Prospect Info: Calgary Wranglers and Prospect Discussion Megathread

[Debrincat93]

Will Matty Philips ever get a legit chance?
or is he just that typical skilled kid who cant figure out the NHL?

 

[Backlund]

Will Matty Philips ever get a legit chance?
or is he just that typical skilled kid who cant figure out the NHL?

He's only played 1 NHL game so its hard to tell. Unlikely he gets in the lineup until there's an injury to a forward.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Will Matty Philips ever get a legit chance?
or is he just that typical skilled kid who cant figure out the NHL?

He would have to score 4 goals a game to get a period in the NHL in this backwardass organization.

 

[Kranix]

Will Matty Philips ever get a legit chance?
or is he just that typical skilled kid who cant figure out the NHL?

Depends on what you mean by legit chance. Do you mean 20 mins a night with Huberdeau to start the year, or just a pro contract with team personnel constantly evaluating him?
Apparently, he's not with the big club because of size, as if that was this organization's policy with skilled players.

 

[super6646]

Depends on what you mean by legit chance. Do you mean 20 mins a night with Huberdeau to start the year, or just a pro contract with team personnel constantly evaluating him?
Apparently, he's not with the big club because of size, as if that was this organization's policy with skilled players.

Lol

 

[Kranix]

Lol

Keep parroting 5'7"

 

[super6646]

Keep parroting 5'7"

13 pts in 9 games, but he only has 5 assists. Guess he needs another 20 years to marinate in the ahl till he gets that up a bit.

 

[Kranix]

13 pts in 9 games, but he only has 5 assists. Guess he needs another 20 years to marinate in the ahl till he gets that up a bit.

He should study TJ Tynan's game tapes on how to make passes. Another victim of the anti-small conspiracy.

 

[Debrincat93]

Depends on what you mean by legit chance. Do you mean 20 mins a night with Huberdeau to start the year, or just a pro contract with team personnel constantly evaluating him?
Apparently, he's not with the big club because of size, as if that was this organization's policy with skilled players.

something like middle six minutes, 12-15 mins? or just an every day chance.
i see his numbers every year in the AHL and wonder whats the hold up, as an outsider.

 

[Mazatt]

something like middle six minutes, 12-15 mins? or just an every day chance.
i see his numbers every year in the AHL and wonder whats the hold up, as an outsider.

That's not something any Flames fan can tell you, and as you see here, just gets into the appeal to authority vs. raw numbers debate that follows an AHL prospect.

Basically you'll hear a range from "the guy has 1 NHL game, clearly he isn't good enough" to "who cares about size, he'd be a star in the NHL" and all of the more reasonable in between, but there's no real consensus. Basically it boils down to in some way there's an assumption something about Phillips isn't liked by the organization either systemically or individually, or he simply hasn't "earned it".

Systemically, the Flames have not graduated any picks from 2018 onwards into a full time role, and the players that have been introduced to the team recently have felt out of chance instead of out of pre-planning (Kylington was waiver fodder without getting a real shot until Sutter came in, Mangiapane was forced to come up the 4th line way while Dube got right into a middle six role) so there's some consideration that the Flames view Phillips as injury insurance for the top 9--notably not if someone in the top 6 like Lucic sucks, and for the bottom 6 players like Byron Froese get the recall instead--and the Flames have simply never been hurt/don't sit guys for minor injuries so he's toiled for that reason.

The individual theory is that due to Phillip's height he is unfairly being discriminated and isn't getting a fair shake from the coaching staff. This is a weird one to me since this is the organization famous for pushing a late round pick in Gaudreau through their system and profiting off of his role as a star, and even now a smaller player like Mangiapane is a top 6 forward on the team. But that's why you see a lot of "you can't teach size" when talking about Phillips sarcastically, because there's a thought process out there that the only thing he doesn't have that worse players do have is height and weight.

The final idea is the appeal to authority wherein despite the AHL numbers/production, praise of AHL coaching staff, and his success in limited preseason action, that the Flames just simply see something the rest of us don't and understand he isn't capable in the NHL without so much as a test run.

Who knows which one it really is--the Flames ARE pretty youth averse in recent years. But Flames fans can't give you a straight answer and for the most part, there really isn't a good reason for Phillips not to get a test run alongside top 6/9 players in place of Lucic or Lewis to at least see if his outstanding AHL production even partially extends to the NHL.

 

[Kahvi]

Funny stat: Flames have 4 players left on the team from first 3 rounds of drafts from 2008 to 2018. First round picks traded or waived include Bennett, Tkachuk, Monahan, Välimäki, and then there's a whole bunch of busts.

If I have nothing better to do next week I'm gonna play around a bit with Power BI and all first round picks for all teams from 2000 to 2022.

 

[Elvis P]

What Matthew Phillips' NHL Future Looks Like

Matthew Phillips leads the AHL in goals this season but hasn't been called up to the Calgary Flames. What are the pros and cons of his game?

thehockeynews.com

 

[Yepthatsme]

For all the hype Phillips has been getting, I don’t know how translatable his current hot streak is to the NHL. The man’s shot production has actually gone down from last season, he is just shooting an insane 33% to start the season. He also is completely relying on power play production, something he would either get a lot less of on our team or wouldn’t sniff it at all. He actually doesn’t have an assist in the season not on the PP yet, and half his goals are PP markers.

