Prospect Info: [2022 - 1st OA] Juraj Slafkovsky (LW) (Player Discussion ONLY)

[ReHabs]

@JoelWarlord

I was replying chunk by chunk but I felt it was getting tedious. You're response is appreciated. You're right that I've been too pessimistic on the player and it's bled into my commentary.

I don't have faith in the Habs organization's ability to produce players (not until I see it), and especially not the Habs' ability to develop prospects that need a lot of refining in their hockey IQ which I believe is tied to a player's ability to produce points night-in night-out. Caufield doesn't really count, he went the college route and played less than 20 NHL/AHL games prior to last season's half-season breakout under MSL. Suzuki was kept in the OHL until he jumped over to the NHL team.

We have no other success stories to look on.

I bring up the recent top3 pick-busts Galchenyuk and Kotkaniemi because they ARE relevant to the discussion. There is more to a hockey club than the GM and president. Lapointe is a development guy and he's still there, Bouillon too for some reason. Allard is new and leading it but will he succeed? Do you have blind faith in him?

Brobov has questions asked of him too -- we had earned-faith in Timmins for too long until well past his best-before date. Brobov doesn't come in with a blank slate, we can look at his picks with the Rangers and ask questions.

All this put together tells me that Slafkovsky is far from being a sure thing, and if he doesn't bust (which I obviously hope he does not), he's far from being a PPG player.

It's a shame we had the 1OA in such a contentious draft but it's also a shame that the Habs didn't pick the safest and most necessary 1OA... Wright/Nemec/Cooley/Jiricek... compared to them Slafkovsky has the broadest range of outcomes from super good to super bust and I dunno about you but it doesn't comfort me one bit.

I'm not sure I would rank him as our #1 prospect given the uncertainty around him. I think in HF Prospects lingo there was a number assigned to a player's potential and a letter assigned to their likelihood of fulfilling that potential in the NHL eg 7.0B meant they were likely to hit the NHL but be a good 2nd liner and 9.0C meant they were less likely to make it but had the potential to be elite if they did make it.

What grade would you give Slafkovsky? I'm unsure about the number but the player profile and the cursed Habs organisation he's been picked into doesn't scream a A or B prospect to me.

 

[River Meadow]

@JoelWarlord

I was replying chunk by chunk but I felt it was getting tedious. You're response is appreciated. You're right that I've been too pessimistic on the player and it's bled into my commentary.

I don't have faith in the Habs organization's ability to produce players (not until I see it), and especially not the Habs' ability to develop prospects that need a lot of refining in their hockey IQ which I believe is tied to a player's ability to produce points night-in night-out. Caufield doesn't really count, he went the college route and played less than 20 NHL/AHL games prior to last season's half-season breakout under MSL. Suzuki was kept in the OHL until he jumped over to the NHL team.

We have no other success stories to look on.

I bring up the recent top3 pick-busts Galchenyuk and Kotkaniemi because they ARE relevant to the discussion. There is more to a hockey club than the GM and president. Lapointe is a development guy and he's still there, Bouillon too for some reason. Allard is new and leading it but will he succeed? Do you have blind faith in him?

Brobov has questions asked of him too -- we had earned-faith in Timmins for too long until well past his best-before date. Brobov doesn't come in with a blank slate, we can look at his picks with the Rangers and ask questions.

All this put together tells me that Slafkovsky is far from being a sure thing, and if he doesn't bust (which I obviously hope he does not), he's far from being a PPG player.

It's a shame we had the 1OA in such a contentious draft but it's also a shame that the Habs didn't pick the safest and most necessary 1OA... Wright/Nemec/Cooley/Jiricek... compared to them Slafkovsky has the broadest range of outcomes from super good to super bust and I dunno about you but it doesn't comfort me one bit.

I'm not sure I would rank him as our #1 prospect given the uncertainty around him. I think in HF Prospects lingo there was a number assigned to a player's potential and a letter assigned to their likelihood of fulfilling that potential in the NHL eg 7.0B meant they were likely to hit the NHL but be a good 2nd liner and 9.0C meant they were less likely to make it but had the potential to be elite if they did make it.

What grade would you give Slafkovsky? I'm unsure about the number but the player profile and the cursed Habs organisation he's been picked into doesn't scream a A or B prospect to me.

