2015 NHL Entry Draft Discussion - April 2015 Post Season

[Nithoniniel]

I have seen a lot of Strome (and Marner for that matter), and Marner's skill level is simply better. I will qualify that statement with the phrase at this point in time.

I don't think anyone here doubts that Marner is a more capable scorer. His regular season and playoff scoring is just simply better on a per game basis, despite playing on a team that scored 41 goals less than Strome's Otters.

With that being said, I think Strome has the chance to take his game to next level, and potentially be a more effective NHLer than Marner. Once again, at this point in time, Marner is the more dynamic scoring option in junior, which I think has a good chance to translate.

A point about the regular season. CHL Stats estimate time on ice and according to that, Strome actually outproduces Marner in P/e60. Marner did take part in a larger percentage of his teams offense though.

 

[leafhky88]

This is exactly how I feel. I know strome is talented. But he hasn't looked very good in the playoffs. The London series he is not very noticeable. Strome and Marner are so talented. I prefer Marner.

My post was the last of the now closed thread (due to size).

Strome's play the past 2 games has been a bit underwhelming - 1 I watched on TV, last night's I attended.

Last night both his linemates had their best chances and scored their points while not playing with Strome. Baptsiste seemed to be better once he was shifted to the 3rd line.

From my viewings, Marner is more dynamic. He does things with and without the puck at high speed - being very aggressive in both ends of the ice. It may just be these playoffs, but Strome has seemed to avoid the high traffic areas and physical side more than I expected. That being said, the possibility of a 6'3 center who won the scoring race in his draft year cannot be overlooked. He has been the guy I was hoping the Leafs would target and would be available at their pick. Having not seen others, it is tough to say for sure for me.

Watching a game live for me is so much different than on TV/streaming etc. as you have the ability to key in on a player of your choosing for a full shift, not necessarily where the puck is. The downside as mentioned in one of the above posts, is while it has been so accessible to many to watch Strome and Marner, it has created some tunnel vision. I have not had a chance to watch Provorov or Hanifin etc. and as such, do not post much about them, as I have nothing beyond what I read.

Toronto could very much end up taking a player apart from those 2 (Strome/Marner). Toronto's last pick in the top 5 was Rielly, who TSN had at 8, and Burke apparently had at 1.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

Both Marner and Nylander may need the puck too much for this to be as good a combination as we would like.

We may find out, one way or the other.

I can't see the pair working either. If anything, I'd rather have Nylander play as a centre and go for a three line ES scoring solution until we move Kadri.

 

[gabeliscious]

how upset would people be if the leafs took provorov at 4?

 

[Rufio65*]

how upset would people be if the leafs took provorov at 4?

I would be estatic if we selected Provorov. What he is doing in the WHL is very impressive. I also think that he will be the Leafs first round selection (unless Edmonton takes him which is very possible). He fills a major, major void here.. As much as Strome would IMO. I have no questions regarding Provorov's game. He does everything well AND physically asserts his will.

He's a stud and will be in contention for the Calder next season. He is 100% NHL ready and would accelerate the rebuild.

 

[Rufio65*]

People don't talk about Provorov much, but the Leafs have scouted him extensively.

 

[SprDaVE]

People don't talk about Provorov much, but the Leafs have scouted him extensively.

They've extensively scouted the top prospects in the top 40 or so.

 

[613Leafer]

People don't talk about Provorov much, but the Leafs have scouted him extensively.

I dont see why he's not just as hyped as Strome/Marner. Id say he's just as good as the majority of the top D prospects from the past 5-10 years, whereas Strome/Marner are a very clear notch below the top top forward prospects from the same timeframe. Still very good prospects, but I dont see them as Tavares, Stamkos, Kane, Malkin, etc calibre forward prospects.

 

[shelf]

I dont see why he's not just as hyped as Strome/Marner. Id say he's just as good as the majority of the top D prospects from the past 5-10 years, whereas Strome/Marner are a very clear notch below the top top forward prospects from the same timeframe. Still very good prospects, but I dont see them as Tavares, Stamkos, Kane, Malkin, etc calibre forward prospects.

