Discussion: Coach Willie Desjardins | V

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SirKillalot

Registered User
Feb 27, 2008
5,864
276
Norway
Hi!

We have a new NHL-website with NHL content.

See were we rank your Vancouver Canucks:

https://nhlnor.com/2016/10/13/season-previews-nhlnor-nhl-20162017/

Where we among other things say that Willie Desjardins can't be blamed for the lack of success you'll have this season.

I don't think we'll see much success for you this season, mainly because how the team used to be structured has been taken apart over the last 3 years or so. Frankly to me it's incredible how hard and fast you fell, given how good that 2011 team was.
 

Huggy

Respectful Handshake
Jul 22, 2014
9,673
706
Vancouver
Hi!

We have a new NHL-website with NHL content.

See were we rank your Vancouver Canucks:

https://nhlnor.com/2016/10/13/season-previews-nhlnor-nhl-20162017/

Where we among other things say that Willie Desjardins can't be blamed for the lack of success you'll have this season.

I don't think we'll see much success for you this season, mainly because how the team used to be structured has been taken apart over the last 3 years or so. Frankly to me it's incredible how hard and fast you fell, given how good that 2011 team was.

I disagree, he is the worst coach of all time.
 

WTG

December 5th
Jan 11, 2015
23,933
8,136
Pickle Time Deli & Market
Hi!

We have a new NHL-website with NHL content.

See were we rank your Vancouver Canucks:

https://nhlnor.com/2016/10/13/season-previews-nhlnor-nhl-20162017/

Where we among other things say that Willie Desjardins can't be blamed for the lack of success you'll have this season.

I don't think we'll see much success for you this season, mainly because how the team used to be structured has been taken apart over the last 3 years or so. Frankly to me it's incredible how hard and fast you fell, given how good that 2011 team was.

I read it, your overall ranking seems fair on the canucks.

However, I do not necessarily agree with the ranking of the defense as bellow average. And I do not think our offense is above average.

But overall it seems pretty reasonable.

We are a pretty average opening night lineup. I think WD does make us a worse then advertised team though. And you are right that as soon as we have injuries we are in tough shape.


Fair assessment.
 

SirKillalot

Registered User
Feb 27, 2008
5,864
276
Norway
I read it, your overall ranking seems fair on the canucks.

However, I do not necessarily agree with the ranking of the defense as bellow average. And I do not think our offense is above average.

But overall it seems pretty reasonable.

We are a pretty average opening night lineup. I think WD does make us a worse then advertised team though. And you are right that as soon as we have injuries we are in tough shape.


Fair assessment.

Thanks for giving some solid feedback!

We were a bit harsh on the defense for a couple of reasons. They weren't very good last season, and the guy they traded for (Gudbranson) also received his fair share of critique last year. So, in that sense they of course have a better potential. That I absolutely agree with, but I'm doubtful that we'll see too much of that this season.

Maybe a slight improvement.

Offensively you definitely got some interesting forwards to look at this season, but as you said. Skeptical that it will be an improvement of a serious factor. Should be some though, it would be a huge letdown if they aren't better than last season.
 

mathonwy

Positively #toxic
Jan 21, 2008
19,155
10,130
Hi!

We have a new NHL-website with NHL content.

See were we rank your Vancouver Canucks:

https://nhlnor.com/2016/10/13/season-previews-nhlnor-nhl-20162017/

Where we among other things say that Willie Desjardins can't be blamed for the lack of success you'll have this season.

I don't think we'll see much success for you this season, mainly because how the team used to be structured has been taken apart over the last 3 years or so. Frankly to me it's incredible how hard and fast you fell, given how good that 2011 team was.

Might want to do a spellcheck before posting your thread to a team forum.

sJcfgbY.png

68OGhma.png


Don't agree with the below average defense. Our top 6 should be pretty decent at keeping the puck out of the net. It's the offense that is the biggest question mark right now.

With both Bart and Weber gone, I currently have more confidence in our defense than our forwards. Especially if Biega slots in and Sbisa is driven to the airport.
 

SirKillalot

Registered User
Feb 27, 2008
5,864
276
Norway
Might want to do a spellcheck before posting your thread to a team forum.

sJcfgbY.png

68OGhma.png


Don't agree with the below average defense. Our top 6 should be pretty decent at keeping the puck out of the net. It's the offense that is the biggest question mark right now.

With both Bart and Weber gone, I currently have more confidence in our defense than our forwards. Especially if Biega slots in and Sbisa is driven to the airport.

