockey. everybody knows there is this big tournament every 4 years..., nba finds a solution why the nhl/nhlpa cant do it ?

when they signed those guaranteed contracts, they became contractually obligated to their teams. you cannot in good conscience say that you can sign a contract, decide unilaterally not to uphold your end of it, and that there cannot be any reprecussions for what amounts to a willfull breach.

if there was such a clause it must be written in invisible ink. There MAY well be clause in the next CBA but the problem wont be the owners, it will be the majority of the PA who WONT be going to the olympics. Because the owners have already made it clear, if the players that they have UNDER CONTRACT want to go to the olympics, then the players will have to make concessions to the owners. What these concessions will be is unknown ( they initially floated pushing the opt out dat back, the pa never even voted on it before rejecting it) but concessions WILL need to be made.

Do you have the stars looking at their fourth line grinder teamates who make a lot less and have far less employment certaininty that THEY should make concessions on their contracts so that the stars get to play in the olympics. As talent laden as the league is, the majority of players wont go to the olympics, so getting them to make concessions so that a minority can, is a VERY VERY hard sell.

And I'm glad you mentioned the NBA, 1) they dont shut down the league 2) the likelihood of catastrophi injury is far less 3) the start are ALREADY starting to decline going because they dont get didly from it and I suspect that many silently fear being on the team that DOESNT cakewalk to the gold.

 

[sandysan]

I don't understand how one can be a hockey fan and not wanting to see the best players in the world play against each other.

I, for one, care very much.

so you are/were pro world cup of hockey that HAD the best players in the world playing each other ?

 

[Syrinx]

I love the winter Olympics.

I couldn't care less that the NHL players aren't going for three reasons:
1 - I love to see all of these other sports that I wouldn't normally see for a couple weeks every four years. I don't even usually watch the hockey if I have other options.
2 - I love the athlete stories. I already know most NHL player stories that I'm interested in.
3 - The players make millions to play for their NHL teams. Why should the team have to allow them to risk injury?

 

[sandysan]

This line of thinking always bothers me. This event happens every four (or two) years regardless of the state of the country. Not every single cent saved on not hosting the Olympics would go towards doing whatever you think the government has to do in your dream world. That's not how the economy/world works.

Are no countries ever allowed to host events now because some other country is poor?



Wasn't aware the IOC was in charge of ending world hunger and promoting world peace either :/

isnt promoting peace and understanding through sport part of their mission statement ?

from the horse's ass ( I mean mouth)

he goal of the Olympic Movement is to contribute to building a peaceful and better world by educating youth through sport practised without discrimination of any kind, in a spirit of friendship, solidarity and fair play.

And world hunger is a tough one when their representatives need 900 dollar a day per diems.

 

[Raymoondo]

isnt promoting peace and understanding through sport part of their mission statement ?

from the horse's ass ( I mean mouth)

he goal of the Olympic Movement is to contribute to building a peaceful and better world by educating youth through sport practised without discrimination of any kind, in a spirit of friendship, solidarity and fair play.

And world hunger is a tough one when their representatives need 900 dollar a day per diems.

What? I can't tell if you're trolling or not anymore..

 

[Tom Polakis]

It's just a proven fact the US has the most gifted athletes on earth.

I don't think it's a proven fact that they have the most gifted athletes on earth. That is probably spread evenly across most countries.

I do think the USA puts more money (from all sources) into training and facilities allowing it to find and exploit that talent better than any other country.

That sounds like a more reasonable explanation for the USA's advantage in Olympic competition. Rather than one country having the most gifted athletes, perhaps extrinsic factors weigh in, no?

 

[sandysan]

What? I can't tell if you're trolling or not anymore..

if you dont like the olympic mission statement, your beef is with them not me for telling it to you. But their mission statement is to enrich the world and promote peace through sport. Take it up with them.

 

[luki here]

It's weird that all the fat people can somehow dominate the largest sports competition in the galaxy but damn they somehow do it. You have to think the rest of the world would get tired of being dominated by a bunch of lazy lard asses when they try so hard and are in such good shape but they just can't win. It has to be demoralizing to think you are in Olympic shape and world class athlete in the top percentile body weight and nope shamu beats you on every land competitive event and then some guy dressed as fat bastard from Austin powers only 17 times heavier wins every water competition. I'd assume they are at the ledge being talked down from the ledge at this point.

