Speculation: Acq/ Rost. Bldg./ Cap Part XXVI

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hb12xchamps

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I really like Neuvirth as he's been one of my favorite players to watch when he came through Hershey with the success he had, but I think he's better off moving on. I think he's struggled a lot the past two seasons and needs that change of scenery to benefit him and possibly turn his career around. I do think he has the skills to be a #1 if he can get through that mental aspect of the game.
 

Ridley Simon

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You seem to think a line in hockey is just the sum of its parts. That's not the case. Chemistry, playing style, tactics, all those things can either make a line better than the sum of its parts or worse. For example, neither Chimera nor Ward have particularly good offensive skills, yet together they generate a lot more offense than you'd expect from two stone hands pluggers. If you go back a couple years Hartnell-Briere-Leino was arguably the most effective line in the 2010 playoffs. Who on that line even knows what defense is? They should have been lit up, yet they actually dominated the competition. Semin is a much better player than Knuble yet Knuble was a better fit opposite Ovechkin and Backstrom than Semin.

Ovechkin-Johansson-Erat would have different dynamics from Johansson-Backstrom-Ovechkin. Mojo's defensive play would improve simply because he's better defensively at C. He wouldn't be a Selke player but it's no secret that his defensive play at C is better than at W, since he gets to use his speed more and his positioning is better. This line would also have 3 players capable of creating offense at a high speed, and having 3 players capable of playing at a high speed can patch up quite a few holes. Ovechkin would backcheck more (at least he should be asked), which he has shown to be capable of if the system requires it. Johansson can be better at carrying the puck through the neutral zone than along the wing where he always gets pinned along the boards and muscled off of it. You'd get more of a contribution from all 3 players and could have Ovechkin be more involved in the play, which right now he's not (and that's by Oates' design). Tell me, which one of Chimera, Grabovski or Ward is anywhere as good as Backstrom or Ovechkin? Which one of them is as good defensively (in a vacuum) as Backstrom? Yet amazingly enough they're a LOT better at even strength than a line with 2 far superior players and Johansson who himself is top 6 material.

Erat has had a few bad turnovers, yes, but career wise he's been a very good two way player. It's stupid to let the last couple of games dictate who he is rather than his whole body of work. If Ovechkin goes a couple games without scoring do we ****can him? And until his trade request is reflected by his play on the ice it shouldn't matter. He may be going through a rough patch (as players are sometimes known to do) but he's clearly not dogging it in any way. And he requested a trade because Oates kept ******** on him and putting him in a position to fail, if he starts to get a good opportunity to play the trade request evaporates.

Last, but not least, this also frees up Backstrom to be the man on his line, he can play at his own pace and march to his own drum without constantly having to play to Ovechkin's style. That makes the team harder to play against and in turn softens the minutes for Ovechkin's line. Backstrom can do whatever he wants without looking to force feed Ovie every five seconds. Likewise, Ovechkin can run around hitting people, deking, carrying the puck, rather than hovering around looking to get a pass from Backstrom. You have both of them contributing more because neither of them has to conform to the other and can take on more responsibilites. And fundamentally they're not the best fit for each other. Yes, Ovechkin can shoot at a high level and Backstrom can make plays at a high level, but together Backstrom has been reduced to a pure playmaker and Ovechkin has been reduced to a pure shooter, and both of them are much more than that. Backstrom can shoot more, Ovechkin can make plays at a high level himself, and carry the puck, etc. Ovechkin also excels in a high speed north-south game whereas Backstrom is as east-west as they come. They're not like the Sedins or Stamkos and St. Louis or Getzlaf and Perry where they were tailor made to play with each other.

Very quickly. I've long wanted to make 19 the focal point of his own line. Now that he is "back" from the Bourque elbow, it's time.

He and 8 will always play on the PP together. Split them up ES. Can't hurt.

I agree with your lines. One Laich comes back, it gets a tad crowded. Maybe start him on 4th w Patti and Wils, while also playing PK
 

txpd

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many caps playoff seasons backstrom has been moved away from ovechkin. the most successful of those times was when fedorov was available to center ovechkin and semin available to finish for backstrom.

the only problem I see with backstrom away from 8 right now is who is the finisher to play the semin role? do you think backstrom can create a kunitz with fehr or ward or laich or chimera or tom Wilson? oops...forgot brouwer.

I don't think that's going to work, but its probably worth a try particularly in a game with a bad start going on.

in support of halpy's view however, I will add that a string of games with 19 away from ovechkin also creates what boudreau had with semin. that is the opportunity to whenever a goal is needed to throw the big line back together and run them out there every other shift for the last 10 minutes of a game the way bb did with semin backstrom and ovechkin.
 