Sorry about that. Thank's for the heads up. Hadn't noticed, and the grammar spellcheck somehow didn't catch that. Have had some major issues with the laptop, and in specific the keyboard, where I think the problem is that it overheats and goes slow/doesn't react properly when it's been on for a long time.

Hehe, I agree that the D can surprise and do better. Well. One should expect them to do better. Ideally, the defense would be above average 6+. But, I don't think they will be.
 

JA

Guest
We have already finished 3rd and 6th last in three years. The trajectory for the team makes it very possible to be our worst ever era.
Between 1984-85 and 1989-90, the Canucks finished 4th last, 6th last, 3rd last, 3rd last, 8th last, and 2nd last, respectively, in six consecutive seasons. The team missed the playoffs in four of those six years.
 

MikeK

Registered User
Nov 10, 2008
10,789
4,412
Earth
Nice guy and all, but he needs to go. I'm astounded by some of the things he says.

It makes me wonder how he got as far as he did. I think he's a great person, but one of the worst coaches this Franchise has ever had. The fact this management group actually chose him over others speaks to the level we have fallen to.
 

krutovsdonut

eeyore
Sep 25, 2016
16,916
9,605
as i said earlier, the horvat 4th line thing is the first willie thing i'd call out as appearing to be outright stupid (from the outside). i sympathize with the idea of granlund needing good guys to play better, but the way it was described seems ridiculous and the fact horvat stated publicly he expected to play with baertschi indicates he is (rightly) pissed. the obvious solution is to create 3 third lines mixing the wingers evenly or to give horvat an energy line of something like gaunce/virtanen to go cause havoc. the naive idea that burrows/dorsett are going to shut down top lines and the idea of robbing horvat of the chance to score points after he has done everything you asked of him just is too breathlessly stupid to take in. the genie is out of the bottle. letting a top prospect be creative and undisciplined and taste apparent success then unduly reigning them in is toxic. it is how the oilers have repeatedly ruined or setback their top draft choices.

we'll see how many minutes horvat gets and what chances he gets. hopefully a tempest in a teapot but still troublingly clueless.

as for willie's overall coaching, i don't see rolling 4 lines as a bad thing. it was the right thing after torts blew the team up shortening the bench the year before, and it was the right thing to develop players last year. it makes sense for a rebuilding team with aging veterans playing well beyond the level of the rest of the team. i actually see it as the team's only shot and a good way to develop young talent. as soon as you start matching or zone starts or sheltering younger players you end up overplaying the sedins. even in their prime they would run out of gas over a season. how much they can take today and how much that plays into line strategy is something that gets overlooked.

and blaming too many men penalties on willie is interesting since he's not directly managing the changes. in any event, it's not a weighty factor in assessing the guy for me. a better critique is how badly the canucks played last year in overtime and 4 on 4. we used to thrive on that. since willie came along, we look lost.

anyway, we'll see this year. willie is playing for his job. and he's said he is done developing. i'd like him to roll 4 lines as much as he can but i expect him to line match, shorten the bench and everything else to stay afloat until the sedins crash and burn. we'll see how that goes.
 

racerjoe

Registered User
Jun 3, 2012
12,202
5,915
Vancouver
as i said earlier, the horvat 4th line thing is the first willie thing i'd call out as appearing to be outright stupid (from the outside). i sympathize with the idea of granlund needing good guys to play better, but the way it was described seems ridiculous and the fact horvat stated publicly he expected to play with baertschi indicates he is (rightly) pissed. the obvious solution is to create 3 third lines mixing the wingers evenly or to give horvat an energy line of something like gaunce/virtanen to go cause havoc. the naive idea that burrows/dorsett are going to shut down top lines and the idea of robbing horvat of the chance to score points after he has done everything you asked of him just is too breathlessly stupid to take in. the genie is out of the bottle. letting a top prospect be creative and undisciplined and taste apparent success then unduly reigning them in is toxic. it is how the oilers have repeatedly ruined or setback their top draft choices.

we'll see how many minutes horvat gets and what chances he gets. hopefully a tempest in a teapot but still troublingly clueless.

as for willie's overall coaching, i don't see rolling 4 lines as a bad thing. it was the right thing after torts blew the team up shortening the bench the year before, and it was the right thing to develop players last year. it makes sense for a rebuilding team with aging veterans playing well beyond the level of the rest of the team. i actually see it as the team's only shot and a good way to develop young talent. as soon as you start matching or zone starts or sheltering younger players you end up overplaying the sedins. even in their prime they would run out of gas over a season. how much they can take today and how much that plays into line strategy is something that gets overlooked.

