Prospect Info: 2023-24 Prospect Info (CHL, NCAA, Europe)

[Chiarelli]

View attachment 799754

career high 31 points

 

[GirardSpinorama]

career high 31 points

Who?

 

[expatriatedtexan]

career high 31 points

You use points as your baseline metric for usefulness of defensemen?

 

[henchman21]

G put up 37 points last season, has 3 30+ points seasons and outside his rookie year has never dipped below 27 (though that is likely this year). We are in a different era of offense from defensemen... but G has very solid to good offensive ability. He's probably hurt more by Makar/Toews offensively than anybody else and is still a 30-35 guy consistently.

 

[Chiarelli]

You use points as your baseline metric for usefulness of defensemen?

we're talking about offensive d men

Who?

nvm that was his assists


Anyways Girard isn't really an offensive D I would argue he makes his money through transitioning and positioning. He's a solid defender as long as he isn't stuck in his own zone having to clear the net or battle in the corners too much.

 

[henchman21]

Anyways Girard isn't really an offensive D I would argue he makes his money through transitioning and positioning. He's a solid defender as long as he isn't stuck in his own zone having to clear the net or battle in the corners too much.

I agree with this... G is a middle pairing 2 way puck mover who ideally needs to be partnered with a bigger and more physical defender that doesn't handle the puck like a grenade. Not that Anaheim would want G, just want to use to use Gudas as an example. That's the perfect RD for G. Physical, also good at puck retrieval, and a very good first pass guy (he's super underrated there)... Manson when he's on top of his game can still do that but is more intermittent in his effectiveness (though prime Manson > Gudas).

Asking G to carry a pairing defensively, have a pairing that is undersized, or asking him to do all the puck retrievals is asking for trouble.

Put G in say Florida... he probably ends up the top PP option and offensively tilted guy where he might gain 10-15 points. Any place with a more skilled defender (well over half the league) will have him as a middle pairing transition guy who adds to the 2nd unit.

 

[Foppa2118]

I don't want to criticize G too much, he's a great puck moving defenseman, and I'm happy he's doing better.

But is he really a solid two way D, if we're acknowledging that he needs to be paired with a bigger more physical partner, he shouldn't do all the puck retrievals, and he shouldn't be asked to clear the front of the net or battle in the corners too much?

Those are all some of the most important things that make a defenseman good defensively.

Girard's transition game is elite, and it helps the team by keeping the puck out of the D zone, but the actual defending part of the game isn't his strong suit, because of his physical limitations with size and reach.

But that's ok, because a lot of good players have areas of the game they aren't as good with, and the areas G is good at, are very good. And he's a really nice luxury if he's playing on the 3rd pair, even though he doesn't put up a ton of points. Which is why the Avs depth on D is so good.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

I don't want to criticize G too much, he's a great puck moving defenseman, and I'm happy he's doing better.

But is he really a solid two way D, if we're acknowledging that he needs to be paired with a bigger more physical partner, he shouldn't do all the puck retrievals, and he shouldn't be asked to clear the front of the net or battle in the corners too much?

Those are all some of the most important things that make a defenseman good defensively.

Girard's transition game is elite, and it helps the team by keeping the puck out of the D zone, but the actual defending part of the game isn't his strong suit, because of his physical limitations with size and reach.

But that's ok, because a lot of good players have areas of the game they aren't as good with, and the areas G is good at, are very good. And he's a really nice luxury if he's playing on the 3rd pair, even though he doesn't put up a ton of points. Which is why the Avs depth on D is so good.

You're basically asking for Devon Toews at that point which G is not.

 

[Muffin]

I have no idea where all Girard's offensive abilities went. The first game he played in Sweden was looked do dynamic I thought he could be putting up Tyson Barrie numbers. Now he's literally worse offensively than Malinski.

 

[Alienblood]

I have no idea where all Girard's offensive abilities went. The first game he played in Sweden was looked do dynamic I thought he could be putting up Tyson Barrie numbers. Now he's literally worse offensively than Malinski.

Pratt coached it out of him which he is doi g to Byram and even Makar has gone worse in that department too.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

I have no idea where all Girard's offensive abilities went. The first game he played in Sweden was looked do dynamic I thought he could be putting up Tyson Barrie numbers. Now he's literally worse offensively than Malinski.

I dont think his offensive abilities are gone but his offensive opportunities are non existant. That and hes always lacked a shot. Also its a pretty short sample size this season, he was putting up
.5ppg as a dman without pp1 and without prime time with the big line which is very good.

Honestly cant think of any 60point dmen who plays in G's role.

 

[henchman21]

I have no idea where all Girard's offensive abilities went. The first game he played in Sweden was looked do dynamic I thought he could be putting up Tyson Barrie numbers. Now he's literally worse offensively than Malinski.

