Confirmed Signing with Link: [CAR] Canes match MTL Offer Sheet for Sebastian Aho (5 years, $8.454M AAV) - Pt.6 | Mod Note in OP

[Lempo]

"I think that Sebastian 100 percent wants to play in Montreal," Johannson told Marc Antoine Godin of The Athletic. "He wouldn't have signed an offer sheet if he didn't want to play in Montreal."

This is me when I BS. I stress that what I tell is my own personal understanding of the situation, and then I try to convince them with a carefully formulated example of a logical causality involved that supposedly led me to my understanding.

 

[bleedgreen]

And........ caused the best forward to sign with another team literally 3 hrs after he was allowed to. Which no other player has done in 6 years. And no player who has had finished their contract with that team in how long?

The agent has never done this before. He has point now but point hasn’t signed one? So it’s a good idea for aho but not point?

No other cane has signed an offer sheet. Has any other player who played for the GM signed an offer sheet?

I’m sure canes fans don’t want to believe it’s a problem. But it’s ridiculous to assume he signed with another team because he just couldn’t imagine without a contract with the canes so long that he had to sign with Montreal

What’s the problem? He’s ours for five years. I seriously could care less if you sign him to some mega contract for the rest of his career. We'll have always got the best years of his career.

If he secretly yearns to be a hab and hangs a flag in his bedroom I could give af. You’re getting paid, score some goals and don’t disappear for the last two months of the season again.

Even if the delirious dreams of Habs fans are true and he longs to be with you guys, what does that get you? An apology as he passes your bench post celly?

 

[Anton Babchuk]

can't wait until aho signs 8 years/100 milion with the habs five years from now and then does an andrew ladd/milan lucic

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

can't wait until aho signs 8 years/100 milion with the habs five years from now and then does an andrew ladd/milan lucic

So Canes are gonna trade him to MTL at some point? Because that’s the only way he can sign an 8 year deal with MTL. I do get the point that you’re making though

 

[Gaud]

Why say they’ll match and wait to match ? It doesn’t really slow the habs down from their future plans. Unless maybe they don’t match ?

Doesn't the offer prevent MB from doing futher moves?
Until this is resolved, i think the money and the picks are considered as being unusable. The Canes could just be waiting this long to make MB have to wait it out.

 

[Gaud]

Ok.. so at which point are teams allowed to talk to RFA players or their agents? I thought the player's rights belonged to their teams as long as they had a qualifying offer, and that prevented other teams from talking with them.

an offer sheet suggests that the one presenting it has an idea of what the player wanted. If that is the case, then the agent would have supplied the number that Aho was looking for and the Canes were refusing to give a the time.

 

[Lempo]

Doesn't the offer prevent MB from doing futher moves?
Until this is resolved, i think the money and the picks are considered as being unusable. The Canes could just be waiting this long to make MB have to wait it out.

Don't know about the money, but upon receiving l'offre hostile the targeted team is to contact the NHL Central Registry and request them to encumber the draft picks and place them in reserve.

I would guess the money won't have any cap implications at that point, because the SPC will be only finalized afterwards.

 

[Seanaconda]

Ok.. so at which point are teams allowed to talk to RFA players or their agents? I thought the player's rights belonged to their teams as long as they had a qualifying offer, and that prevented other teams from talking with them.

an offer sheet suggests that the one presenting it has an idea of what the player wanted. If that is the case, then the agent would have supplied the number that Aho was looking for and the Canes were refusing to give a the time.

A week before July 1st just like ufas I believe , well they arent supposed to talk numbers but it seems like they do with ufas being signed the second they are allowed but they are just supposed to talk about interest or something .

And then July 1st and after they are allowed to talk numbers.

The restricted part of rfa just means the teams can match or get compensation otherwise it's pretty much the same rules. If the team or player files for arbitration I believe that goes away but first year rfas don't qualify for arb.

And then also only for type 2 rfas which most are so I'll just ignore the 3/4 rfas that arent this year

 

[Lempo]

Ok.. so at which point are teams allowed to talk to RFA players or their agents? I thought the player's rights belonged to their teams as long as they had a qualifying offer, and that prevented other teams from talking with them.

an offer sheet suggests that the one presenting it has an idea of what the player wanted. If that is the case, then the agent would have supplied the number that Aho was looking for and the Canes were refusing to give a the time.