Strome/Marner may not be Tavares/Stamkos level but Provorov is also not Doughty/Hedman/Ekblad leve.

 

[shelf]

I'd agree with that. But the point is, you can't go wrong with either option.



Like another poster said, Strome has size, shot, and arguably passing (but it's extremely close). As well as puck possession, board play, and leadership (both are good leaders). I also disagree that Marner is better defensively and I'm not sure where that came from.

One aspect about Strome that I love is his hockey sense. It's absolutely off the charts good. Better than anyone's in the draft not named McDavid.

I doubt you're blown away watching players like Sam Reinhart compared to guys like Ehlers too. It's easy to get caught up in the highlight reel plays.

OHL coaches say Marner has the higher hockey sense. Just because Marner is always moving doesnt mean he doesnt think where he is moving to. Both are very intelligent players.

 

[SprDaVE]

I dont see why he's not just as hyped as Strome/Marner. Id say he's just as good as the majority of the top D prospects from the past 5-10 years, whereas Strome/Marner are a very clear notch below the top top forward prospects from the same timeframe. Still very good prospects, but I dont see them as Tavares, Stamkos, Kane, Malkin, etc calibre forward prospects.

Strome and Marner may not be franchise players, at least not right now, but they both have Duchene, Landeskog, Galchenyuk, Johansen type potential, which is slightly under the franchise tag in most peoples eyes but top end/blue chip talent for sure.

Provorov probably will/should be amongst them though. It feels like he's got that Pietrangelo type potential.

 

[ULF_55]

http://www.eliteprospects.com/draftcenter.php?year=2015

Links to scouting rankings

ISS and Central Scouting below

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
4 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
5 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
6 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
7 Mikko Rantanen (C/W) TPS Liiga 56 9 19 28 22
8 Mathew Barzal (C) Seattle Thunderbirds WHL 44 12 45 57 20
9 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
10 Pavel Zacha (C/LW) Sarnia Sting OHL 37 16 18 34 56

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
4 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
5 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
6 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
7 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
8 Pavel Zacha (C/LW) Sarnia Sting OHL 37 16 18 34 56
9 Zachary Werenski (D) Univ. of Michigan NCAA 35 9 16 25 8
10 Timo Meier (RW/C) Halifax Mooseheads QMJHL 61 44 46 90 59

Future Considerations:

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
4 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
5 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
6 Zachary Werenski (D) Univ. of Michigan NCAA 35 9 16 25 8
7 Mikko Rantanen (C/W) TPS Liiga 56 9 19 28 22
8 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
9 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
10 Travis Konecny (C/RW) Ottawa 67's OHL 60 29 39 68 34

 

[613Leafer]

Strome/Marner may not be Tavares/Stamkos level but Provorov is also not Doughty/Hedman/Ekblad leve.

Why not? Provorov was nominated for WHL defenceman of the year (won for his conference). I'm pretty sure Doughty/Ekblad are the only other draft eligible defencemen that have done that (but in the OHL) in the past decade.

I'd say Provorov is above guys like Pietrangelo, Bogosian, Hamilton, etc from their respective draft years. He's the top defenceman on one of the top teams in the entire CHL, excels in all situations, has great offensive skills, is a good skater, isn't overly small, and has very good hockey IQ. He's not quite at Doughty/Ekblad level, but he's not far off either. He'd fall somewhere between them and the other guys I mentioned above.

I'm not even saying we should draft Provorov, just that I think he should definitely be in consideration and not immediately written off. Most people just seem to WANT a centre. The majority of people want one of Strome/Marner ahead of Hanifin too, despite Hanifin being ranked higher in the majority of prospect rankings.

 

[12345678910]

McDavid or bust. We all just have to collectively believe as well as say our prayers before bed every night until the lottery.

