Confirmed Signing with Link: [CAR] Jesperi Kotkaniemi signs offersheet with the Hurricanes (1 year, $6.100035M) [Part IV]

[Guttersniped]

I don't think it matters cause whoever has KK come Saturday, can't trade him anyways. Habs won't be allowed and good luck to the Canes if they are allowed. Nobody going to give value for a under performing player making $6.1M at age 21.

Yeah, I agree specifically about Kotkaniemi , it was more about the actual rules in the CBA.

 

[Stickpucker]

no ones knows this, certainly not you or me. No comments where said by KK and that is it.

Well....he was seething to get benched in po. What competitive player takes that slap in face especially after extending Toronto series?

Then in Carolina he can play with better forwards and pad his numbers, not have to speak French or deal with media scapegoat, and play with countryman.

Put yourself in his shoes and you can surmise what he wants at minimum.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Yeah, I agree specifically about Kotkaniemi , it was more about the actual rules in the CBA.

I'm curious as well on that question

 

[Price is Wright]

Well, speaking as a fan of the Canes, I think we do need a good future 2c as that is missing in our prospect pool. Yes, we do have Trocheck currently at that spot, but he's UFA after this year and unless he REALY wants to be a Cane, I suspect he will price himself out above what our management values him/that position at; just like Dougie priced himself out of the 2/3 D position management saw him at.

Also correct me if I'm wrong but it isn't is common for the Hurricanes to be deep at centre?

Mid 2000s they had Staal/Rod the bod/Matt Cullen (who was underrated), early 2010s you tried to develop Sutter behind Staal and Ruutu, and then traded for Jordan Staal. At one point it was Staal/Rask/Lindholm and now it's Aho/Trocheck/Staal. Staal might stick around in the bottom six but they probably want to develop a guy to fill what role he had. And like you said, Trocheck might price himself out. Aho/Kotkaniemi with an eye on how Geekie develops sounds like how Carolina wants to build this, with hopefully Jordan sticking around as a veteran C.

 

[Penaltykiller17]

How dare you say there's a possible risk for the Canes, it's supposed to be a win all around

I really don't understand this twisted logic that if the Habs match and KK doesn't deliver this season we're screwed, but if the same happens with Carolina while giving up a 1st+3rd it's a win lol

Nobody's saying there isn't a risk for Carolina, we're just saying the risk is low. Carolina will not be reliant on KK to put up big numbers or live up to being the #3 pick, and our season will not live or die on his production.

 

[Canadienna]

Well....he was seething to get benched in po. What competitive player takes that slap in face especially after extending Toronto series?

Then in Carolina he can play with better forwards and pad his numbers, not have to speak French or deal with media scapegoat, and play with countryman.

Put yourself in his shoes and you can surmise what he wants at minimum.

Seething? Really?

 

[Not The One]

Well....he was seething to get benched in po. What competitive player takes that slap in face especially after extending Toronto series?

Then in Carolina he can play with better forwards and pad his numbers, not have to speak French or deal with media scapegoat, and play with countryman.

Put yourself in his shoes and you can surmise what he wants at minimum.

Someone who isn't performing. Getting 1 goal and 0 assists in his last 11 playoff games is not helping his team, especially with the kind of deployment and ice time he got. A veteran like Tatar was benched the last 17 games of this run and I don't hear nearly as much whining about this as for KK.

And are we acting like no team has ever sat out a young player in the playoffs ever? At 21 he has 29 career playoff games. For comparison this is more than anybody else in his draft class and more than some established players like Matt Duchene, Taylor Hall or even Connor McDavid.

 

[MinJaBen]

Also correct me if I'm wrong but it isn't is common for the Hurricanes to be deep at centre?

Mid 2000s they had Staal/Rod the bod/Matt Cullen (who was underrated), early 2010s you tried to develop Sutter behind Staal and Ruutu, and then traded for Jordan Staal. At one point it was Staal/Rask/Lindholm and now it's Aho/Trocheck/Staal. Staal might stick around in the bottom six but they probably want to develop a guy to fill what role he had. And like you said, Trocheck might price himself out. Aho/Kotkaniemi with an eye on how Geekie develops sounds like how Carolina wants to build this, with hopefully Jordan sticking around as a veteran C.

I don't know that I'd say it is common. When Aho started at the center position we had him as a rookie, Victor Rask, and Jordan Staal with Walmark as our 4th line center. Certainly Aho turned out pretty good, but at the time with him as an unknown, that was not what I'd call "strong down the middle".