Wright/Nemec/Cooley/Jiricek would have all been better? lol. You obviously did not watch much of Wright

A ton of actual, real scouts had Slaf at #1. That's a fact.

This isn't some reach like you're trying to make it out to be.

 

[SlafySZN]

What did i just read,

Slafkovsky not our #1 prospect and Slafkovsky not a A or B prospect

geez…

 

[ReHabs]

Wright/Nemec/Cooley/Jiricek would have all been better? lol. You obviously did not watch much of Wright

A ton of actual, real scouts had Slaf at #1. That's a fact.

This isn't some reach like you're trying to make it out to be.

I think a ton of real scouts also had general doubts about the overall quality of the draft. A line we saw was that none of these topX players would go topX in 2023 for instance. The overall water mark of the 22 draft’s high end is lower than normal. The fact is that nobody stood out enough (or: everybody had enough question marks about them to prevent a consensus from being formed).

As for Wright, I didn’t say he would be better or even the better player because we have no idea how any of these players will develop — I said the pick (or Cooley, Nemec, and Jiricek) would be better at fulfilling the Habs organization’s priority need for a 1C and 1D.

I concede it wasn’t a cowboy pick that was off the board, Slaf was ranked top5/top3/top2 even but since no BPA revealed himself I don’t see why we can’t question the wisdom of picking a W who has only showed he can produce in a tournament setting so far in his young career.

And since he has been chosen, we should now be sober and be able to discuss how he can best reach his ceiling.

 

[Justsayin]

I think a ton of real scouts also had general doubts about the overall quality of the draft. A line we saw was that none of these topX players would go topX in 2023 for instance. The overall water mark of the 22 draft’s high end is lower than normal. The fact is that nobody stood out enough (or: everybody had enough question marks about them to prevent a consensus from being formed).

As for Wright, I didn’t say he would be better or even the better player because we have no idea how any of these players will develop — I said the pick (or Cooley, Nemec, and Jiricek) would be better at fulfilling the Habs organization’s priority need for a 1C and 1D.

I concede it wasn’t a cowboy pick that was off the board, Slaf was ranked top5/top3/top2 even but since no BPA revealed himself I don’t see why we can’t question the wisdom of picking a W who has only showed he can produce in a tournament setting so far in his young career.

And since he has been chosen, we should now be sober and be able to discuss how he can best reach his ceiling.

In order to have a strong opinion on one player compared to another, I think you really need to have spent a lot of time watching those players actually play and analyzing their play in the circumstances they are in.
When someone has very little actual knowledge of the players they are comparing, they tend to resort to cherrypicking stats, favoring players based on the positional needs of the organization or regurgitating other peoples' opinions in support of an otherwise vacuous position.
It's not so much the position that is taken by the unknowledgeable that is so off-putting, but the adamance that they are right.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I’ve learned over the last few days that it wasn’t Slaf’s offensive potential or his intriguing build to go along with his offensive game that propelled him to the 1OA, but it was his well rounded, defensive game that set him apart. Haha.

I’m kidding, but the argument that he has a sound defensive game has very little basis in fact. His IQ/positioning and defensive awareness are definitely weaknesses. They can be improved and they are not completely terrible, but they are certainly not a strength.

 

[Jaynki]

What did i just read,

Slafkovsky not our #1 prospect and Slafkovsky not a A or B prospect

geez…

Can you imagine, we have a f***ing first overall pick and because its not Connor McDavid its a shame if we are excited by his prospective.

We would win a stanley cup that some folks here would find a way to discredit it or even deny it.

 

[Kennerback]

I’ve learned over the last few days that it wasn’t

I’ve learned over the last few days that it wasn’t Slaf’s offensive potential or his intriguing build to go along with his offensive game that propelled him to the 1OA, but it was his well rounded, defensive game that set him apart. Haha.

I’m kidding, but the argument that he has a sound defensive game has very little basis in fact. His IQ/positioning and defensive awareness are definitely weaknesses. They can be improved and they are not completely terrible, but they are certainly not a strength.

Slaf’s offensive potential and his intriguing build to go along with his offensive game propelled him to the 1OA. His defensive game is well rounded enough to be play in the NHL now. Wright and Cooley are not there yet.