I think it is really underestimated how skilled a defensemen has to be to put up 40-45-50+ points consistently. It is easier than it was 10 years ago, but Barrie was very skilled offensively and supremely underrated here in that area. He was basically a top 10 defensive scorer in the league during most of his tenure with the Avs. Girard never really had that level of skill. Maybe if G is running a top PP he gets ~10 more points a season, which would put him in that 40 range... but the other side of that is that any team with G as their top PP defensemen is going to look for an upgrade because he's just not that talented.

Malinski has offensive skills, but his style of play and weakness defensively is always going to limit him. There are plenty of defensemen out there that can put up points, but not nearly as many who can handle 20+ minutes nightly to get the ice needed to reach higher levels of scoring. Friend of the show Calle Rosen is a good example of this. He can pile up points if given the ice time to do so. We saw it last year in St Louis very clearly... he's just not a guy you feed minutes to.

 

[niwotsblessing]

Friend of the show Calle Rosen is a good example of this. He can pile up points if given the ice time to do so. We saw it last year in St Louis very clearly... he's just not a guy you feed minutes to.

Unless Binnington is in net, amirite?

 

[expatriatedtexan]

It's hard for me to judge our dmen at times because I'm at a bit of a loss when it comes to adjusting for the fact that Makar and Toews get all of MacK, Rants, and most of Nuke's ice-time. That means our 3-6 dmen are playing with lesser quality offensive players. These guys don't convert at near the rate that our top line does. One of the reason's I've been looking at expected goals so much more lately...but I feel like there's something more to the picture that I need to take into account.

 

[McMetal]

I don't want to criticize G too much, he's a great puck moving defenseman, and I'm happy he's doing better.

But is he really a solid two way D, if we're acknowledging that he needs to be paired with a bigger more physical partner, he shouldn't do all the puck retrievals, and he shouldn't be asked to clear the front of the net or battle in the corners too much?

Those are all some of the most important things that make a defenseman good defensively.

Girard's transition game is elite, and it helps the team by keeping the puck out of the D zone, but the actual defending part of the game isn't his strong suit, because of his physical limitations with size and reach.

But that's ok, because a lot of good players have areas of the game they aren't as good with, and the areas G is good at, are very good. And he's a really nice luxury if he's playing on the 3rd pair, even though he doesn't put up a ton of points. Which is why the Avs depth on D is so good.

I think G always looks very good off the rush defensively. His skating allows him to maintain good gap control and he has a good active stick. He's also pretty good at reading the play. The cycle game and puck retrieval down low is pretty much his only weakness, because as you said once the puck is on his stick he's excellent at transition and creating space for a breakout.

 

[henchman21]

I think G always looks very good off the rush defensively. His skating allows him to maintain good gap control and he has a good active stick. He's also pretty good at reading the play. The cycle game and puck retrieval down low is pretty much his only weakness, because as you said once the puck is on his stick he's excellent at transition and creating space for a breakout.

Puck retrievals with G are interesting. He is one of the very best in the league at uncontested retrievals and when he gets those, his transition numbers are through the roof. This simply means when he can get the puck cleanly and start the breakout, he almost never spends any time defending. That is one of his biggest strengths defensively (along with gaps and play in space... his passes defended stats are also very good). Contested puck retrievals are not good though. He's not bottom of the league or anything, but typically in the 25th-40th percentile. He loses a lot of contested battles and when those happen, he tends to get trapped in the zone and cycled on. That's why he needs a cycle busting and contested puck retrieval partner. If you compliment him, he can be very effective. If you're asking him to be the guy to bust a cycle... it is only going to end poorly.

 

[Foppa2118]

You're basically asking for Devon Toews at that point which G is not.

It's more that I'm trying to see if we can clarify or agree what kind of defenseman he actually is. Which is quite a good one in many ways, especially with the puck.

Your characterization is an accurate one IMO. It acknowledges his faults. But when I see comments that he's solid, or a good two way defenseman, or very good defensively, or years ago when people would say he's a top pairing guy, or a #1, I don't think those are accurate.

Especially in the context of ranking him ahead of other D men on the team who get heavily criticized, even though they're not playing worse than G.

 

[avsfan09]

I think it is really underestimated how skilled a defensemen has to be to put up 40-45-50+ points consistently. It is easier than it was 10 years ago, but Barrie was very skilled offensively and supremely underrated here in that area. He was basically a top 10 defensive scorer in the league during most of his tenure with the Avs. Girard never really had that level of skill. Maybe if G is running a top PP he gets ~10 more points a season, which would put him in that 40 range... but the other side of that is that any team with G as their top PP defensemen is going to look for an upgrade because he's just not that talented.