 

[TS Quint]

This thread us great. All the Habs fans coming out to tell us how he was drafted too high, his failures, his parents bullying the team into putting him into the NHL too quickly. So brave now that he has a Canes logo next to his name on capfriendly.

Where did all the Habs posters go who insisted he is going to be a great 1C, he is only 21, he's a 3rd overall pick for God's sake! Are they hiding with all the Habs fans who insisted Domi is a 70 point player until he put that BJ jersey on?

Oh I know, it was just a loud minority of crazy Hab fans saying that. It wasn't you. But you didn't say anything at the time but now he signed that offer here comes the big balls.

 

[Stickpucker]

Someone who isn't performing. Getting 1 goal and 0 assists in his last 11 playoff games is not helping his team, especially with the kind of deployment and ice time he got. A veteran like Tatar was benched the last 17 games of this run and I don't hear nearly as much whining about this as for KK.

And are we acting like no team has ever sat out a young player in the playoffs ever? At 21 he has 29 career playoff games. For comparison this is more than anybody else in his draft class and more than some established players like Matt Duchene, Taylor Hall or even Connor McDavid.

You're looking at it from the teams perspective not JKs.....and there are quotes he was seething and played his last game for Habs.

 

[Stickpucker]

Also correct me if I'm wrong but it isn't is common for the Hurricanes to be deep at centre?

Mid 2000s they had Staal/Rod the bod/Matt Cullen (who was underrated), early 2010s you tried to develop Sutter behind Staal and Ruutu, and then traded for Jordan Staal. At one point it was Staal/Rask/Lindholm and now it's Aho/Trocheck/Staal. Staal might stick around in the bottom six but they probably want to develop a guy to fill what role he had. And like you said, Trocheck might price himself out. Aho/Kotkaniemi with an eye on how Geekie develops sounds like how Carolina wants to build this, with hopefully Jordan sticking around as a veteran C.

Mid 2000s yes...but Ruutu and Lindholm were wingers here and Staal and Staal with Rask were pretty much all we had for 2010s.

 

[Husqvarna]

Jesperi Kotkaniemi ... the new Teuvo Teräväinen.
And Carolina knows it for sure - even if Montreal is totally clueless.

Chicago was a no-go-zone for a young Teräväinen and the same goes for Kotkaniemi with Montreal.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Also correct me if I'm wrong but it isn't is common for the Hurricanes to be deep at centre?

Between Cullen leaving in 2010 and Trocheck's excellent 2020-21 campaign, the Hurricanes did not have an effective 2C. Jordan Staal was brought in to be that, but he flopped and has really been an elite matchup 3C than a true 2C. The next closest was ~40 games of Victor Rask playing with Jeff Skinner on one of his hot streaks.

In fact, the idea that Kotkaniemi might not work because the Hurricanes have too many centers is a foreign one, it's probably the first time since I started following this franchise seriously that this was a real problem.

 

[RationalExpectations]

I wonder what Canes fans would have said if we were trying to trade KK++ for Svechnikov or some other trade talk. Bet you your narrative on KK gets attacked even though I think you are not far off on that assessment.

KK's biggest flaws is he falls down a lot, is not great on face offs, and his skating is below average. When can he put all that together? Doubt that happens in one off season. But make no mistake, he has solid vision and skill. His shot is very good but takes a long time to release it cause his stick is like 12' long lol. But that stick reach gives him a little help for his lack of skating when defending.

every fan base wants to believe the best for their team. KK as a trade piece would be undervalued by the canes, overvalued by the Habs (on average), as an offersheet target the canes will focus on the potential rather than the value now.

 

[didimentionlarseller]

Jesperi Kotkaniemi ... the new Teuvo Teräväinen.
And Carolina knows it for sure - even if Montreal is totally clueless.

Chicago was a no-go-zone for a young Teräväinen and the same goes for Kotkaniemi with Montreal.

the Canes fans seem to want kotkaniemi to be anyone but who he actually is

 

[Runner77]

I doubt that's true.

You doubt KK’s relationship with the Habs is strained? What about the info that came out that he said he had played his last game as a Hab? What about the negotiations on a contract that went nowhere with Bergevin, opening the door to Carolina’s OS? Was that just a happenstance?

KK has been benched, seen his TOI dwindle, was played on the wing repeatedly, was demoted to lower lines, seen his assignments reduced and was taken out of playoff games. His negotiations on a new contract were at an impasse for a reason — he wants out.