He has a sound defensive game. His IQ/positioning and defensive awareness are good enough to play in the NHL now. Wright and Cooley are not there yet.

 

[Kennerback]

@JoelWarlord

I was replying chunk by chunk but I felt it was getting tedious. You're response is appreciated. You're right that I've been too pessimistic on the player and it's bled into my commentary.

I don't have faith in the Habs organization's ability to produce players (not until I see it), and especially not the Habs' ability to develop prospects that need a lot of refining in their hockey IQ which I believe is tied to a player's ability to produce points night-in night-out. Caufield doesn't really count, he went the college route and played less than 20 NHL/AHL games prior to last season's half-season breakout under MSL. Suzuki was kept in the OHL until he jumped over to the NHL team.

We have no other success stories to look on.

I bring up the recent top3 pick-busts Galchenyuk and Kotkaniemi because they ARE relevant to the discussion. There is more to a hockey club than the GM and president. Lapointe is a development guy and he's still there, Bouillon too for some reason. Allard is new and leading it but will he succeed? Do you have blind faith in him?

Brobov has questions asked of him too -- we had earned-faith in Timmins for too long until well past his best-before date. Brobov doesn't come in with a blank slate, we can look at his picks with the Rangers and ask questions.

All this put together tells me that Slafkovsky is far from being a sure thing, and if he doesn't bust (which I obviously hope he does not), he's far from being a PPG player.

It's a shame we had the 1OA in such a contentious draft but it's also a shame that the Habs didn't pick the safest and most necessary 1OA... Wright/Nemec/Cooley/Jiricek... compared to them Slafkovsky has the broadest range of outcomes from super good to super bust and I dunno about you but it doesn't comfort me one bit.

I'm not sure I would rank him as our #1 prospect given the uncertainty around him. I think in HF Prospects lingo there was a number assigned to a player's potential and a letter assigned to their likelihood of fulfilling that potential in the NHL eg 7.0B meant they were likely to hit the NHL but be a good 2nd liner and 9.0C meant they were less likely to make it but had the potential to be elite if they did make it.

What grade would you give Slafkovsky? I'm unsure about the number but the player profile and the cursed Habs organisation he's been picked into doesn't scream a A or B prospect to me.

Slafkovsky was not the most “necessary“ but it was the safest pick. His floor is higher than any of the 4 players you named. They have a harder road to reach the NHL. The only thing we don’t know for sure is Slaf’s ceiling. I would give Slafkovsky a 9.0B in hfboards lingo.

 

[DAChampion]

@ExpatHabs in my opinion you have not been rude, however the discussion over Slafkovsky 's Liga production has been exhausted.

 

[Sterling Archer]

Just gonna leave this here.

[2022 - 1st OA] Juraj Slafkovsky (LW) (Player Discussion ONLY)​

I'll let myself out now.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I’ve learned over the last few days that it wasn’t


Slaf’s offensive potential and his intriguing build to go along with his offensive game propelled him to the 1OA. His defensive game is well rounded enough to be play in the NHL now. Wright and Cooley are not there yet.

He has a sound defensive game. His IQ/positioning and defensive awareness are good enough to play in the NHL now. Wright and Cooley are not there yet.

You don’t know what you’re talking about and this post proves it.

 

[Scriptor]

Too many forwards, I don't see the point of bringing him in the NHL. You need to play guys like Armia, Byron, Drouin if you want to get assets at the TDL.

Slaf would benefit from 1/2 years in the AHL, next to Schnarr and Mesar for example. He is far from playing too well already, anybody who follows Liiga can see it.

If you have not, just look quickly at the stats on the internet, he was 12th in Point per Game, 8th in GPG for players having played 10 games or more on his team (4th in the regular season). He is far from a finished product. I hope he is the next Jagr but there is no denying he is not there yet.

You forget the progression and the built up confidence as the season wore on. His production in Liga was better upon his return from international play.

Things change quickly for a maturing young adult and progression is key, not yearly stats.

 

[Kennerback]

You don’t know what you’re talking about and this post proves it.

Why is Cooley not playing in the NHL this season?

 

[FloJack]

...consensus, no consensus, who gives a shyte; we picked Slafkovsky...let's talk about him...start a Consensus thread in the OT if it means that much...

