Speculation: Armchair GM Thread: the madness continues

[Calculon]

Gaudreau-Monahan-Ferland
Tkachuk-Backlund-Frolik
Lazar-Bennett-Iginla
Versteeg-Stajan-Brouwer
Hamilton/Hathaway

No room for Jankowski/Foo but if they had wanted to play in the NHL next year that badly they shouldn't have signed with the Flames.

The following year when Stajan, Versteeg and Iginla are gone is when there'll be some real opportunity.

 

[Lunatik]

My concern with bringing Iginla in, is who gets benched as a result?

Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Versteeg - Bennett - Brouwer
Stajan - Jankowski - Lazar
Hamilton

These are the more likely of the 13 who'd have been on the roster come October. Would signing Iggy mean Hamilton gets demoted, or would Jankowski get another year in the AHL?

Jankowski will likely be the first call-up, but there would still be room for one of Hathaway, Hrivik or Gazdic too. My guess is Gazdic as he is LW.

I suspect the lines will have most Flames fans whining.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Versteeg - Bennett - Brouwer
Lazar - Stajan - Iginla
Hamilton/Gazdic

 

[1989]

I'm curious how everyone here feels about Calgary's current fourth line.

I feel that this team is generally solid on paper up and down the entire roster. While it's generally accepted that the Flames still have a couple holes to plug in the form of uncertain goaltending and a top-6 right wing, I feel that an underrated point of concern may be the fourth line.

It's by no means the worst in the league, yet I feel like with a real focus on having a strong, quick bottom three might be what pushes this team into perennial contender, as opposed to a star winger or goaltender. Due to our defensive structures (both player and systems) we technically shouldn't need another Kiprusoff-esque goaltender, and seeing how the defence should be incredibly mobile, offence is also a team concept. A strong fourth line combination would play well with the rest of the team makeup if they were able to pressure and create a quick cycle of their own while playing within the system as a unit vs a single player performance. I'm not saying we lack a good fourth line - but having a great one might make all the difference.

What are your thoughts?

 

[Lunatik]

I'm curious how everyone here feels about Calgary's current fourth line.

I feel that this team is generally solid on paper up and down the entire roster. While it's generally accepted that the Flames still have a couple holes to plug in the form of uncertain goaltending and a top-6 right wing, I feel that an underrated point of concern may be the fourth line.

It's by no means the worst in the league, yet I feel like with a real focus on having a strong, quick bottom three might be what pushes this team into perennial contender, as opposed to a star winger or goaltender. Due to our defensive structures (both player and systems) we technically shouldn't need another Kiprusoff-esque goaltender, and seeing how the defence should be incredibly mobile, offence is also a team concept. A strong fourth line combination would play well with the rest of the team makeup if they were able to pressure and create a quick cycle of their own while playing within the system as a unit vs a single player performance. I'm not saying we lack a good fourth line - but having a great one might make all the difference.

What are your thoughts?

If we have a 4th line that includes Stajan, Brouwer and Lazar as many are predicting, we will have one of the best 4th lines in the league

 

[1989]

If we have a 4th line that includes Stajan, Brouwer and Lazar as many are predicting, we will have one of the best 4th lines in the league

How do you figure? Stajan is reliable but Brouwer and Stajan aren't exactly going to overwhelm the opponent in puck retrieval races or board battles as often as you'd think compared to "elite fourth lines" in order to actually being a cycle themselves. I believe Lazar is still a question mark albeit one with potential.

 

[Lunatik]

How do you figure? Stajan is reliable but Brouwer and Stajan aren't exactly going to overwhelm the opponent in puck retrieval races or board battles as often as you'd think compared to "elite fourth lines" in order to actually being a cycle themselves. I believe Lazar is still a question mark albeit one with potential.

how do I figure? I think Brouwer is still a 3rd liner who was playing hurt. I think Stajan is better than almost any 4C in the NHL and Lazar should be a constant motor. They might not be the fastest but they're basically a 3rd line shutdown line

 

[FerklundCGY]

how do I figure? I think Brouwer is still a 3rd liner who was playing hurt. I think Stajan is better than almost any 4C in the NHL and Lazar should be a constant motor. They might not be the fastest but they're basically a 3rd line shutdown line

I don't think they'll end up as the 4th line but if they do, I wouldn't be mad. However, calling them a "shutdown" line is hilarious.

Stajan is pretty good defensively, Brouwer is horse****, and we don't know what we have in Lazar yet

 

[Lunatik]

Nevermind

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

People have to realize PKing alone doesn't mean good defensively. Although MM thinks Brouwer is better defensively than a lot of forwards that outplay Brouwer on the PK and significantly outplay Brouwer 5 on 5 defensively.

 

[DFF]

If we have a 4th line that includes Stajan, Brouwer and Lazar as many are predicting, we will have one of the best 4th lines in the league

I think you meant the most expensive

 

[ColdSteel2]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2371101

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Uh?, thanks I suppose?

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Yeah our bottom 6 is pretty abysmal. Compare it to teams like Washington or Minnesota, who can actually score, and we are vastly inferior.

