OT: Covid-19 (Part 17) When the World is Running Down...

[waffledave]

What's nuts is that in terms of cities, Montreal is one of the worst in the world. We have more confirmed cases than entire countries.

It's too early to open Montreal while there is an outbreak in the north east end and while we haven't seen a dip in daily cases. We're still at 700-900 cases per day.

I'm telling you man, everyone thinks they will be OK, that it won't happen to them. They pretend like they are ready to take the risk, but deep down nobody actually thinks it will happen to them, to their spouses, to their kids, to their parents, to their friends.

 

[Andy]

But guys, aren't we worried more about the cases more then deaths that this virus is causing?

Cases, cases, cases yes

but who does this virus kill so far? 20 years olds? 40? 60? Will this virus kill us all? If not then... good news, we will be able to resume one day.

There is still so much we don't know about the virus.

While 32k confirmed cases is high, it's a drop in the bucket relative to Quebec's population. As you increase the possibility for a rise in cases, you increase the chances of complications to healthcare systems, as well as anomalous cases (such as young people dying).

Lastly, we have no idea what the long-term health consequences are. Suppose most are asymptomatic in the short-term, but in a year-2 years they develop severe health conditions. We will only delay the overwelming of hospital cases.

We talk about a functioning economy, but you need a healthy workforce to have a functioning economy. If the virus is cyclical, and the health consequences are long-term, the economy will be affected greatly regardless of whether we open now or later when a vaccine is available.

We are truly rolling the dice here.

You need to think that in 8 weeks we've already used up 25% of the province's 6k hospital beds. 25% while being on a fairly strict lockdown. Relax these measures and you can see the beds fill up very quickly.

 

[Fazkovsky]

waffledave, i completely agree. If i were in charge, i wouldn't re-open anything before June-July 15. Because an extra month would allow us to study the impact of mortality of this virus and the long-term effects of it. We do know that this virus can reduce lung function so far, thats very worrysome. Im surprised Georges Laraque is still alive. However, the economic impact of this is being vastly underrated. Do you know how much business a restaurant is losing by not being in business for just a week? Do you know how much small businesses probably wont re-open ever gain? Most of them got funding but if the lockdown persists longer, some would just go out of business. I believe everything happens for a reason in life, I think some stores should focus more on their online business. Direct shopping is very old school and companies should also assign a lot more work from home. Its maybe the big G upstairs that is waking us up.

Andy, i completely agree. The one fact that we know so far is that its killing older people more then the youngins. What we are trying to do is gradually open until we are set by fall or 2021, thats it. I agree its premature, i would have waited that 1 extra month but i have talked to a lot of people, the lockdown is a major mess for us physically and mentally.

 

[waffledave]

However, the economic impact of this is being vastly underrated. Do you know how much business a restaurant is losing by not being in business for just a week? Do you know how much small businesses probably wont re-open ever gain? Most of them got funding but if the lockdown persists longer, some would just go out of business. I believe everything happens for a reason in life, I think some stores should focus more on their online business. Direct shopping is very old school and companies should also assign a lot more work from home. Its maybe the big G upstairs that is waking us up.

Yes, this is an economic disaster and it's going to be the case for every country on earth. At the end of the day you need to decide whether are want to deal with an economic disaster, or a health disaster, knowing full well the health disaster, if it comes, will lead to economic problems anyway.

Many businesses will close. Many new businesses will open. Things will change. Restaurant industry will not be the same as it was, most restaurants can't operate at 50% capacity on a regular basis no matter what, not to mention increased costs due to more strict health procedures.

What happens to all the business owners and employees who are over 60? There are a whole lot of them, not everyone retires at 60 or 65 anymore. Is everyone who is vulnerable doomed to be locked up forever until there is a vaccine? I mean I don't see what other option there is for these people if number of cases and infection vectors is going to increase significantly.

If we reopen now we have no way to control it. We are effectively giving up on containing it. And so, we are also giving up on everyone 60 or older.