You said the most athletic country in the world. Not my fault if you phrase poorly.

Also: obviously the USA are not the most successful at olympic games/capita. I think taking the absolut number of medals has its merit, but it isn't cut and dry.

you understand the definition of MAY, yes ? And this isnt news to me, people are looking for ways to do precisely this ( as I mentioned) but we are not there yet, we don't know how long we have to go or if any of these things will ever pan out.

if you want to reduce diagnosis to afflictions that people " might" have, that kind of sets medical science back a little more than I'm comfortable with.

As of right now ( and likely for the near future) EVERY SINGLE diagnosis of CTE has relied on IHC and was done post mortem. them's the facts.

did you actually read the article ? it starts with this

It is a humbling but very motivating fact that a person currently has to die before doctors can make a diagnosis of chronic traumatic encephalopathy, the degenerative brain disease that afflicts many professional football players and other athletes who have sustained repeated blows to the head.

I dont know what will happen in the future, I hope we do find a good biomarker, but as of right now, I cannot be any clearer, CTE is ONLY diagnosed by IHC of brain sections.

hey no need to be so patronising, I didn't need rhetoric questions to bring my point across. Research is being done and there has been a NFL player who was diagnosed pre-mortem.

The Future of Detecting Brain Damage in Football

only because it isn't definitive doesn't mean it is a worthless diagnosis. I mean some diseases are diagnosed by exclusion, how do you feel about that? Obviously a larger amount of cases need to attempted, but if I were feeling the symptoms, i guess i would head over to the doc who thinks he may be able to diagnose CTE with a simple PET scan.

 

[luki here]

my bad.

 

[Raymoondo]

if you dont like the olympic mission statement, your beef is with them not me for telling it to you. But their mission statement is to enrich the world and promote peace through sport. Take it up with them.

How have they not been doing that? I'm not going to argue against the fact that the committee itself might be taking up a lot of money, but they have absolutely been promoting peace and enriching the world through sport.

That doesn't mean it's their job to solve world hunger or singlehandedly end racism and whatever else the original post stated.

 

[ThePhoenixx]

No.

 

[luki here]

No, I don't care if the NHL doesn't go to the Olympics. I HATE the Olympics. It's the dumbest, and biggest money/time/energy wasting crap of all time.

People are starving to death in the world. Kids are stuck in the middle of war zones. Diseases are killing us every day. Pollution is reaching unbelievable levels around the world. Racism is out of control everywhere.

We need to stop pumping billions and billions of dollars into that crap every two years, and actually do something to help each other and this planet.

NO MORE OLYMPICS.

Who is pumping billions of dollars into the olympics? Are they funded by the international state community? I thought they funded themselves (leaving nearly nothing for the host nations).

 

[sandysan]

You said the most athletic country in the world. Not my fault if you phrase poorly.

Also: obviously the USA are not the most successful at olympic games/capita. I think taking the absolut number of medals has its merit, but it isn't cut and dry.

hey no need to be so patronising, I didn't need rhetoric questions to bring my point across. Research is being done and there has been a NFL player who was diagnosed pre-mortem.

The Future of Detecting Brain Damage in Football

only because it isn't definitive doesn't mean it is a worthless diagnosis. I mean some diseases are diagnosed by exclusion, how do you feel about that? Obviously a larger amount of cases need to attempted, but if I were feeling the symptoms, i guess i would head over to the doc who thinks he may be able to diagnose CTE with a simple PET scan.

Im not being patronizing if you are willingly ignoring the word "MAY" in the previous article and the word " future" in the one you just posted. Diagnoses pretty much have to be definitive, its not a guessing game or based on the preponderance of the evidence. if you say someone HAS CTE, " when did they die?" is a perfectly reasonable question. If you say you think they MAY have CTE, well they MAY have a lot of things.

why don't you just admit that you were wrong, I was right, that CTE diagnosis right now requires IHC and that unless you have a souped up delorean, that what might may or could happen in the future does us absolutely no good right now ?

yes research is being done, i admitted it and am aware of it. but the path from research to diagnostic is a long and arduous one where the outcome is still very much uncertain. I do not want to be patronizing and have no quarrel with you but your position is EXACTLY how we get more wakefields. I don't want that and I dont think anyone should.