Later of June 26 or Tuesday after Entry Draft June 30:

Restricted Free Agents may make contact with Clubs (including their own) regarding potential interest, but may not sign new SPCs or Offer Sheets until the opening of RFA/UFA Signing Period


(technically only the holdouts from the now-ending season would actually be RFAs at this point, and they can't sign even with their own club until the new season begins on July 1, but this probably means also the pending RFAs)

 

[powerstuck]

Ok.. so at which point are teams allowed to talk to RFA players or their agents? I thought the player's rights belonged to their teams as long as they had a qualifying offer, and that prevented other teams from talking with them.

an offer sheet suggests that the one presenting it has an idea of what the player wanted. If that is the case, then the agent would have supplied the number that Aho was looking for and the Canes were refusing to give a the time.

The league allows a 1 week period, prior to July 1st for all RFA's to talk with all teams. But usually that doesn't give much leverage unless the RFA can score an interesting OS deal. Kinda like Aho did with Habs. He got everything he wanted.

 

[Legion34]

What’s the problem? He’s ours for five years. I seriously could care less if you sign him to some mega contract for the rest of his career. We'll have always got the best years of his career.

If he secretly yearns to be a hab and hangs a flag in his bedroom I could give af. You’re getting paid, score some goals and don’t disappear for the last two months of the season again.

Even if the delirious dreams of Habs fans are true and he longs to be with you guys, what does that get you? An apology as he passes your bench post celly?

I don’t care about Montreal..... I Just don’t be see how people think this won’t affect the relationship

The agent came out and said he wants rob play for another team. Acting like this is some secret plan to game the system is pretty ridiculous

 

[Chips]

I don’t care about Montreal..... I Just don’t be see how people think this won’t affect the relationship

The agent came out and said he wants rob play for another team. Acting like this is some secret plan to game the system is pretty ridiculous

The Habs certainly decided to an extent by themselves to not go too high $, but could have gone higher with the same compensation.

That begs the question, was MB really that scared, or would Aho only sign at 8.5, because he didn’t want to come off as a selfish dick to his team? Like “hey, I only asked for 5 , $9m from you in the first place; I’m committed to helping this team compete. I just didn’t want to play negotiation games.”

If it were that, it’d suggest that his relationship with the team is safe, he just wants more negotiation leverage sooner once he feels he’s earned it and the team is in an even better position to pay more people.

Habs and Canes will be fine with each other of course, it’s just business and it really wasn’t a serious threat.

 

[GoldiFox]

I don’t care about Montreal..... I Just don’t be see how people think this won’t affect the relationship

The agent came out and said he wants rob play for another team. Acting like this is some secret plan to game the system is pretty ridiculous

Canes owner Tom Dundon already said that was the agent speaking and he never heard those words out of Aho's mouth - which would be much different in regards to their relationship:

“It is in his right to use that leverage the (collective bargaining agreement) provides to get the most money from us and that’s all that happened. I have not heard Sebastian say that. If he said that it would be different but he didn’t. So the fact that an agent said it means that there’s no credibility to it.”

It appears as though the Canes management group is fine to pin this on a slippery agent who fooled a useful idiot into getting the deal they wanted. And as Dundon said regarding Aho's agent:

“I could care less about Sebastian’s agent and being complicated with him going forward,” Dundon said. “It doesn’t matter at all.”

 

[Frank Drebin]

can't wait until aho signs 8 years/100 milion with the habs five years from now and then does an andrew ladd/milan lucic

I suggest you hold your breath till then

 

[Legion34]

Canes owner Tom Dundon already said that was the agent speaking and he never heard those words out of Aho's mouth - which would be much different in regards to their relationship:


It appears as though the Canes management group is fine to pin this on a slippery agent who fooled a useful idiot into getting the deal they wanted. And as Dundon said regarding Aho's agent:

Or Aho told 2 different people 2 different things? The agent works for the player. He has multiple clients including point. Only 1 player signed so far.

 

[Lempo]

Don't know about the money, but upon receiving l'offre hostile the targeted team is to contact the NHL Central Registry and request them to encumber the draft picks and place them in reserve.