 

[Andy]

 

[CrAzYNiNe]

More cases=more deaths. Sure the percentage is low with the number of cases vs the number of deaths but none the less the more this spreads, the more it will spread to vulnerable people. Opening up Montreal is going to be a disaster!

 

[MilhouseIsScared]

It's a good thing you didnt have covid19, because anti-inflammatories like ibuprophen (advil) make it worst.

That’s what I thought , and I had none of the other main symptoms of the covid19 . I just gotta check that temp next couple of days beforeI go back to work

 

[MilhouseIsScared]

I'm telling you man, everyone thinks they will be OK, that it won't happen to them. They pretend like they are ready to take the risk, but deep down nobody actually thinks it will happen to them, to their spouses, to their kids, to their parents, to their friends.

Oh man , I do think it will happen to me and if not so well , I went out a total of 7 times since March 23rd , all essential . I’m 28 , I stopped smoking , I am in my healthy weight , no hypertension , I train 4 times a week ( 2x 10 km 2x 5 km running mixed with weights ) I work as a welder( meaning it’s not a desk job ) I could be selfish and not give a f*** about covid19 , but I think of my parents who are over 60 , my girlfriends mother who has a non-existant immunity system, and all of those other people who are more likely to suffer from it than I would . I am doing my part for everyone safety and at the same time I think long term of our economy repercussions of further closing our jobs . People are too selfish to decide between what is the best for themselves vs everyone in our society . They rather see their friends , family than to follow the rules and tell themselves (it’s not essential to see my friends ) Not everyone is doing it but it takes just a small fraction of people to screw everything for everyone

 

[scrubadam]

30 minutes to go. 1000+ cases here we come. 100+ deaths? Could be.

But don't worry there all in CHSLD's!

Not sure how we went from a great down ward trend and looking like we could be sub 300 cases a day by May to highest cases ever.

 

[llamateizer]

30 minutes to go. 1000+ cases here we come. 100+ deaths? Could be.

But don't worry there all in CHSLD's!

Not sure how we went from a great down ward trend and looking like we could be sub 300 cases a day by May to highest cases ever.

1000+ cases will be the minimum.
If we're doubling our testing capacity. I expect a 20% raise.

I'm not aware of CHSLD's current situation. so tough to say on the number of deaths.

 

[llamateizer]

interesting
Les enfants ne seraient pas des transmetteurs de la COVID-19, selon une étude | Coronavirus

that validates the opening of schools in regions.
CMM, we'll see.

IMHO, this is a political post by the Liberal party.
I hate this honestly, I hope we're not going there like the US are.

If he posted it AFTER re-opening schools, I'd be fine with it. but it's a plan with dates. some provinces put plans without any target date.

 

[sheed36]

No new cases for a 3rd straight day here in NL and we've had something like 2 positive cases in the past 2 weeks or so. We've had a total of 259 confirmed cases thus far and currently have 23 active cases here with 4 of these in the hospital and 2 of these 4 in ICU. They've tested 8935 people.

 

[SirClintonPortis]

Yes, this is an economic disaster and it's going to be the case for every country on earth. At the end of the day you need to decide whether are want to deal with an economic disaster, or a health disaster, knowing full well the health disaster, if it comes, will lead to economic problems anyway.

Many businesses will close. Many new businesses will open. Things will change. Restaurant industry will not be the same as it was, most restaurants can't operate at 50% capacity on a regular basis no matter what, not to mention increased costs due to more strict health procedures.

What happens to all the business owners and employees who are over 60? There are a whole lot of them, not everyone retires at 60 or 65 anymore. Is everyone who is vulnerable doomed to be locked up forever until there is a vaccine? I mean I don't see what other option there is for these people if number of cases and infection vectors is going to increase significantly.

If we reopen now we have no way to control it. We are effectively giving up on containing it. And so, we are also giving up on everyone 60 or older.