 

[Habs Halifax]

every fan base wants to believe the best for their team. KK as a trade piece would be undervalued by the canes, overvalued by the Habs (on average), as an offersheet target the canes will focus on the potential rather than the value now.

Before the offer sheet: Habs shopping KK+ for center or PMD upgrades and his value is rag dolled on HF boards

After the offer sheet: KK's got potential and I have not seen one other fan base (not Habs or Canes) jump on the chance to make fun of the Canes for offer sheeting him with a "he is a bust" narrative.

 

[Deam78]

Begevin cares about his job not the teams long term.

His team is plagued with injuries after a sc run. If they tank this year Molson will send him to the guillotine.

He's going to do whatever he can to save his job....I don't know Montreal cap well enough to know what that means over next few weeks before season.

I can understand why you would say that since multiple GMs do so (they shouldn't), however it's a bit misinformed.

Bergevin has been on record multiple time saying he needs to keep the team's long term in mind and do the right move rather he'll still be there or not in the future. He might be lying, but his track record of not sacrificing key future pieces (never traded a 1st or key prospect for veteran help) suggest he isn't.

There's also multiple rumours/reports saying he won't extend past his last year of contract and would've retired if they would've won the cup. Based on that I don't think he would do "whatever he can to save his job" and I strongly believe he'll do what's good for the team long term.

 

[MeHateHe]

You all are suckers. Bergevin has it all sussed. He's going to match and then have Kotkaniemi be a healthy scratch all season. They'll call up half of Laval's roster at some point just to have enough skaters. The result will be a lottery pick where they can take Shane Wright. It's perfect I tells ya. Perfect.

 

[RationalExpectations]

Thank you for honesty.

I think this should be approach from bubble teams. Obviously Buffalo won't offer sheet with lotto picks but a team around 8-10 in conference should do this in off-season instead of pony up for rental at tdl.

I believe contending teams should use this means or non contenders to cap contrained teams : imagine somebody offered 2.5/3m for 1/2 seasons to Cal foote in TBL that would have been a pain for them. Not sure it is healthy way of doing business to pay youngsters like that but it is a cheap gamble.

 

[Runner77]

If Montreal likes the player, I think they will probably match and then extend him when they can.

If they don't like the player they probably let him go and take the compensation.

Offer sheets are just business. I doubt this has much to do with anything besides business.

Nothing anymore to do with liking the player — KK holds all the cards now and he can force a QO close to $6M year over year — which if he remains a Hab, he will avail himself of. As a Hab, he’d be a toxic asset.

 

[RationalExpectations]

Before the offer sheet: Habs shopping KK for center upgrades and his value is rag dolled on HF boards

After the offer sheet: KK's got potential and I have not seen one other fan base (not Habs or Canes) jump on the chance to make fun of the Canes for offer sheeting him with a "he is a bust" narrative.

Before o/s : fans trollings Habs fans disappointed with KK

After O/S : damn you can get a D + 3 3OA for what projects to be a 20-24 OA

 

[Habs Halifax]

You doubt KK’s relationship with the Habs is strained? What about the info that came out that he said he had played his last game as a Hab? What about the negotiations on a contract that went nowhere with Bergevin, opening the door to Carolina’s OS? Was that just a happenstance?

KK has been benched, seen his TOI dwindle, was played on the wing repeatedly, was demoted to lower lines, seen his assignments reduced and was taken out of playoff games. His negotiations on a new contract were at an impasse for a reason — he wants out.

I think you are speculating too much on the context you see. This is just the Habs playing hard ball on his bridge and the Canes offering him something he can't refuse. Is KK not happy with Ducharme? Maybe but he understand that he is young and we had vets we were riding. I don't think it's at the level you are presenting but it could be. It's all speculation one way or another.

What about this speculation? Drouin played his last game as a Habs and Bergevin wants out after his last year in term? Cause he said... "I have one year left and will honor it". I'm guessing you translate that to Bergevin not wanting to come back? I've seen others think that as well but I believe it's just Bergevin not revealing too much to the media when he is negotiating a contract extension and they decided to delay it

 

[CokenoPepsi]

If he doesn't improve though teams can just walk away from his QO and he UFA at 21

 

[GrandBison]

Before the offer sheet: Habs shopping KK+ for center or PMD upgrades and his value is rag dolled on HF boards

After the offer sheet: KK's got potential and I have not seen one other fan base (not Habs or Canes) jump on the chance to make fun of the Canes for offer sheeting him with a "he is a bust" narrative.

Just curious, outside Habs and Canes, which team would give an unprotected 1st and a 3rd for one year of KK at 6.1M?