I would guess the money won't have any cap implications at that point, because the SPC will be only finalized afterwards.

Now see how I BS:

CBA 50.5 (d)(i)

(A) From July 1 until and including the last day of Training Camp of each League Year, "Averaged Club Salary" for each Club for that League Year shall be calculated as the sum of the Player Salary and Bonuses for that League Year for each and every Player, from the following categories:
-snip-

(4) Any amount offered in that League Year by the Club in a Qualifying Offer or in an Offer Sheet to a Restricted Free Agent from the date of such offer until the earliest of the following: (A) the Restricted Free Agent signs an SPC with the Club; (B) the Restricted Free Agent signs an SPC with another Club; or (C) the Qualifying Offer expires pursuant to Section 10.2 (for purposes of Two-Way Qualifying Offers, the NHL portion of the Qualifying Offer will be counted at a rate reflective of the Player's time on an NHL Roster (including days on Injured Reserve, Injured Non-Roster and Non-Roster status) the prior League Year so that, for example, a Player who spent forty-six (46) days on an NHL Roster (including days on Injured Reserve, Injured Non-Roster and Non-Roster status) in a 184-day regular season, and receives a Qualifying Offer for $525,000 (NHL) / $50,000 (AHL), the portion of his Qualifying Offer that will count for off-season accounting purposes will be 46/184 x $525,000 = $131,250); plus

It was on your cap, MTL! Bahahaha!!

 

[Lurk Muller]

Or Aho told 2 different people 2 different things? The agent works for the player. He has multiple clients including point. Only 1 player signed so far.

What exactly are you trying to convince people of in here?

Aho has said himself he used his only leverage to get the deal he wanted and didn't want to negotiate all summer over the term. Do you think Point putting a clock on TB to clear cap would be useful for him to get the deal he wants from his current team?

 

[Fainting Couch]

“I could care less about Sebastian’s agent and being complicated with him going forward,” Dundon said. “It doesn’t matter at all.”

Talk about sending a mixed message.

 

[Lurk Muller]

“I could care less about Sebastian’s agent and being complicated with him going forward,” Dundon said. “It doesn’t matter at all.”

Talk about sending a mixed message.

What's mixed about that? Dundon likes Seb. Dundon don't care about Gerry or the things he told MB.

 

[Fainting Couch]

What's mixed about that?

Not knowing the difference between could and couldn't.

 

[Roboturner913]

I'm sure a commonly-made mistake in a colloquialism is the exactly the same as what you're talking about, K.

 

[Legion34]

What exactly are you trying to convince people of in here?

Aho has said himself he used his only leverage to get the deal he wanted and didn't want to negotiate all summer over the term. Do you think Point putting a clock on TB to clear cap would be useful for him to get the deal he wants from his current team?

That the after the fact rationalization of a player who did not sign with Carolina but did sign with another team is ridiculous. People who believe it are being naive.

This agent said he wants to go to Montreal. He signed contract with Montreal.
The agent has not done this before.

The idea that this was some master plan is just foolish.

 

[General Fanager]

“I could care less about Sebastian’s agent and being complicated with him going forward,” Dundon said. “It doesn’t matter at all.”

Talk about sending a mixed message.

of course it doesnt matter. the deal is done and I suspect that the deal 5 year from now wont have anything to do with Dundon.

 

[Chips]

That the after the fact rationalization of a player who did not sign with Carolina but did sign with another team is ridiculous. People who believe it are being naive.

This agent said he wants to go to Montreal. He signed contract with Montreal.
The agent has not done this before.

The idea that this was some master plan is just foolish.

I thought I remember multiple people saying his agent has had other clients sign offersheets?

 

[spockBokk]

That the after the fact rationalization of a player who did not sign with Carolina but did sign with another team is ridiculous. People who believe it are being naive.

This agent said he wants to go to Montreal. He signed contract with Montreal.
The agent has not done this before.

The idea that this was some master plan is just foolish.

Except by using MTL, Aho got exactly what he wanted. So looks pretty likely to most observers that it was a “master plan” to get his deal done.

I can think of only 1 certain poster who is hanging on to a fantasy that Aho truly wanted to end up in MTL as looking foolish...