 

[shelf]

Why not? Provorov was nominated for WHL defenceman of the year (won for his conference). I'm pretty sure Doughty/Ekblad are the only other draft eligible defencemen that have done that (but in the OHL) in the past decade.

I'd say Provorov is above guys like Pietrangelo, Bogosian, Hamilton, etc from their respective draft years. He's the top defenceman on one of the top teams in the entire CHL, excels in all situations, has great offensive skills, is a good skater, isn't overly small, and has very good hockey IQ. He's not quite at Doughty/Ekblad level, but he's not far off either. He'd fall somewhere between them and the other guys I mentioned above.

I'm not even saying we should draft Provorov, just that I think he should definitely be in consideration and not immediately written off. Most people just seem to WANT a centre. The majority of people want one of Strome/Marner ahead of Hanifin too, despite Hanifin being ranked higher in the majority of prospect rankings.

Dylan Strome is the first to win CHL scoring title in his draft year since P.Kane and before that Crosby.

Kulikov and Ellis both won d-man of the year in their draft year. If Yandle was 6 days younger he would have done it.

 

[ULF_55]

http://www.eliteprospects.com/draftcenter.php?year=2015

Links to scouting rankings

ISS and Central Scouting below

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
4 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
5 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
6 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
7 Mikko Rantanen (C/W) TPS Liiga 56 9 19 28 22
8 Mathew Barzal (C) Seattle Thunderbirds WHL 44 12 45 57 20
9 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
10 Pavel Zacha (C/LW) Sarnia Sting OHL 37 16 18 34 56

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
4 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
5 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
6 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
7 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
8 Pavel Zacha (C/LW) Sarnia Sting OHL 37 16 18 34 56
9 Zachary Werenski (D) Univ. of Michigan NCAA 35 9 16 25 8
10 Timo Meier (RW/C) Halifax Mooseheads QMJHL 61 44 46 90 59

Future Considerations:

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
4 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
5 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
6 Zachary Werenski (D) Univ. of Michigan NCAA 35 9 16 25 8
7 Mikko Rantanen (C/W) TPS Liiga 56 9 19 28 22
8 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
9 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
10 Travis Konecny (C/RW) Ottawa 67's OHL 60 29 39 68 34

You'd have to think their rankings aren't based on personal like for the player, but logic, analysis and consensus.

You can turn purple all you want ...

 

[gabeliscious]

I would be estatic if we selected Provorov. What he is doing in the WHL is very impressive. I also think that he will be the Leafs first round selection (unless Edmonton takes him which is very possible). He fills a major, major void here.. As much as Strome would IMO. I have no questions regarding Provorov's game. He does everything well AND physically asserts his will.

He's a stud and will be in contention for the Calder next season. He is 100% NHL ready and would accelerate the rebuild.

People don't talk about Provorov much, but the Leafs have scouted him extensively.

Strome/Marner may not be Tavares/Stamkos level but Provorov is also not Doughty/Hedman/Ekblad leve.

i think it would be a little too obvious for the leafs to just take strome and call it a day. i think marner as well for that matter. i feel like people have raised legitimate questions about both strome and marner's game/character/size/etc. in contrast i havent heard/read anything to the same extent about provorov. granted because he is generally considered in the 6-10 range and not the 3-5 range it could be as simple as that. my gut feeling is that hunter/dubas/shanny will do something unexpected and not in a crouse kind of way. clearly we need everything so i dont think it is crazy to think they might think provorov will have the most utility to the leafs moving forward.

http://www.eliteprospects.com/draftcenter.php?year=2015

Links to scouting rankings

ISS and Central Scouting below

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
4 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
5 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
6 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
7 Mikko Rantanen (C/W) TPS Liiga 56 9 19 28 22
8 Mathew Barzal (C) Seattle Thunderbirds WHL 44 12 45 57 20
9 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
10 Pavel Zacha (C/LW) Sarnia Sting OHL 37 16 18 34 56