 

[Volica]

Yeah our bottom 6 is pretty abysmal. Compare it to teams like Washington or Minnesota, who can actually score, and we are vastly inferior.

Yeah, you need Bennett to develop into a 40-55 point player and fast. Having that on your third line would make Calgary legitimate. The way teams are structured these days is more or less; fill up down the middle, stack as much chemistry on the top two lines and then have your 3C/4C be able to carry your bottom 6 as most guys nowadays will be on ELC's/Mins.

I like Stajan (it's taken me like 5 years to say that) and I think he's a good 4th liner who can actually take a fairly tough shift and not be completely SOL... Although he is a fringe 3C making an elite 3C's money

I really think that bottom 6 hinges on getting internal growth from Bennett or one of the Rooks to perform at their projected or highest level. If we could get:

Johnny (85 points) - Monahan (65 points) - Ferland (35-40 points)
Tkachuk (60 points) - Backlund (55 points) - Frolik (40 points)
Versteeg (40 points) - Bennett (55 points) - Lazar (35 points)
X (17 points) - Stajan (20 points) - Brouwer (30 points)

Giordano (40 points) - Hamilton (50 points)
Brodie (30 points) - Hamonic (30 points)
Kulak (10 points) - Stone (20 points)

This team would be poised to make a run. I really don't think that those numbers are really 'wow, year right' for anyone. You could see a world where they could hit those figures.

 

[Sparky93]

Our bottom 6 isn't the problem, the problem is we lack top 6 complementary wingers, forcing bottom 6 guys into the role. A little shuffling, to spread the talent and one player and all of the sudden, it looks pretty solid

Gaudreau(70)-Monahan(65)-Lazar(35)
Frolik(40)-Backlund(45)-Brouwer(35)
Tkachuk(45)-Bennett(40)-Iginla(35)
Ferland(25)-Stajan(20)-Versteeg(30)

I really don't see much of a difference between Ferland and Lazar, they should be interchangeable, going the dirty work in the corners, playing physical and going to the front of the net. Ideally, we upgrade the 1RW and don't need Iggy.

 

[Flames Fanatic]

Yeah, you need Bennett to develop into a 40-55 point player and fast. Having that on your third line would make Calgary legitimate. The way teams are structured these days is more or less; fill up down the middle, stack as much chemistry on the top two lines and then have your 3C/4C be able to carry your bottom 6 as most guys nowadays will be on ELC's/Mins.

I like Stajan (it's taken me like 5 years to say that) and I think he's a good 4th liner who can actually take a fairly tough shift and not be completely SOL... Although he is a fringe 3C making an elite 3C's money

I really think that bottom 6 hinges on getting internal growth from Bennett or one of the Rooks to perform at their projected or highest level. If we could get:

Johnny (85 points) - Monahan (65 points) - Ferland (35-40 points)
Tkachuk (60 points) - Backlund (55 points) - Frolik (40 points)
Versteeg (40 points) - Bennett (55 points) - Lazar (35 points)
X (17 points) - Stajan (20 points) - Brouwer (30 points)

Giordano (40 points) - Hamilton (50 points)
Brodie (30 points) - Hamonic (30 points)
Kulak (10 points) - Stone (20 points)

This team would be poised to make a run. I really don't think that those numbers are really 'wow, year right' for anyone. You could see a world where they could hit those figures.

You have 5 forwards achieving noticeable new career highs (Gaudreau, Ferland, Tkachuk, Benett, Lazar), several guys within a few points of their career best season, bounce back seasons for a few and not a single forward taking a step back taking a step back. While you argue that not any single one of those is a "wow" or out of the norm, I think the likelihood of all of them happening at the same is incredibly unlikely. Especially when you factor in injuries.

Bennett going from a 26 points forward to 20 points higher than his career high is a wow year as well.

 

[Rangediddy]

Iggy's my hero, I'd be so happy seeing him finish his career here.

If we can sign him for 1 year @ $2m or less, he's still capable of being top 5 goal scorers on the team. That's just good value.

Plus... maybe we'll finally see that Iginla-Phaneuf fight!

 

[Sparky93]

Gaudreau-Monahan-Ferland
Frolik-Backlund-Brouwer
Tkachuk-Bennett-Foo
Versteeg-Stajan-Lazar

I think Foo will get at least a few games. Everyone seems to rave about Backlund's work with Colborne and Bouma, we need Brouwer to be better, it makes sense. Plus, having are 2 best defensive forwards with him would go a long way.

 

[1989]

With regards to the Iginla rumours:

Not that they are not legitimate (I believe they're pretty on-point) but I wonder if the prolonged delay isn't due in part to other rumours Treliving has been involved in. The Flames have been rumoured to be in on Jagr and possibly Duchene as well.

If I had a say, I'd like to see the following acquisitions in order of preference:

Jagr, Vanek, Iginla, Duchene

Jagr still has it. Yes he's slow but he's incredibly skilled and strong and Calgary has the defence in place to cover for his lack of back-checking ability. 2 years, 4m per.

