Prospect Info: 2015 NHL Draft Prospect Discussion - At the Halfway Mark of the Season

[Leaf Rocket]

Just to throw another wrench in there - according to central scoutings latest rankings

Crouse is #4, Strome #5, Marner #7.

I can't believe people don;t realize how good crouse is and surprised at him being 4 lol

 

[Trapper]

This is one of the few times an opinion is wrong.

You DO NOT take a player with less potential because of position. Thats how you ruin a franchise.

The Leafs need franchise/elite TALENT, it doesn't matter if its a center or a D-man.

If you read my post, I'm saying Barzal has high potential. So much in fact that I don't agree with the players Button listed ahead of him. I'm not picking a center worse than a D-man because I need a center, I'm picking what IMO is the BPA. My draft list,
McDavid,Eichel,Hannifin,Strome,Marner,Barzal.
If you think someone else is better, good for you. You can tell me why player x is better.

 

[Leaf Rocket]

Barzal is pretty awesome and under-rated because he's been injured but his talent, skill and oddly unusual drive...who is actually doubted. I saw him at what? 16...he was breaking records. This kid could be good, if he is given the room to grow. He was making waves to be the next joe sakic in skill. So i really hope we pick him up with a second first rounder if we are higher than expected.

Another guy that's under the radar because he's not having a strong year in the 67's is Konecky strong, two way and skilled. Good one to pick up if he slips past the tweens.

 

[theIceWookie]

Within certain blocks of players. If you have two equlivant players, sure go by positino. But Hannifin and Strome/Marner aren't in the same "block". Hannifin is with McDavid and Eichel, Strome and Marner are on the next tier down. Thats why you take Hannifin instead of a center.

And McKenzie just did his mid-season ranking, and has them in the those positions as well.

And it would be easy to argue that call - Hannifin appears to have greater potential. Maybe Hunter turns out being right, but he would taking the lower odds (like taking Barkov over Jones).

Ranking really doesn't mean much. It's a good indicator of a player but it is by no means a plumb line to go on. Scouts, teams, GM's and lists are wrong every year.

I don't think Hanifin is with McDavid at all. Those two have very much separated themselves. I see Hanifin as the next tier, albeit it the leader, but by no means comfortably ahead of the rest. Not anymore. He hasn't done enough (which isn't saying he's bad, he's been very good) to be considered in that tier.

 

[Leaf Rocket]

Ranking really doesn't mean much. It's a good indicator of a player but it is by no means a plumb line to go on. Scouts, teams, GM's and lists are wrong every year.

I don't think Hanifin is with McDavid at all. Those two have very much separated themselves. I see Hanifin as the next tier, albeit it the leader, but by no means comfortably ahead of the rest. Not anymore. He hasn't done enough (which isn't saying he's bad, he's been very good) to be considered in that tier.

TBH in general it's hard for a D to be above in another Tier. Ekblad was the only one I can think about it but it was huge.

 

[silentbob37*]

Ranking really doesn't mean much. It's a good indicator of a player but it is by no means a plumb line to go on. Scouts, teams, GM's and lists are wrong every year.

I don't think Hanifin is with McDavid at all. Those two have very much separated themselves. I see Hanifin as the next tier, albeit it the leader, but by no means comfortably ahead of the rest. Not anymore. He hasn't done enough (which isn't saying he's bad, he's been very good) to be considered in that tier.

Based on?

 

[theIceWookie]

Based on?

Based on a lot, including personal viewings of him at the WJC and BC.

Look he's good but he's not Eichel/McDavid good. He wasn't nearly as impressive as Werenski at the WJC's, hasn't been as explosive as I expected him to be at BC. I don't think it's a stretch to say he's not with those two, and I don't think it's a stretch to see him as not as good as Strome/Marner. Eichel and McDavid have been incredible and put up numbers that aren't usual for any player in their leagues, let alone being draft eligible players. Hanifin has been good but not exceptional. He's been outproduced by Werenski, which doesn't mean he's worse (I've railed against those that only use points to judge a player) but does show he's not nearly as exceptional as some are thinking he is.

He's the third best prospect but he's not leaps and bounds ahead of guys I have at 4/5/6 personally.

 

[silentbob37*]

Based on a lot, including personal viewings of him at the WJC and BC.

Look he's good but he's not Eichel/McDavid good. He wasn't nearly as impressive as Werenski at the WJC's, hasn't been as explosive as I expected him to be at BC. I don't think it's a stretch to say he's not with those two, and I don't think it's a stretch to see him as not as good as Strome/Marner. Eichel and McDavid have been incredible and put up numbers that aren't usual for any player in their leagues, let alone being draft eligible players. Hanifin has been good but not exceptional. He's been outproduced by Werenski, which doesn't mean he's worse (I've railed against those that only use points to judge a player) but does show he's not nearly as exceptional as some are thinking he is.

He's the third best prospect but he's not leaps and bounds ahead of guys I have at 4/5/6 personally.

So your personal viewings (and your qualified to judged a prospects NHL potential how?) is more valid then a pro-scouts?