Halpysback*

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Backstrom doesn't need a great finisher to be effective IMO. For one, he himself can shoot a lot more. And if Grabo can elevate Chimera and Ward and have that line put up that kind of even strength performance, Backstrom elevating Fehr and Brouwer (who are arguably more talented, at least at shooting the puck) isn't at all out of the question. Fehr and Brouwer aren't world beaters but having them both be ~20-25 goal players and Backstrom be a ~25-30 goal player himself should be doable.
 

RandyHolt

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Great posts Halpy

Oates's entire team is flawed in that he cannot create an ES top line. Stop right there, and address that as priority one. He has so many options, yet is stuck stick blades on boards, Ovi & Nick, MJ at wing, etc. For being a brilliant offensive mind, he sure takes a very static approach.

Everyone knows I wanted to see Ovi tried at RW when his LW rush move got solved. But i wanted him to be used at LW as well, go back and forth. Why not both, consistency? I think Oates hasn't figured out consistency means its easy for teams to defend us.

Erat is in the mix as a complimentary move to be made at the same time Ovi gets time at LW. Using 2 guys at their natural position? Oatesies mind is blown at such a simple thought and scoffs at the idea. Book it. Look no further than that to see our struggles in the top 6 at ES. He has 10000 options to try, some very logical, yet limits himself to ~ 10.

Ovi has never been less dynamic at ES and a big part of it is pairing him with Nick. Erat can't score.

Hockey is only rocket science if you make it so.
 
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txpd

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Backstrom doesn't need a great finisher to be effective IMO. For one, he himself can shoot a lot more. And if Grabo can elevate Chimera and Ward and have that line put up that kind of even strength performance, Backstrom elevating Fehr and Brouwer (who are arguably more talented, at least at shooting the puck) isn't at all out of the question. Fehr and Brouwer aren't world beaters but having them both be ~20-25 goal players and Backstrom be a ~25-30 goal player himself should be doable.

be careful. fehr has one season at or around 20 goals where brouwer has 4 or more. brouwer has 4 consecutive seasons of no less than 17 goals which includes the shortened season. other than the one 21 goal season several seasons ago fehr has never had more than 12.

what fehr brings is a bonus. you count on him at your peril.

also and most importantly, backstrom could lead his own line and be the finisher. but isn't that wasting/illusing his best skill? he is an elite set up man. that would be similar to putting ov out with two shoot first players and make him the assist man. don't over think.
 

Halpysback*

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Fehr has never had this kind of opportunity in his career (top 6 spot with Backstrom centering him)

Also, Backstrom is with 2 shoot first players. They just don't command his respect the way OV does so he can be more free to do his own thing without always deferring, which would make him more impactful overall IMO. But he can still set up Brouwer and Fehr with plenty of good opportunities and they are shooters who should be able to bury decent chances.


And don't you think Backstrom's skillset at ES is currently being wasted as things are anyway? An elite set up man should be able to squeeze decent ES offense from Troy Brouwer and Eric Fehr.
 

Stewie G

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Fehr only has 5 fewer ES goals than Brouwer in the past 5 seasons in 37 fewer games. That includes his terrible stint with the Jets and much less TOI/G than Brouwer has seen.
 

BrooklynCapsFan

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Fehr has never had this kind of opportunity in his career (top 6 spot with Backstrom centering him)

Also, Backstrom is with 2 shoot first players. They just don't command his respect the way OV does so he can be more free to do his own thing without always deferring, which would make him more impactful overall IMO. But he can still set up Brouwer and Fehr with plenty of good opportunities and they are shooters who should be able to bury decent chances.


And don't you think Backstrom's skillset at ES is currently being wasted as things are anyway? An elite set up man should be able to squeeze decent ES offense from Troy Brouwer and Eric Fehr.

Backstrom's skillset is absolutely being wasted. And so is Ovechkin's; the guy is an elite set up man.

For reference, career high ESA in a single season:

H Sedin - 60 (crazy!)
Thornton - 56
Malkin - 51
Backstrom - 42
Getzlaf - 37
Kane - 37
Crosby - 36
Ovechkin - 36

Ovechkin has 1 ESA playing with Backstrom and Johansson this season. What a ****ing waste.
 

Ridley Simon

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many caps playoff seasons backstrom has been moved away from ovechkin. the most successful of those times was when fedorov was available to center ovechkin and semin available to finish for backstrom.

the only problem I see with backstrom away from 8 right now is who is the finisher to play the semin role? do you think backstrom can create a kunitz with fehr or ward or laich or chimera or tom Wilson? oops...forgot brouwer.