Quite frankly, he’s been cooling off as well while Pelletier and Zary have been heating up, think I’d rather our younger prospects get a chance anyways.

What Matthew Phillips' NHL Future Looks Like

Matthew Phillips leads the AHL in goals this season but hasn't been called up to the Calgary Flames. What are the pros and cons of his game?

thehockeynews.com

This video makes a lot of points I’ve been saying. Phillips style of players will never be used in a bottom 6 because almost no NHL coach (especially not Sutter) wants a bottom 6 that trades chances. Like it or not as well, but adding a player that’s even smaller than Gaudreau changes the make up of how a line has to play as well. Makes sense why the organization is hesitant about that.

 

[Yepthatsme]

So this Cole Schwindt guy can shoot a puck.

 

[DFF]

I really don’t know why Phillips keep coming back to the Flames. He has no chance here

The rest of the league probably doesn’t care much about him also

 

[Kahvi]

I really don’t know why Phillips keep coming back to the Flames. He has no chance here

Still RFA after his current contract, so he really has no other options.

 

[Ace Rimmer]

Still RFA after his current contract, so he really has no other options.

European league most likely. I think that would have been a really smart option after last season's camp TBH. Go the Mark Giordano route.

How good he *actually* is would determine which league.

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

European league most likely. I think that would have been a really smart option after last season's camp TBH. Go the Mark Giordano route.

How good he *actually* is would determine which league.

He should play for the Eliteserien. Imagine if he goes to the Stavanger Oilers lmao.

 

[Volica]

Kind of wild to see this Wranglers team be not bad.
Only really 2 guys in their top 10 in scoring are AHL career guys, and no one in the top 3 scoring.

Nice to see!

 

[Mazatt]

Not entirely sure what they're doing with Kerins right now. What's the point of drafting a guy late, having him hit all conceivable bench marks, and then playing him in the ECHL? He should be a prime candidate of a guy getting put into spots to succeed to see if there's a potential expedited path to the NHL as a late pick--those chances should specifically come at the best level. Sure having him tear up the ECHL is fun but it seems like it'd be better for him to be in the AHL playing at a higher level. Just doesn't make sense

 

[JPeeper]

Not entirely sure what they're doing with Kerins right now. What's the point of drafting a guy late, having him hit all conceivable bench marks, and then playing him in the ECHL? He should be a prime candidate of a guy getting put into spots to succeed to see if there's a potential expedited path to the NHL as a late pick--those chances should specifically come at the best level. Sure having him tear up the ECHL is fun but it seems like it'd be better for him to be in the AHL playing at a higher level. Just doesn't make sense

Are you familiar with the Detroit Red Wings?

There is nothing wrong with letting prospects marinate in the lower leagues and tear it up. It makes perfect sense. Instead of getting buried on the depth chart on the Wranglers he gets good ice-time in the ECHL, which literally happened to Zary last year (being buried on the depth chart). Kerins is currently over a PPG so he's doing well there which is all you can ask, he's literally in a perfect place to succeed.

 

[Kahvi]

Is Jack Beck injured again? he's putting up solid numbers but seems to be injured half the time every season

 

[Mazatt]

Are you familiar with the Detroit Red Wings?

There is nothing wrong with letting prospects marinate in the lower leagues and tear it up. It makes perfect sense. Instead of getting buried on the depth chart on the Wranglers he gets good ice-time in the ECHL, which literally happened to Zary last year (being buried on the depth chart). Kerins is currently over a PPG so he's doing well there which is all you can ask, he's literally in a perfect place to succeed.

I'm not sure that's the right way to look at it when it's not a foregone conclusion that Kerins would need to be buried in the lineup.

There's no harm in having players start out in lower leagues and work their way up--they won't lose skill doing it that way--but the reference to the Red Wings doesn't hit for me. A lot of the current teams who successfully graduate prospects, like the Canes and Stars, do so by promoting their scoring youth through the system to get them to the highest level at the highest role as tests, and can fast track players like Wyatt Johnston to the NHL that way.

If Kerins is an NHLer I have no doubt he will eventually work his way up to being on a roster, and being successful there, but why take the angle of eventually seeing that when he waits a season out in the ECHL, then gets a rookie season in the AHL, then has to take another season in a higher AHL role, before finally being considered for a full-time roster spot.

There isn't really anything saying that Kerins can't be in the top 6 instead of Jones/McLain or what not, or that he needs to start on the 4th line as an AHL rookie. The Red Wings strategy referenced logically only works if there is a dearth of near NHL ready prospects acting as stop-gaps that block AHL placement. The Flames aren't really even looking at their AHL team for depth right now. Find out right now if Kerins is further along than Pospisil/Petterson/Klapka, and potentially have a guy pushing for the roster instead of following a "typical" late round NHL pick timeline.

 

[FLAMESFAN]

Is Kerins back in ECHL? I know the Wranglers called him up last week for a couple games, but then he was scratched. Was hoping to see if he was still there tonight.
I look at him like Emilio Petterson right now, offensive but maybe a little soft. He's got work to do for sure.

 

[Bounces R Way]

Wranglers wrecking Edmonton's farm team 4-0 halfway through the game.

2pts each for Phillips and Pelletier. Poirier and Zary also scored on the PP which is 3/4. Zary's goal came on a PP he drew after a dirty hit, like to see him stick it to em. PK is 4/4
Broberg sucks.