We don’t need no stinking consensus!

 

[RationalExpectations]

You forget the progression and the built up confidence as the season wore on. His production in Liga was better upon his return from international play.

Things change quickly for a maturing young adult and progression is key, not yearly stats.

Look at playoff stats then, 2 goals in 18 games.

 

[SOLR]

Slafkovsky was not the most “necessary“ but it was the safest pick. His floor is higher than any of the 4 players you named. They have a harder road to reach the NHL. The only thing we don’t know for sure is Slaf’s ceiling. I would give Slafkovsky a 9.0B in hfboards lingo.

There is no 9 in this draft. Nemec, Savoie, Cooley have the highest potential.

Nemec 8.7B
Savoie 8.7D
Cooley 8.5C
Slaf 8.3C
Wright 8C

However there is another score to give to these ratings "rarity"

Nemec 8.7B - 6
Savoie 8.7D - 6
Cooley 8.5C - 6
Slaf 8.3C - 10
Wright 8C - 7

This is where Slaf becomes interesting, he's a physical specimen, on a team with a lot of small player and acquiring such specimen is nearly impossible.

Nemec was the best player, for sure.
Slaf is the rarest player that could become good.

Next year it's

9.5B Michkov
9.5C Bedard
9 C Yager
9 C Fantilli
9 D Carlsson
8.7 C Dvorsky
8.7 C Allen
8.7 C Benson
8.7 C Sale
etc.

Notice that 10s are Gretzky, Lemieux, Ovechkin, Crosby, McDavids (verrry few).

 

[Scriptor]

And many other lists had Wright. There was no consensus 1OA this year, McKenzie said it himself that he could’ve easily polled 5-4 the other way.

It was never a consensus. The Habs went with what they preferred — and reportedly they didn’t interrogate Slafkovsky nearly as much as they did Wright. They liked the vibes Slaf gave off.

Truthfully it reminds me of the previous GM’s approach, remember “When you’re offered Shea Weber, you don’t ask for more”.

If Wright wasn’t the guy, then Cooley Nemec or Jiricek. The Habs need a 1C and 1D more than they need to swing for literally the rarest type of player imaginable.

You're fishing, extrapolating and projecting and it all works wonders to convince yourself that you are right, like what you are imagining is actual fact.

Nicely done.

 

[Scriptor]

Yes thats very possible personally i was team Wright all along but always believed Nemec had the highest ceiling

That being said im starting to love the Slafkovsky pick

Same here. I wanted Wright, wished it could be Nemec, but not at 1st OA. I'm also being swayed by what will say is organizational spin bout Slafkovsky. I like what I see on the ice and can't wait to see more of it.

Montreal or Laval? Like I've always said, ideally for Slafkovsky's development -- and the amount of NHL wingers currently on the team facilitates this -- Montreal, for a taste of the NHL's tempo to build up towards, a trip to Laval, for prime TOI in prime game situations in order to work on what needs to be improved and get accustomed to the North-American ice, then a recall to the fold in Montreal to apply what was learned in Laval.

All of that with no more than 39 games in the NHL this season! It kills an ELC year off the contract, but stalls Slafkovsky's road to becoming an UFA. After this upcoming season, he would still need 7 more years before becoming an UFA. That's more years of control and a chance to lock him up cheaper longer term since there will be more remaining RFA seasons when he is ready to cash in!

A taste of the NHL, time to work on things away from the limelight in Montreal and the return of the prodigal son to give Slafkovsky a slap on the back for a strong effort in Laval and the fans a taste of the future.

If Laval makes the playoffs, Slafkovsky can also go back to play in the post season there rather than stay in Montreal to let a hapless season fizzle out.

The 2023 draft, coming off a showcasing of Slafkovsky in Montreal to end the season, will be a huge event for Montreal fans, especially if Montreal manages to land a C like Slafkovsky's compatriot, Dvorsky, or a generational phenom like Bedard!

 

[ReHabs]

There is no 9 in this draft. Nemec, Savoie, Cooley have the highest potential.