 

[al secord]

I'm glad we won't have to watch Auston Matthews lead his country to Gold.

 

[mikeyp24]

You said the most athletic country in the world. Not my fault if you phrase poorly.

Also: obviously the USA are not the most successful at olympic games/capita. I think taking the absolut number of medals has its merit, but it isn't cut and dry.

hey no need to be so patronising, I didn't need rhetoric questions to bring my point across. Research is being done and there has been a NFL player who was diagnosed pre-mortem.

The Future of Detecting Brain Damage in Football

only because it isn't definitive doesn't mean it is a worthless diagnosis. I mean some diseases are diagnosed by exclusion, how do you feel about that? Obviously a larger amount of cases need to attempted, but if I were feeling the symptoms, i guess i would head over to the doc who thinks he may be able to diagnose CTE with a simple PET scan.

I don't think you know what athletic means. You can be 450 pounds and be incredibly athletic. A large section of NFL players are considered obease even though they are extremely athletic and in good shape. BMI which determines that stuff is a shitty determining factor. I find it hilarious that the only thing non Americans say or can try to argue is this Americans are fat thing but when it comes to athletic competition at the highest level we have in average the best of the best. It just makes me laugh that apparently our fat asses out swim, run, row, etc better then the Europeans and Canada is really good at trampoline

 

[lomiller1]

Do not confuse a sense of patriotism for caring for the sport.

Why didn't Michael Phelps cause a huge surge in interest in swimming outside of the Olympics? How did the US Womens gymnasts do at the last World Championship?

Secondly, I would expect US Olympic hockey games to get huge ratings. The whole country is watching THAT one game. It is not like a typical NHL game that will draw in it's home markets and little elsewhere. If you really want to compare, compare how the 2014 Olympics did against the Stanley Cup Finals in the LA and NYC metro areas. Compare 2010 with the Chicago and Philadelphia tv markets.

There has not been a spike in ratings, merchandise sales, or tickets sales following any of the past 5 Olympics.

I’m reaching the point where basically done with the Olympics in general. If you really want to support the athletes, support their national championships, world championships etc. Screw corrupt bodies like the IOC that essential screw everyone, from the host nation to the sports bodies who participate in the games.

 

[JETZZZ]

I understand why the NHL doesn't want the players to go, but it still just sucks for the fans and players. If the NHL had ran a consistent Best-on-Best World Cup every 4 years since 96, and stayed out of the Olympics, that might have been even better, but that last one was just a joke. (Hell, if the NHL owners stayed out of international hockey and the IIHF ran the World Cup, that would be the best)

wrong.

the NHL just wants a fair shake.

The IOC is insisting on:

- not paying for insurance against player injury
- not allowing the NHL to use anything Olympic related (footage, results, etc) in their own marketing efforts
- not sharing any of the revenue the IOC makes from using their players with the NHL

The IOC is literally insisting on keeping every single benefit and take on absolutely zero risk while forcing the NHL to shoulder 100% of the risk for 0% of the benefit.

But yeah, its the NHL thats being unreasonable.

Reminds me of the NHL owners whenever they want hundreds of millions of dollars in public funding to replace 30 year old arenas. Nobody is saying that the IOC isn't evil and greedy and corrupt, but its kinda funny when the shoe is on the other foot.

 

[luki here]

Im not being patronizing if you are willingly ignoring the word "MAY" in the previous article and the word " future" in the one you just posted. Diagnoses pretty much have to be definitive, its not a guessing game or based on the preponderance of the evidence. if you say someone HAS CTE, " when did they die?" is a perfectly reasonable question. If you say you think they MAY have CTE, well they MAY have a lot of things.

why don't you just admit that you were wrong, I was right, that CTE diagnosis right now requires IHC and that unless you have a souped up delorean, that what might may or could happen in the future does us absolutely no good right now ?

yes research is being done, i admitted it and am aware of it. but the path from research to diagnostic is a long and arduous one where the outcome is still very much uncertain. I do not want to be patronizing and have no quarrel with you but your position is EXACTLY how we get more wakefields. I don't want that and I dont think anyone should.

