bert
Registered User
Right he wasn't he was drafted to shut down the other team something he is doing the absolute opposite of.
Imagine Karlsson just didn't score at all.... What he is supposed to do. Well Cowen is doing the equivalent on defense.
Post-Game Talk: 08-Feb-2014 OTT @ BOS
- Thread starter WORLDSTARHIPHOP
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Right he wasn't he was drafted to shut down the other team something he is doing the absolute opposite of.
Imagine Karlsson just didn't score at all.... What he is supposed to do. Well Cowen is doing the equivalent on defense.
Pierre from Orleans
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Pierre from Orleans
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He is pretty bad defensively.
He makes one good defensive play just to follow it up with a few terrible ones.
That's been littered throughout his entire career thus far. You and most posters are just blinded by his incredible speed, his ability to penetrate the oppositions blue line etc to remember his defensive gaffs.
''bad''? What do you mean, below average or not even NHL caliber? Either way you're wrong.
First of all, he plays 28 min a game and is 23 years old. Do you expect no mistakes? Please. Even Lidstrom would make mistakes logging those minutes on this team. This year, EVERYONE on the team is bad defensively except for Turris. Everyone looks ''bad''. That would make it extremely hard for Karlsson to look good, no?
Second, no he hasn't been good defensively this year, but he's been average overall. I don't care who you are and what amount of points you put up, you don't get 28 min if you have 6/7 D level defense (i.e. Corvo).
Third, he's been good defensively during his career. He was one of the best defensive players in the league last year. In his Norris year, he was above average for an NHL defenseman and got the toughest matchups on the team.
So please, spare us the lies.
Karlsson has been pretty bad defensively most of this season. Even his offence isn't really where it was, he used to be a lot more dynamic along the offensive blue line.
I'm not crapping on the guy. He's the team's best player and, yesterday aside, has been improving steadily. He'll be fine.
What this team needs is a shot of professionalism. Too relaxed, too many games where they just don't show up. It would be one thing if the talent just wasn't there, but in most of their losses, like this one, they were never really in the game.
I'm not crapping on the guy. He's the team's best player and, yesterday aside, has been improving steadily. He'll be fine.
What this team needs is a shot of professionalism. Too relaxed, too many games where they just don't show up. It would be one thing if the talent just wasn't there, but in most of their losses, like this one, they were never really in the game.
aragorn
Do The Right Thing
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Agreed, Karlsson has been brutal defensively this yr & being paired with Cowen isn't helping either one of them. Karlsson was much better defensively in his Norris yr, I'm not sure what is going on with him this yr but he isn't attacking players defensively & just letting people walk in or beat him to pucks he used to always win races for. I would like to see either Methot or Wiercioch play with Karlsson to see if it improves. Cowen would be better paired with Ceci since he is much easier to read than Karlsson.
But it's not just him, this team is just too careless with the puck which is why they have too many turnovers, they are lazy defensively which is why they get so many penalties (the refs suck too) & they have lacked energy, heart, passion & consistency all yr long in games. I have no idea why they are like that but they need to find consistency in their game, all of them hopefully at the same time would be nice for a change. I don't know if they can make the playoffs, they are just too inconsistent to bet on, but I still want BM to make a deal or two to improve the team a little more.
Pierre from Orleans
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''bad''? What do you mean, below average or not even NHL caliber? Either way you're wrong.
First of all, he plays 28 min a game and is 23 years old. Do you expect no mistakes? Please. Even Lidstrom would make mistakes logging those minutes on this team. This year, EVERYONE on the team is bad defensively except for Turris. Everyone looks ''bad''. That would make it extremely hard for Karlsson to look good, no?
Second, no he hasn't been good defensively this year, but he's been average overall. I don't care who you are and what amount of points you put up, you don't get 28 min if you have 6/7 D level defense (i.e. Corvo).
Third, he's been good defensively during his career. He was one of the best defensive players in the league last year. In his Norris year, he was above average for an NHL defenseman and got the toughest matchups on the team.
So please, spare us the lies.
First of all he played 17 games last year, whose to say he would be able to sustain his defensive play throughout the season. He is just not as good as people make him out to be.
With your logic Cowen's ice time is justified this season then too no? If people are going to rip on Cowen at least shed some blame on his partner as well. Cowen also gets the toughest matchups and is still adjusting to playing a full time role in the NHL he is bound to make mistakes especially coming off major surgery.
He is extremely young but his counterpart Karlsson who makes defensive gaffs is let off the hook despite playng almost 2 more seasons than that of Cowen. If he was consistently bad throughout his career (very short NHL career thus far) then I would understand the harsh criticism towards him.