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
4 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
5 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
6 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
7 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
8 Pavel Zacha (C/LW) Sarnia Sting OHL 37 16 18 34 56
9 Zachary Werenski (D) Univ. of Michigan NCAA 35 9 16 25 8
10 Timo Meier (RW/C) Halifax Mooseheads QMJHL 61 44 46 90 59

Future Considerations:

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
4 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
5 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
6 Zachary Werenski (D) Univ. of Michigan NCAA 35 9 16 25 8
7 Mikko Rantanen (C/W) TPS Liiga 56 9 19 28 22
8 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
9 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
10 Travis Konecny (C/RW) Ottawa 67's OHL 60 29 39 68 34

it certainly looks like strome is our guy based on these lists assuming hanifin is gone. i have a gut feeling that shanny wont take him though.

 

[613Leafer]

Dylan Strome is the first to win CHL scoring title in his draft year since P.Kane and before that Crosby.

Kulikov and Ellis both won d-man of the year in their draft year. If Yandle was 6 days younger he would have done it.

Good catch on Kulikov/Ellis, I do remember Ellis now that you mention it.

Regardless, the QMJHL has produced very few top pairing NHL defenceman over the past decade, while the WHL is known as an NHL dman factory, so the Q would be the easiest league to contend for that type of award. And then Ellis had big question marks on his style of play / size, and whether or not it could translate well to the NHL.

Provorov doesn't have those types of question marks. As for Strome, his scoring pace was lower when McDavid wasn't on the team. He still would have ended up with ~100 points, but not CHL scoring level numbers.

I'll be happy if we draft Strome, but I'll also be happy if we draft Provorov. Hunter/Dubas have been scouting an incredible amount, and this pick is where they're going to hopefully demonstrate why we hired them.

 

[carko32]

http://www.eliteprospects.com/draftcenter.php?year=2015

Links to scouting rankings

ISS and Central Scouting below

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
4 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
5 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
6 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
7 Mikko Rantanen (C/W) TPS Liiga 56 9 19 28 22
8 Mathew Barzal (C) Seattle Thunderbirds WHL 44 12 45 57 20
9 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
10 Pavel Zacha (C/LW) Sarnia Sting OHL 37 16 18 34 56

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
4 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
5 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
6 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
7 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
8 Pavel Zacha (C/LW) Sarnia Sting OHL 37 16 18 34 56
9 Zachary Werenski (D) Univ. of Michigan NCAA 35 9 16 25 8
10 Timo Meier (RW/C) Halifax Mooseheads QMJHL 61 44 46 90 59

Future Considerations:

1 Connor McDavid (C) Erie Otters OHL 47 44 76 120 48
2 Jack Eichel (C) Boston Univ. NCAA 40 26 45 71 28
3 Noah Hanifin (D) Boston College NCAA 37 5 18 23 16
4 Dylan Strome (C) Erie Otters OHL 68 45 84 129 32
5 Mitchell Marner (C) London Knights OHL 63 44 82 126 53
6 Zachary Werenski (D) Univ. of Michigan NCAA 35 9 16 25 8
7 Mikko Rantanen (C/W) TPS Liiga 56 9 19 28 22
8 Ivan Provorov (D) Brandon Wheat Kings WHL 60 15 46 61 42
9 Lawson Crouse (LW) Kingston Frontenacs OHL 56 29 22 51 70
10 Travis Konecny (C/RW) Ottawa 67's OHL 60 29 39 68 34

You'd have to think their rankings aren't based on personal like for the player, but logic, analysis and consensus.

You can turn purple all you want ...

So according to such rankings and also from other scouting agencies, first 3 players are almost certain - McDavid, Eichel, Hanifin. And then Strome is 4th, almost without competition. But then things get interesting. Marner and Crouse are competing for 5th, even though Crouse is ranked also as 9th on one of them. But yeah, I can see him going 6th or 7th. Provorov will probably enter the race for 5th too.
But then we have Werenski, Rantanen, Barzal and Zacha(probably in such order), competing for remaining spots in top10, even though Konecny, Meier are following them strongly. It will go down to team needs and personal preferences in playing style I think.