I'll stick with what the experts and pro's say about them. And according to those, Hannifin is a top tier propsects, Strome/Marner etc.. are 2nd tier.

I see we have another "stat sheets = potential" people.

 

[silentbob37*]

TBH in general it's hard for a D to be above in another Tier. Ekblad was the only one I can think about it but it was huge.

Jones is another one.

And from all reports so is Hannifin. Some people have been saying without McDavid and Eichel Strome would be the top center int he draft. Well without those two Hannifin would be the concensus #1 pick.

 

[ErikP803]

I can't believe people don;t realize how good crouse is and surprised at him being 4 lol

Would you really take him over Marner though?

 

[Bridgeman]

Based on a lot, including personal viewings of him at the WJC and BC.

Look he's good but he's not Eichel/McDavid good. He wasn't nearly as impressive as Werenski at the WJC's, hasn't been as explosive as I expected him to be at BC. I don't think it's a stretch to say he's not with those two, and I don't think it's a stretch to see him as not as good as Strome/Marner. Eichel and McDavid have been incredible and put up numbers that aren't usual for any player in their leagues, let alone being draft eligible players. Hanifin has been good but not exceptional. He's been outproduced by Werenski, which doesn't mean he's worse (I've railed against those that only use points to judge a player) but does show he's not nearly as exceptional as some are thinking he is.

He's the third best prospect but he's not leaps and bounds ahead of guys I have at 4/5/6 personally.

Please explain how Hanifin wasnt as impressive as Werenski at the WJC. I've watched all the games a second time and it is clear Hanifin was relied upon much more in critical
situations, (PK 4x4 end of games)which tells me the coaches had more faith in Hanifin. BC is in a tougher league then Michigan ,many more low scoring 1 goal games not to mention Michigan has more goal scorers so please dont compare point production, its foolish . Both are great players but Hanifin is a better skater, a stud in d zone and believe me will produce offensively big time when in the right enviorment to do so.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

If the leafs are lucky enough to get to the 3rd overall pick I think they take Hanifin regardless of how long they've needed a top center. I believe that you build your team from the crease out. Hanifin is a defensemen with no apparent holes in his game and has been the consensus #3 by nearly all scouting services since last season behind two generational talents. So I don't see us not taking him. I would love to have a guy that could be the next Suter/ Pietrangelo and being on a pairing with Rielly would be something special for years!

Hopefully we could get a top 15 pick via trade with Kessel/Phaneuf and add a solid forward like Barzal/Rantanen/Merkley. Remember guys like Kopitar and Getzlaf weren't taken in the top 10. I guess the same argument could be made for defensemen like Weber but I guess I value a potential top 5 NHL defensemen in the top five in the draft over a guy like Strome who does have question marks. I see Hanifin having a bigger impact in the NHL than Strome.

 

[ACC1224]

If Edmonton picks 2 wouldn't they be better suited taking Hanifin than Eichel?

 

[Leaf Rocket]

Would you really take him over Marner though?

I personally wouldn't.

If Edmonton picks 2 wouldn't they be better suited taking Hanifin than Eichel?

I dont think they ever plan for these things...they just dont anything and look at google for an answer.

 

[theIceWookie]

So your personal viewings (and your qualified to judged a prospects NHL potential how?) is more valid then a pro-scouts?

I'll stick with what the experts and pro's say about them. And according to those, Hannifin is a top tier propsects, Strome/Marner etc.. are 2nd tier.

I see we have another "stat sheets = potential" people.

You haven't been around this thread much have you?

Cause I am not anywhere near "stat sheets = potential" people.

And go for it, I jsut spent about three pages telling people that the scouts do know what they are talking and they have credibility. But scouts also make mistakes. Sometimes psoteres actually know what they're talking about. Not that I'd ever claim to know more, but than again I never said that did I.

I think I'm going to lovvvvee having you in this thread...

 

[theIceWookie]

Jones is another one.

And from all reports so is Hannifin. Some people have been saying without McDavid and Eichel Strome would be the top center int he draft. Well without those two Hannifin would be the concensus #1 pick.

Not consensus actually. Button just came out and said he thinks the best dmen in the draft in Provorov. ISS has Crouse at 3, and more than a few other rankings have Hanifin at 4 or even 5.

Drafting isn't a science. If it was you wouldn't continue to have massively different draft days than the rankings.

And like I said multiple times, Hanifin is the third best prospect in this draft but theres an argument to be made that he might not be so solid there. Which doesn't mean he's not the third best prospect, but it means there's some other very good prospects.

 

[ULF_55]

If Edmonton picks 2 wouldn't they be better suited taking Hanifin than Eichel?

Would Hanifin be BPA?

It isn't even close is it?

 

[theIceWookie]

Please explain how Hanifin wasnt as impressive as Werenski at the WJC. I've watched all the games a second time and it is clear Hanifin was relied upon much more in critical
situations, (PK 4x4 end of games)which tells me the coaches had more faith in Hanifin. BC is in a tougher league then Michigan ,many more low scoring 1 goal games not to mention Michigan has more goal scorers so please dont compare point production, its foolish . Both are great players but Hanifin is a better skater, a stud in d zone and believe me will produce offensively big time when in the right enviorment to do so.