and blaming too many men penalties on willie is interesting since he's not directly managing the changes. in any event, it's not a weighty factor in assessing the guy for me. a better critique is how badly the canucks played last year in overtime and 4 on 4. we used to thrive on that. since willie came along, we look lost.

anyway, we'll see this year. willie is playing for his job. and he's said he is done developing. i'd like him to roll 4 lines as much as he can but i expect him to line match, shorten the bench and everything else to stay afloat until the sedins crash and burn. we'll see how that goes.

I am more shocked this is the first thing you blame willie for.

For a team with the most two many men penalties, the 1,2,3,4, in the playoffs. I could just go on and on. How do you justify most of this?
 

VanJack

Registered User
Jul 11, 2014
21,385
14,652
Last season the Canucks as a team were the poster-child for mediocrity....not a single three-game win streak until late in the year, and led the league by a mile in third period/overtime meltdowns...can't blame the rookies, because they hardly played.....if those trends continue this year, they're toast, whether or not the injuries come....at some point you have to look at what's happening behind the bench, don't you?
 

krutovsdonut

eeyore
Sep 25, 2016
16,916
9,605
I am more shocked this is the first thing you blame willie for.

For a team with the most two many men penalties, the 1,2,3,4, in the playoffs. I could just go on and on. How do you justify most of this?

well he lost that series on defence and lack of physicality. playing the sedins more often wasn't going to stop ferlund skating around taking liberties. bieksa was supposed to stop that.

he had a team full of veterans who got to the playoffs using cunning and experience where they were promptly overwhelmed by youth and enthusiasm.
 

Ryp37

Registered User
Nov 6, 2011
7,525
1,081
as i said earlier, the horvat 4th line thing is the first willie thing i'd call out as appearing to be outright stupid (from the outside). i sympathize with the idea of granlund needing good guys to play better, but the way it was described seems ridiculous and the fact horvat stated publicly he expected to play with baertschi indicates he is (rightly) pissed. the obvious solution is to create 3 third lines mixing the wingers evenly or to give horvat an energy line of something like gaunce/virtanen to go cause havoc. the naive idea that burrows/dorsett are going to shut down top lines and the idea of robbing horvat of the chance to score points after he has done everything you asked of him just is too breathlessly stupid to take in. the genie is out of the bottle. letting a top prospect be creative and undisciplined and taste apparent success then unduly reigning them in is toxic. it is how the oilers have repeatedly ruined or setback their top draft choices.

we'll see how many minutes horvat gets and what chances he gets. hopefully a tempest in a teapot but still troublingly clueless.

as for willie's overall coaching, i don't see rolling 4 lines as a bad thing. it was the right thing after torts blew the team up shortening the bench the year before, and it was the right thing to develop players last year. it makes sense for a rebuilding team with aging veterans playing well beyond the level of the rest of the team. i actually see it as the team's only shot and a good way to develop young talent. as soon as you start matching or zone starts or sheltering younger players you end up overplaying the sedins. even in their prime they would run out of gas over a season. how much they can take today and how much that plays into line strategy is something that gets overlooked.

and blaming too many men penalties on willie is interesting since he's not directly managing the changes. in any event, it's not a weighty factor in assessing the guy for me. a better critique is how badly the canucks played last year in overtime and 4 on 4. we used to thrive on that. since willie came along, we look lost.

anyway, we'll see this year. willie is playing for his job. and he's said he is done developing. i'd like him to roll 4 lines as much as he can but i expect him to line match, shorten the bench and everything else to stay afloat until the sedins crash and burn. we'll see how that goes.

Did you watch the playoff series against Calgary in his first year?
 

Rotting Corpse*

Registered User
Sep 20, 2003
60,153
3
Kelowna, BC
well he lost that series on defence and lack of physicality. playing the sedins more often wasn't going to stop ferlund skating around taking liberties. bieksa was supposed to stop that.

he had a team full of veterans who got to the playoffs using cunning and experience where they were promptly overwhelmed by youth and enthusiasm.

He lost the series because he played his worst players as often as he played his best players, while the coach on the other side played his best players significantly more often than his worst players.

I've never seen a series so dramatically decided by coaching. Or rather managing, to describe it better.