Vanek is a right-shot dual winger. Stylistically he's a fit on any of Calgary's top-9. 2 years, 3.5m per.

Iginla: purely a PP winger with limited spot duty on the bottom 6 as needed. Intangibles. 1 year, 3 million.

Duchene. Youngest of the group, can still play and slot in on the top 6 easily. Costs the most to acquire, high risk potentially high reward. Sakic's asks have been unrealistic however. Duchene's contract ends in 2 seasons, so he may even become trade deadline bait in 2018-2019 if Calgary were to acquire him during this off-season should the experiment fail.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Sig, for argument sake. Who do we move for Duchene and how do we fit in all 4 of those guys under the cap?

 

[1989]

Sig, for argument sake. Who do we move for Duchene and how do we fit in all 4 of those guys under the cap?

… what? Where did I say Calgary would try to acquire all four?

I posted in the Duchene thread that Calgary is obviously trying to enter their "perennial playoff contender" mode, therefore no significant roster assets should be expected as a return.

The maximum I could see Calgary trading away is Bennett + Kylington/Andersson and depending on who you ask, that could be considered far too rich a price. I believe an NHL-quality roster player would have to be moved to accommodate this trade.

 

[CraigsList]

Bringing Iggy back would be amazing. I still don't think he is done yet. I think if you gave him some PP time and a little time with Gaudreau and Monahan (like for a period or so), the guy would light it up. I know he isn't as good as he used to be, but I am pretty sure he still thinks he has a lot in the tank and a lot to prove, especially after being on a horrific team like Colorado. I still don't expect nothing more than 3rd/4th line duty. Even at an old age he's a better player than Brouwer in my opinion.

 

[Skobel24]

Yeah, you need Bennett to develop into a 40-55 point player and fast. Having that on your third line would make Calgary legitimate. The way teams are structured these days is more or less; fill up down the middle, stack as much chemistry on the top two lines and then have your 3C/4C be able to carry your bottom 6 as most guys nowadays will be on ELC's/Mins.

I like Stajan (it's taken me like 5 years to say that) and I think he's a good 4th liner who can actually take a fairly tough shift and not be completely SOL... Although he is a fringe 3C making an elite 3C's money

I really think that bottom 6 hinges on getting internal growth from Bennett or one of the Rooks to perform at their projected or highest level. If we could get:

Johnny (85 points) - Monahan (65 points) - Ferland (35-40 points)
Tkachuk (60 points) - Backlund (55 points) - Frolik (40 points)
Versteeg (40 points) - Bennett (55 points) - Lazar (35 points)
X (17 points) - Stajan (20 points) - Brouwer (30 points)

Giordano (40 points) - Hamilton (50 points)
Brodie (30 points) - Hamonic (30 points)
Kulak (10 points) - Stone (20 points)

This team would be poised to make a run. I really don't think that those numbers are really 'wow, year right' for anyone. You could see a world where they could hit those figures.

I don't know. Assuming every goal the Flames score comes with 2 assists, that puts this lineup at about 250 goals. I can't see Bennett getting 55 unless he seems more ice time or more powerplay time, and that would result in another line taking a hit.

Johnny (70 points) - Monahan (65 points) - Ferland (35 points)
Tkachuk (50 points) - Backlund (55 points) - Frolik (40 points)
Versteeg (35 points) - Bennett (40 points) - Lazar (30 points)
X - Stajan (25 points) - Brouwer (35 points)

Giordano (60 points) - Hamilton (50 points)
Brodie (40 points) - Hamonic (25 points)
Kulak (10 points) - Stone (15 points)

 

[Sparky93]

… what? Where did I say Calgary would try to acquire all four?

I posted in the Duchene thread that Calgary is obviously trying to enter their "perennial playoff contender" mode, therefore no significant roster assets should be expected as a return.

The maximum I could see Calgary trading away is Bennett + Kylington/Andersson and depending on who you ask, that could be considered far too rich a price. I believe an NHL-quality roster player would have to be moved to accommodate this trade.

The only thing that makes sense for Duchene, as far as positioning and cap wise, is Backlund +. The only way it makes any sense for us, is if management feels they won't be able to come to term with Backlund, because we simply can't afford both beyond this year.

Basically the same structure as the Hamilton and Hamonic deals, only a little less, based on performance/contract.
Assuming Backs won't stay in Colorado...Backlund(late 1st + at the deadline) + Kylington(2nd) for Duchene

 

[Goulet17]

The only thing that makes sense for Duchene, as far as positioning and cap wise, is Backlund +. The only way it makes any sense for us, is if management feels they won't be able to come to term with Backlund, because we simply can't afford both beyond this year.

Basically the same structure as the Hamilton and Hamonic deals, only a little less, based on performance/contract.
Assuming Backs won't stay in Colorado...Backlund(late 1st + at the deadline) + Kylington(2nd) for Duchene

Why would Colorado trade Duchene for Backlund and Kylington? It just makes no sense for them.