I believe the vaccine will take about 5 years because this thing has the the potential to hit everything inside the body and is very inconsistent in what symptoms show up, so the weeding out the many potential complications will take time and very many studies.. It isn't just the lungs, but the heart, skin, etc. By then, what will be "The Great Purge" would have already been completed and the economies would have restarted well before year 5. Currently, the needs of the many is that health needs to be preserved, but eventually, people will run out of money and the needs of the many will be more economic than health-related.

 

[Paddyjack]

It's a good thing you didnt have covid19, because anti-inflammatories like ibuprophen (advil) make it worst.

This was debunked as false.

 

[ECWHSWI]

The government is only opening elementary schools and a few industries where distanciation is possible. We arent opening anything of big envergure. I agree that re-opening stores would be a bit premature but all festivals this summer are cancelled, etc. Sports events are cancelled.We should prepare for the fall instead of thinking the fall or 2021 is the only date where normal life would resume. Everything does have to re-open gradually.

a bunch of 6-8 years old who havent seen their friends in a while, yeah distanciation, sure!

 

[llamateizer]

No new cases for a 3rd straight day here in NL and we've had something like 2 positive cases in the past 2 weeks or so. We've had a total of 259 confirmed cases thus far and currently have 23 active cases here with 4 of these in the hospital and 2 of these 4 in ICU. They've tested 8935 people.

being an island helps alot . So glad to see NL doing good

 

[llamateizer]

YESS! Radio-canada is talking about the missing data on CHSLD!!
let's see if it is raised in the press

 

[Phil Parent]

72 out of 75 deaths today in CHSLDs

 

[Phil Parent]

Only 18 more people hospitalized, and ICU stays the same.

 

[llamateizer]

Obviously. CMM re-opening is delayed by 1 week.

 

[Phil Parent]

Retail now opens on the 18th in Montreal.

 

[Karma Police]

Obviously. CMM re-opening is reported by 1 week.

Only said the ''commerces'' tho. Which means only the stores for the moment.

 

[llamateizer]

 

[scrubadam]

interesting
Les enfants ne seraient pas des transmetteurs de la COVID-19, selon une étude | Coronavirus

that validates the opening of schools in regions.

There is some confusion around this. The author of a study (not sure if its the same in the article) says that he was misquoted by the media. They aren't saying kids can't transmit it, but it is rare. So like most things about this virus there is confusion and up in the air. Almost like the WHO debacle when they said there is no evidence you can't get reinfected and this was interepreted to say there is no immunity.

Children 'do transmit COVID-19' to adults, says researcher whose report was 'misunderstood' as evidence that kids cannot spread coronavirus

But one of the researchers that authored the review in question, Alasdair Munro, insists their findings were misunderstood, and that children can indeed pass the virus to adults.

"Children almost certainly DO transmit COVID-19," Munro, a clinical research fellow in pediatric infectious diseases at University Hospital Southampton, said on Twitter on Thursday, adding: "Growing evidence suggests children are less susceptible to infection, have milder infection, and are infrequently responsible for household transmission."

The Royal College of Pediatrics also corrected the record, tweeting that "a number of media reports, citing RCPCH, have incorrectly suggested that children cannot transmit COVID-19. This is not the the RCPCH position, nor is it based on evidence."

The confusion stemmed, in part, from a reference in the review to a study by the China/WHO joint commission. People interviewed by members of the commission could not recall a single episode where a child transmitted the disease to an adult.

So more confusion thanks to the WHO (masks, reinfections). Right now it seems that children can pass it on but its rare.

 

[groovejuice]

Ha ha ha

I needed the laugh



Sorry, not sure if anyone can tell, but I'm very cynical when it comes to modern journalism.

Journalism has always been polarized. Editorial policies and biases inevitably make their way into news stories.

That doesn't necessarily mean it's all garbage. But readers add their own biases while reading - and people hate to have those biases contradicted.

May the 4th be with you all!