Willie as a baseball manager - "Why are they sending that other dude to the plate when this guy is supposed to hit? Are they allowed to do that? Pinch what?"
 

RobertKron

Registered User
Sep 1, 2007
15,521
8,665
well he lost that series on defence and lack of physicality. playing the sedins more often wasn't going to stop ferlund skating around taking liberties. bieksa was supposed to stop that.

he had a team full of veterans who got to the playoffs using cunning and experience where they were promptly overwhelmed by youth and enthusiasm.

You can't possibly believe this.
 

AwesomeInTheory

A Christmas miracle
Aug 21, 2015
4,282
4,521
well he lost that series on defence and lack of physicality. playing the sedins more often wasn't going to stop ferlund skating around taking liberties. bieksa was supposed to stop that.

Why is it that Big Scary Michael Ferlund only was a thing in that series?

Answer: because Willie was hopelessly outcoached and people ended up parroting the talking points that Linden/Benning made during the offseason and it got accepted as fact.

he had a team full of veterans who got to the playoffs using cunning and experience where they were promptly overwhelmed by youth and enthusiasm.

Yeah, which is why a similar veteran Ducks team were able to steamroll them. Wait. No...

The fact that Anaheim's coach didn't sit his top line for nearly 5 minutes because he had to adhere to a fanatical 1/2/3/4 rotation regardless of situation or circumstance.
 

krutovsdonut

eeyore
Sep 25, 2016
16,916
9,605
You can't possibly believe this.

i'm old school. when you get right down to it, i believe bieksa not backing up his chirping finished us. things just fell apart.

that team was a regular season team if ever i have seen one. it had no chance whatever in the playoffs except catching an inexperienced team and killing them early. it failed to do that and the tide turned accordingly.

but by all means blame the coach.
 

M2Beezy

Objective and Neutral Hockey Commentator
Sponsor
May 25, 2014
45,838
31,168
Hi!

We have a new NHL-website with NHL content.

See were we rank your Vancouver Canucks:

https://nhlnor.com/2016/10/13/season-previews-nhlnor-nhl-20162017/

Where we among other things say that Willie Desjardins can't be blamed for the lack of success you'll have this season.

I don't think we'll see much success for you this season, mainly because how the team used to be structured has been taken apart over the last 3 years or so. Frankly to me it's incredible how hard and fast you fell, given how good that 2011 team was.

Wow great website thanks for posting! :)
 

Fat Tony

Fire Benning
Nov 28, 2011
3,012
0
i'm old school. when you get right down to it, i believe bieksa not backing up his chirping finished us. things just fell apart.

that team was a regular season team if ever i have seen one. it had no chance whatever in the playoffs except catching an inexperienced team and killing them early. it failed to do that and the tide turned accordingly.

but by all means blame the coach.

Oh dear.
 

MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,752
84,941
Vancouver, BC
i'm old school. when you get right down to it, i believe bieksa not backing up his chirping finished us. things just fell apart.

that team was a regular season team if ever i have seen one. it had no chance whatever in the playoffs except catching an inexperienced team and killing them early. it failed to do that and the tide turned accordingly.

but by all means blame the coach.

My god, man.

That series was probably the biggest coaching disaster in NHL history.

If you think that some 4th liner having a few hits was more important than an NHL coach conceding last change and allowing his opposite number his favoured matchups from start to finish, while simultaneously giving Derek Dorsett more ES icetime than Daniel Sedin and the Sbisa pairing more ES icetime than Tanev-Edler, and losing because your worst players are being hopelessly overplayed and getting ventilated in unfavourable matchups ... I don't even know what to say. You're just laughably incorrect.
 

SirKillalot

Registered User
Feb 27, 2008
5,864
276
Norway
Wow great website thanks for posting! :)

Thanks for that!

Sorry about being rough on your Canucks, but honestly, given how the state is. I believe they should consider going into full rebuild-mode (meaning, even how bad that hurts, trading the Sedins as the Flames traded Iginla). Otherwise, I believe the alternative will be to be outside the playoffs spot unless your draft a couple of players who surprise and go in and contribute immediately. Which in turn raise the possibility of other players wanting to sign there.

As we have great examples of with the Oilers (Lucic), Flames (Elliott, Brouwer) and Sabres (Okposo) right now. Outside Elliott, not necessarily players who drive a line, but is highly great complimentary players.

Would you say you agree with the rating of Vancouver? Did we miss anything, to harsh on something?

Feel free to compare up with the other teams, as there surely is things people disagree with (and agree).
 
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