Malinski has offensive skills, but his style of play and weakness defensively is always going to limit him. There are plenty of defensemen out there that can put up points, but not nearly as many who can handle 20+ minutes nightly to get the ice needed to reach higher levels of scoring. Friend of the show Calle Rosen is a good example of this. He can pile up points if given the ice time to do so. We saw it last year in St Louis very clearly... he's just not a guy you feed minutes to.

If Girard had a shot he would be able to score 50. Since he doesn’t it really lowers his offensive potential and ability to be unpredictable offensively.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

1+2 for Ritchie tonight, now up to 31 points in 21 games.

 

[BobRossColton]

1+2 for Ritchie tonight, now up to 31 points in 21 games.

Upping his trade value..or making us think we need to hold onto him?

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Upping his trade value..or making us think we need to hold onto him?

Who knows but more production is good either way!

 

[Perratrooper]

1+2 for Ritchie tonight, now up to 31 points in 21 games.

Getting closer to Henchy’s 1.5ppg line of hope.

How has he looked?

 

[AvsFan2123]

I’ve been away from this site for quite some time, but my Avs fandom has not! So this is a prospect check in I’m doing/asking about based purely on limited viewings and production watching. So if these topics of discussion have recently been brought up, I apologize. But here we go;

A.Buyalsky - I thought he was a dark horse prospect with his sophomore year he had being a top scorer on his team that didn’t score a lot of goals. He seems to have started really slow but is coming around as of late. 8 points in last 6 games.

C.Romaine - Truly thought he was a throwaway pick. But he’s having a decent season in the USHL. Did I see somewhere he de-committed from Providence? I could be very wrong. Top scoring D on his team.

M.Jedlicka - I don’t see a big giant red cross next to his name anymore, so is he close to coming back? I was really excited to see what he did after making a really good impression at camp. Hope he can finish year strong.

J.Polin / O.Pavel - AHL production. Woof. Nice to see Polin get some NHL games tho. Probly Avs just fulfilling games played promise. He actually played 10+ mins in TOR game?! Kinda wild to see that. Hoping he goes down and finishes year strong with more confidence after an NHL stint. As far as Pavel goes, it seemed like we found a solid 4C defensive/intangible ace with zero offense. Well. The zero offense seems to be holding true. Hope he’s doing the other stuff down there lol.

C.Ambrosio - Man. What a dumpy year. I know he’s got a lot of guys in front of him in the lineup, but wouldn’t you think a 21 year old would do well against lesser competition? I was in the same mold as him with Buyalsky, a dark horse prospect who has a chance.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Ritchie with another 1G 2A in the 1st period today. Kids been on a complete heater of late after the slow start.


I believe that's now 6G, 23 points in his last 11 games.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

I’ve been away from this site for quite some time, but my Avs fandom has not! So this is a prospect check in I’m doing/asking about based purely on limited viewings and production watching. So if these topics of discussion have recently been brought up, I apologize. But here we go;

A.Buyalsky - I thought he was a dark horse prospect with his sophomore year he had being a top scorer on his team that didn’t score a lot of goals. He seems to have started really slow but is coming around as of late. 8 points in last 6 games.

C.Romaine - Truly thought he was a throwaway pick. But he’s having a decent season in the USHL. Did I see somewhere he de-committed from Providence? I could be very wrong. Top scoring D on his team.

M.Jedlicka - I don’t see a big giant red cross next to his name anymore, so is he close to coming back? I was really excited to see what he did after making a really good impression at camp. Hope he can finish year strong.

J.Polin / O.Pavel - AHL production. Woof. Nice to see Polin get some NHL games tho. Probly Avs just fulfilling games played promise. He actually played 10+ mins in TOR game?! Kinda wild to see that. Hoping he goes down and finishes year strong with more confidence after an NHL stint. As far as Pavel goes, it seemed like we found a solid 4C defensive/intangible ace with zero offense. Well. The zero offense seems to be holding true. Hope he’s doing the other stuff down there lol.

C.Ambrosio - Man. What a dumpy year. I know he’s got a lot of guys in front of him in the lineup, but wouldn’t you think a 21 year old would do well against lesser competition? I was in the same mold as him with Buyalsky, a dark horse prospect who has a chance.

Got a Jedlicka update today. Still out a while longer.

Avalanche Prospect And Camp Standout Back Skating In Slovakia

One of the true surprises at training camp for the Colorado Avalanche was the play of their seventh round pick in the 2023 NHL Draft, Maros Jedlicka. The now 21 year old Slovak stuck around much longer than anticipated after a strong preseason, and earned plenty of praise from Avalanche Head...

coloradohockeynow.com