Nemec 8.7B
Savoie 8.7D
Cooley 8.5C
Slaf 8.3C
Wright 8C

However there is another score to give to these ratings "rarity"

Nemec 8.7B - 6
Savoie 8.7D - 6
Cooley 8.5C - 6
Slaf 8.3C - 10
Wright 8C - 7

This is where Slaf becomes interesting, he's a physical specimen, on a team with a lot of small player and acquiring such specimen is nearly impossible.

Nemec was the best player, for sure.
Slaf is the rarest player that could become good.

Next year it's

9.5B Michkov
9.5C Bedard
9 C Yager
9 C Fantilli
9 D Carlsson
8.7 C Dvorsky
8.7 C Allen
8.7 C Benson
8.7 C Sale
etc.

Notice that 10s are Gretzky, Lemieux, Ovechkin, Crosby, McDavids (verrry few).

Where did you get these numbers?

 

[WinterLion]

Got beat by Laurent Dauphin at 3v3.... BUST!

 

[Cournoyer12]

Uncalled for. Seriously.

Sorry man, just tongue in cheek. I really love the kid’s potential, really hope he pans out!!

 

[Kennerback]

There is no 9 in this draft. Nemec, Savoie, Cooley have the highest potential.

Nemec 8.7B
Savoie 8.7D
Cooley 8.5C
Slaf 8.3C
Wright 8C

However there is another score to give to these ratings "rarity"

Nemec 8.7B - 6
Savoie 8.7D - 6
Cooley 8.5C - 6
Slaf 8.3C - 10
Wright 8C - 7

This is where Slaf becomes interesting, he's a physical specimen, on a team with a lot of small player and acquiring such specimen is nearly impossible.

Nemec was the best player, for sure.
Slaf is the rarest player that could become good.

Next year it's

9.5B Michkov
9.5C Bedard
9 C Yager
9 C Fantilli
9 D Carlsson
8.7 C Dvorsky
8.7 C Allen
8.7 C Benson
8.7 C Sale
etc.

Notice that 10s are Gretzky, Lemieux, Ovechkin, Crosby, McDavids (verrry few).

So if Sale is 9th in 2023 at 8.7C and you have Slafkovsky at 8.3C, you would have ranked Slafkofsky at what 18th overall in 2023?

 

[DAChampion]

There is no 9 in this draft. Nemec, Savoie, Cooley have the highest potential.

Nemec 8.7B
Savoie 8.7D
Cooley 8.5C
Slaf 8.3C
Wright 8C

However there is another score to give to these ratings "rarity"

Nemec 8.7B - 6
Savoie 8.7D - 6
Cooley 8.5C - 6
Slaf 8.3C - 10
Wright 8C - 7

This is where Slaf becomes interesting, he's a physical specimen, on a team with a lot of small player and acquiring such specimen is nearly impossible.

Nemec was the best player, for sure.
Slaf is the rarest player that could become good.

Next year it's

9.5B Michkov
9.5C Bedard
9 C Yager
9 C Fantilli
9 D Carlsson
8.7 C Dvorsky
8.7 C Allen
8.7 C Benson
8.7 C Sale
etc.

Notice that 10s are Gretzky, Lemieux, Ovechkin, Crosby, McDavids (verrry few).

Somehow, I doubt that the 2023 draft will be the greatest draft of all time.

 

[Scriptor]

Consensus means agreement. Scouts and hockey pros were not in consensus that Slaf was a 1OA. This is plainly obvious. Right up to the last minute nobody knew who would got 1OA. That’s clearly not a consensus. Wright was not a consensus 1OA either! There was no consensus!

Yakupov was not a unanimous 1OA pick but was a consensus 1OA pick.

Slafkovsky was not even a consensus 1OA. It was in the air right until the pick was announced.

Keep arguing your definition of consensus all you want. At this point, you're just trying to be right and it's sounding more and more like a spoiled brat's whining.

Other posters are trying to find a middle ground with you in a discussion and your are relentless in trying to be 100% right.

Maybe you just like the attention? I can't imagine what else it might be, because it's definitely not about engaging in discussion.

FYI, discussion forums are not supposed to be argument forums,. which it always seems to be when you post an opinion.

There is a recurring motif where you just want to be right about something - anything.

Fine, you're right. Now, find another subject your want to be right about...

Hearing your same arguments repeatedly, regardless of what else is being said has grown extremely tiresome.