I don't think that's going to work, but its probably worth a try particularly in a game with a bad start going on.

in support of halpy's view however, I will add that a string of games with 19 away from ovechkin also creates what boudreau had with semin. that is the opportunity to whenever a goal is needed to throw the big line back together and run them out there every other shift for the last 10 minutes of a game the way bb did with semin backstrom and ovechkin.

I actually think 19 can finish on his own (witness his shoot out proficiency, he's got a great shot). So part of moving him away from 8 would be to get him to shoot MORE.

And agreed on last point. End of games outs them together, perhaps with both having a shooting mindset.
 

Ridley Simon

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be careful. fehr has one season at or around 20 goals where brouwer has 4 or more. brouwer has 4 consecutive seasons of no less than 17 goals which includes the shortened season. other than the one 21 goal season several seasons ago fehr has never had more than 12.

what fehr brings is a bonus. you count on him at your peril.

also and most importantly, backstrom could lead his own line and be the finisher. but isn't that wasting/illusing his best skill? he is an elite set up man. that would be similar to putting ov out with two shoot first players and make him the assist man. don't over think.

Which is why Erat needs to be on here somewhere. Either w 8 and 90. Or with 20 and 19.

21 should play 4th line C for a while
 

txpd

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Fehr has never had this kind of opportunity in his career (top 6 spot with Backstrom centering him)

Also, Backstrom is with 2 shoot first players. They just don't command his respect the way OV does so he can be more free to do his own thing without always deferring, which would make him more impactful overall IMO. But he can still set up Brouwer and Fehr with plenty of good opportunities and they are shooters who should be able to bury decent chances.


And don't you think Backstrom's skillset at ES is currently being wasted as things are anyway? An elite set up man should be able to squeeze decent ES offense from Troy Brouwer and Eric Fehr.

sorry halpy. I approve of the experiment. I am far from convinced it will succeed. Backstrom is one of the top 5 set up men in the league right now and there is no question that fehr and brouwer and chimera and laich and ward are at best second tier.

if backstrom's set ups are not getting scored and nobody is passing the puck to 8 anywhere near the quality that backstrom does, you risk a fall off in scoring of significant proportion.

like I said, don't over think it. sure. give it a shot. the caps can afford to lose a few games right now. but don't be shocked if it fails.

what I would like to see is ovechkin with Johansson and backstrom with kuznetsov
 

Halpysback*

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sorry halpy. I approve of the experiment. I am far from convinced it will succeed. Backstrom is one of the top 5 set up men in the league right now and there is no question that fehr and brouwer and chimera and laich and ward are at best second tier.

if backstrom's set ups are not getting scored and nobody is passing the puck to 8 anywhere near the quality that backstrom does, you risk a fall off in scoring of significant proportion.

like I said, don't over think it. sure. give it a shot. the caps can afford to lose a few games right now. but don't be shocked if it fails.

what I would like to see is ovechkin with Johansson and backstrom with kuznetsov

I don't think that you do. Their scoring is largely buyoyed by the PP, at ES their scoring as a line has been abysmal. They'd still be together on the PP. Ovechkin might lose a couple even strength goals but he'd more likely than not pick up assists. He's proven time and time again that he doesn't need an elite setup man to put up points. With him it's more about the style his line plays, like when he was with Zubrus and Clark or Fedorov and Kozlov.

Right now Ovechkin is prime Heatley and Backstrom is a prime Savard (maybe a step below as far as playmaking goes but still a pure playmaker). They can both be more than that. Ovechkin is not a pure turret and Backstrom is not a pure playmaker and that's it.

If Backstrom is such a good setup man then he doesn't need to have a world class sniper to bury his goals. Hell, Grabovski doesn't have one and he has plenty of good setups converted. Brouwer and Fehr aren't elite but they have good shots and can play at a ~top 6 level. They can also do the dirty work on the forecheck, along the boards and in front of the net and have Backstrom be less focused on puck retrieval then he currently is and more on making skilled plays from F3/scoring himself. Having him be the primary puck retrieval guy on his line is NOT good use of him, I'm sure you'd agree. It can fail but I don't think it will, at least not based on my hockey understanding.

Once Kuznetsov comes over I'd be for putting him with Backstrom as well, separate from OV.
 

notDkristich

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well, because he doesn't feel like juggling lines. because it will really hurt our ES production if he mixes players around.

<wish i was being sarcastic>
 

MrGone

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Is Justin Faulk that much better then Carlson? They have Justin Faulk listed as a lock for the Olympic team and it looks like Carlson is not going to make it.
 
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