Personally I didn't actually think Hanifin was that impressive at the WJC. He was relied upon but I didn't see him play as impressively as you did. And you definitely make a good point about NCAA point production however BC is really only lacking a true top scorer in comparison to Michigan, they're probably little deeper offensively just with no real gamebreaker.

Now I think the thing for me was the Werenski was and has been more impressive but that doesn't mean he's a better player. That's the thing with an expected top prospect, they get a lot of exposure compared to other guys so they get analyzed a whole lot more. And often that can lead to them being over analyzed. So a guy like Werenski who wasn't as hyped looks more impressive because he doesn't have as high of expectations.

Which is probably what happened to me. I had high expectations for Hanifin and wasn't nearly as impressed, yet didn't have many for Werenski and was quite impressed. I think someone made a good comment that echoed my thoughts. It was a situation similar to Murray/Trouba. Trouba was more raw, Murray more polished. I think the situation is similar although I think Hanifin has better potential than Murray personally. I just really like Werenski, it's not really a knock on Hanifin. It's just I've seen a ton of potential and improvement from Werenski which I love to see, but since Hanifin has been so polished while he's improved, it hasn't been such a big jump which just isn't as impressive. Which isn't really a bad thing at all, just to me it doesn't stand out as much.

I'd still take Hanifin over Werenski, but I personally don't think Hanifin as solidified at three as people thing he is. That's clearly met some fierce opposition, but I'm ok with that. I'm fairly comfortable knowing I could be wrong, but also knowing that I should have enough currency built up around this thread for others to know that I'm not out to lunch just posting for the sake of being contrarian.

 

[theIceWookie]

If the leafs are lucky enough to get to the 3rd overall pick I think they take Hanifin regardless of how long they've needed a top center. I believe that you build your team from the crease out. Hanifin is a defensemen with no apparent holes in his game and has been the consensus #3 by nearly all scouting services since last season behind two generational talents. So I don't see us not taking him. I would love to have a guy that could be the next Suter/ Pietrangelo and being on a pairing with Rielly would be something special for years!

Hopefully we could get a top 15 pick via trade with Kessel/Phaneuf and add a solid forward like Barzal/Rantanen/Merkley. Remember guys like Kopitar and Getzlaf weren't taken in the top 10. I guess the same argument could be made for defensemen like Weber but I guess I value a potential top 5 NHL defensemen in the top five in the draft over a guy like Strome who does have question marks. I see Hanifin having a bigger impact in the NHL than Strome.

I think personally I'd think about Strome or Marner but ultimately I'd pick Hanifin.

 

[Sundinisagod]

There was no surprise at No. 3 on TSN's mid-season ranking. Boston College freshman Noah Hanifin was in that slot in September and remains there. Hanifin, by all accounts, showed some inconsistency early in the college season, but reaffirmed his high ranking with a solid outing at the world juniors. Only one of 10 scouts surveyed didn't have the mobile, puck-moving defenceman at No. 3, dropping him to No. 4. The consensus, though, is quite clear that next to McDavid and Eichel, he's the premier prospect available.

According to Bobby Mac 9/10 scouts in his most recent ranking have Hanifin at 3...so he does seem to be the BPA at 3 according to the majority of scouts it seems.

 

[ACC1224]

I think personally I'd think about Strome or Marner but ultimately I'd pick Hanifin.

How big is the gap between Eichel and Hanifin vs Hanifin and Strome/Marner?

 

[Community]

How big is the gap between Eichel and Hanifin vs Hanifin and Strome/Marner?

Most people have McEichel in their own tier and then Hanifin as the top of the 2nd tier (that goes from 3-5imo with Marner/Strome), but some people have that tier from 3-7/8.

The majority of people that think Hanifin is #3 have:
McDavid
Eichel

Hanifin
Strome/Marner

With Eichel and Strome/Marner relatively close to the player ahead of them, but definitely not as good.

 

[Paradoc]

Just to throw another wrench in there - according to central scoutings latest rankings

Crouse is #4, Strome #5, Marner #7.

Is Crouse that good? I've never seen him play besides the world juniors, but is he good enought to become a top 5 player in this draft?

 

[WilliamNylander]

How big is the gap between Eichel and Hanifin vs Hanifin and Strome/Marner?

The gap between Eichel-Hanifin is bigger than Hannifin-Strome/Marner.

 

[theIceWookie]

Most people have McEichel in their own tier and then Hanifin as the top of the 2nd tier (that goes from 3-5imo with Marner/Strome), but some people have that tier from 3-7/8.

The majority of people that think Hanifin is #3 have:
McDavid
Eichel

Hanifin
Strome/Marner

With Eichel and Strome/Marner relatively close to the player ahead of them, but definitely not as good.

The gap between Eichel-Hanifin is bigger than Hannifin-Strome/Marner.

Agree with both of these.