I may have been wrong about someone having been diagnosed with CTE pre-mortem (I remember reading some article about that sometime, couldnt find it, maybe someone else remembers?). However i do reserve my opinion that you came across as patronising, no big deal either.

I completely agree, that "when did they die?" is a reasonable question. "Doc can you perform a PET-scan on me to see if i might have CTE?" also seems like a reasonable question to me.

I would also like to re-iterate my previous point: I think a non definitive diagnosis is still a diagnosis (for instance a differential diagnosis- i know it ends up with tests that try to provide a definitve diagnosis). It might not be a valuable diagnosis, but you didn't specify in your original post (even though it was obvious what you meant).

 

[therealkoho]

short answer, I couldn't care less, it is a thorn in the side of the NHL season as far as I'm concerned

I will watch most of the amateurs/pros in the upcoming games and I will cheer for Canada like I always do. The thing I look forward to is the downhill skiing and Snowboard X, which is one of the most exciting sports ever

 

[BagHead]

I don't think it's a proven fact that they have the most gifted athletes on earth. That is probably spread evenly across most countries.

I do think the USA puts more money (from all sources) into training and facilities allowing it to find and exploit that talent better than any other country.

I think you're right. You'll notice the most medals correlate strongly with how rich each country is. Having wealth allows you to spend your resources in disposable (not critical to survival) ways, like training athletes, and building skyscrapers. It's also not a coincidence that the countries with the largest population counts are often the ones with the most medals at the end, as the "prospect pool" is much larger, giving you better odds of finding at least one superstar athlete.

As for the OP: I don't care too much that the NHL isn't going. It'll be nice to watch some guys who never really get the chance to be on such a large stage try to win it. That said, I do think the Olympics should be the best of the best in each sport, so the NHL allowing their players to go is ideal toward that mindset.

 

[luki here]

Have you never looked at a medal count after the Olympics? When is the last time the USA didn't have the most medals at the end. Especially when half the country doesn't even get snow to practice these sports... Look at say that 20 years of medals Canada vs the US and see how many more they have. Add in the summer and it's comically sad. It's just a proven fact the US has the most gifted athletes on earth.

I have looked at all of them. The US (ranked 3rd) had the most medals in Sotchi with 28. Really pulls them ahead of Canada (Rank 2, 25 medals) and norway (rank 1 and 26 medals). The United States have appr. 62x the population of norway (albeit all of norway can have snow in winter, while only parts of the US). Does that really scream evidence that the US has the most athletic (whatever that means) population? To me it doesn't, not that they definitely don't either. I just see no strong enough basis for the claims you are making.

 

[sandysan]

I may have been wrong about someone having been diagnosed with CTE pre-mortem (I remember reading some article about that sometime, couldnt find it, maybe someone else remembers?). However i do reserve my opinion that you came across as patronising, no big deal either.

I completely agree, that "when did they die?" is a reasonable question. "Doc can you perform a PET-scan on me to see if i might have CTE?" also seems like a reasonable question to me.

I would also like to re-iterate my previous point: I think a non definitive diagnosis is still a diagnosis (for instance a differential diagnosis- i know it ends up with tests that try to provide a definitve diagnosis). It might not be a valuable diagnosis, but you didn't specify in your original post (even though it was obvious what you meant).

pet scans do not and formally cannot detect CTE. It's akin to saying you went to a phrenologist to see if you had CTE. The guy that rubbed your head might think you have CTE, but that's a far cry from evidence that you do

this is the definition of diagnosis

1. 1.
   the identification of the nature of an illness or other problem by examination of the symptoms.
   "early diagnosis and treatment are essential"
   

   synonyms:

   identification, detection, recognition, determination, discovery, pinpointing

   [TBODY] [/TBODY]

• I don't see " getting it close enough or still withing the realm of formal possibility as being a synonym. And a non valuable diagnosis is by definition not valuable. if it were, " ebola" could be the diagnosis for everything. the value of a diagnosis is IN the identification of the underlying cause of the illness or symptom. If you want to unilaterally redefine the word to suit your argument, then I say that you sir are a " genius".