And Jeremy Roy, RHD, hopefully available with Nashvilles' pick, weighs just 7 lbs less than Morgan Rielly in his draft year(183 lbs v. 190 lbs), so he can also end up quite strong player. Morgan also grew for 1'' and gained 15 lbs(to 205lbs according to official site) from his draft year. But even if he doesn't grow, he can get stronger and that should be ok too. Only problem I see at the moment is that he'll probably be taken in 15-20 spot, a little bit too early for us.

I have also seen Jansen Harkins climb the rankings, but hopefully he'll be available when we'll be picking with our 2nd 1st round pick.

 

[timlap]

i think it would be a little too obvious for the leafs to just take strome and call it a day. i think marner as well for that matter. i feel like people have raised legitimate questions about both strome and marner's game/character/size/etc. ...
...

Provorov is a fine prospect, so this isn't about that... but what do you mean when you say people have raised legitimate questions about the character of Marner and Strome? I have heard nothing like that.

For that matter I don't see any significant holes in their games (with a small exception for Marner's slight build). They are not brilliant at everything, but I see nothing concerning and plenty to be excited about

I don't really see any significant holes in Provorov's game either, so I'm not picking on him- though he's also not brilliant at everything- a very good all round player though.

Bottom line for me, there's no reason for us to dump on one prospect just because we like another guy.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

Can you imagine Cherry's rant if the leafs took someone like provorov or Hanifin over the two local leaf fans!

 

[SprDaVE]

Can you imagine Cherry's rant if the leafs took someone like provorov or Hanifin over the two local leaf fans!

...Who cares?

 

[Sittler 27]

...Who cares?

I agree, lol.

 

[Lebanese Leaf]

Why not? Provorov was nominated for WHL defenceman of the year (won for his conference). I'm pretty sure Doughty/Ekblad are the only other draft eligible defencemen that have done that (but in the OHL) in the past decade.

I'd say Provorov is above guys like Pietrangelo, Bogosian, Hamilton, etc from their respective draft years. He's the top defenceman on one of the top teams in the entire CHL, excels in all situations, has great offensive skills, is a good skater, isn't overly small, and has very good hockey IQ. He's not quite at Doughty/Ekblad level, but he's not far off either. He'd fall somewhere between them and the other guys I mentioned above.

I'm not even saying we should draft Provorov, just that I think he should definitely be in consideration and not immediately written off. Most people just seem to WANT a centre. The majority of people want one of Strome/Marner ahead of Hanifin too, despite Hanifin being ranked higher in the majority of prospect rankings.

Nothing against Provorov, I like the kid, but he is the wrong choice for the current state of this franchise. Morgan Rielly looks like he has elite #1 D talent and has been developing well, so you have to take that into account IMO. On the other hard, we lack a true top line C prospect, and even with Nylander being moved back to C next year, we need all the help we can get there.

It's also easier to turn a later 1st/2nd round pick into a top D than it is to turn it into a top C.

 

[TheCLAM]

Nothing against Provorov, I like the kid, but he is the wrong choice for the current state of this franchise. Morgan Rielly looks like he has elite #1 D talent and has been developing well, so you have to take that into account IMO. On the other hard, we lack a true top line C prospect, and even with Nylander being moved back to C next year, we need all the help we can get there.

It's also easier to turn a later 1st/2nd round pick into a top D than it is to turn it into a top C.

Top-pairing definitely.

#1 Elite D - I'm not convinced..

He has the potential to become one, but it's unlikely he turns into a handful of elite defensemen in this league. The whole point of drafting is selecting the best player on the board, if the Leafs management decide it's Provorov.. then that's the guy we go with.

Historically it's easier to turn a later 1st/2nd round pick into a top D, however, we have not historically reaped the rewards of this placement.