Fine but you don't have to say it's 1 good play followed by 3 bad ones. That's just wrong
Cowen is worse than Karlsson and I haven't said a bad word about Cowen since mid-November. I'm disappointed in Cowen somewhat but I realize the tough situation he's in and the growing pains associated
Like I said I'm disappointed with Cowen's play (just like Karlsson's), but I'm cool with it
You're going way overboard with the Karlsson bashing. With the shear amount of minutes he gets of course he'll make mistakes. Karlsson has to shoulder EVERYTHING. He has enormous pressure on him. He is expected to be the best defensive and offensive player every day. He needs to be better but chill. There aren't nearly as many gaffs as you make it seem. He's 23
Pierre from Orleans
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Probably exaggerated a bit there but my point stands.
My point was towards everyone who bashes Cowen on a nightly basis without taking into consideration the guys circumstances, not to mention the fact that Karlsson is basically left unscathed with regards to criticism despite being just as responsible more or less.
Not going overboard at all. When you get Karlsson bashed down your throat non stop you tend to pay much more attention to him. I've seen him make great defensive plays and I've seen him make not so great defensive plays. His speed makes up for his lack of position. If he didn't have his speed he would be even worse on the ice from a defensive stand point.
That's cause Cowen is worse defensively than Karlsson (in most people's opinion), and Karlsson is actually produce offense and creating a lot. Cowen is supposed to be the defensive conscience, but yeah that's not really happening.
Well. Yeah he uses his speed. So...?
Absolutely every single defensemen on the team has made bad defensive plays. You'Re expecting perfection when it's just not possible right now
Back in Black
All Sports would be great if they were Hockey
Not true. Phillips hasn't **** up in 7 games now....
true he's been really good these past 7 games, I hope he keeps it up. Though he was bad the rest of the season
I understand that you love Cowen but bashing our star player is not the way to go to try and get your point across. Karlsson brings so much more to the team than Cowen could ever bring.
My frustrations with Cowen is that he just doesn't seem to understand his role. He could be dominant in other ways but for some reason he has forgotten what has brought him here. He doesn't intimidate anyone anymore. He doesn't fight and doesn't hit so, just what does he bring to the team right now.
Boro in the few games that he played looked a lot more intimidating than Cowen has at any point this year and I guarantee you that if he was paired with Karlsson would understand his role. I don't hate Cowen but I do question how he is being used.
Pierre from Orleans
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Who said I am bashing Karlsson? Pretty sure there are people out there who aren't as biased that would agree that he is not as defensively great as others make him out to be.
Boro was trying to keep a full time position on the team, of course he is going to play a safe game to keep a roster spot. Lets see him keep that up for the duration of an 82 schedule in the NHL.
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Pierre from Orleans
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No where was I ever expecting perfection from anyone. Quite the opposite really.
Novak Djokovic
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He doesn't look any different than Chara did when he was on the island. Chara looked like John Scott more than a legit d-man when he was there. Like Holmes mentioned he is a project and it will take time for him to get better. The Cowen you see today likely won't be the same person you see in a few years. For some reason many people have this huge expectation that d-men have to become elite at such a very young age. The truth is a majority of them don't really start to break out until their mid 20s unless they are very gifted like Karlsson. Karlsson gets ripped apart for his defensive play at times but most people seem to forget how young he is. If guys like Karlsson and Cowen are still making so many defensive errors in their mid to late 20s then by all means it's fair to complain like crazy.
Someone said it best before. If you trade Cowen to try and get a top six forward then you will be looking for another Cowen to fill the hole he will leave. If anyone says Boro will replace his spot then I will just laugh because it won't be long until posters bash Boro when he makes similar mistakes that Cowen is making.
Someone said it best before. If you trade Cowen to try and get a top six forward then you will be looking for another Cowen to fill the hole he will leave. If anyone says Boro will replace his spot then I will just laugh because it won't be long until posters bash Boro when he makes similar mistakes that Cowen is making.
Baby Ryan
Registered User
Karlsson makes some pretty dumb defensive plays sometimes (Bergeron walks right around Anderson and Karlsson is trying to stay in the passing lane, but that lane was already covered by a teammate) then very good ones.
I think OVERALL, the problem with him is that he is too offensively inclined. The majority of his defensive errors and criticism comes from him spoon feeding the other team by trying to drive the offense when it's too risky. He just needs to learn how to evaluate how risky it is, and he will be a ton better.
His defensive zone coverage for the MOST PART when he isn't daydreaming about rushing up the ice with the puck, is above average, but no where near fantastic but above average.
And about the Cowen thing everyone is arguing about, someone in page 5 posted what happened on all of the goals, I looked at them all, and I was just SMH at the Cowen goals.
I understand he is recovering from injury, but those were mental errors, very bad ones especially the Iginla one.
But he is young, so bleh.
I think OVERALL, the problem with him is that he is too offensively inclined. The majority of his defensive errors and criticism comes from him spoon feeding the other team by trying to drive the offense when it's too risky. He just needs to learn how to evaluate how risky it is, and he will be a ton better.
His defensive zone coverage for the MOST PART when he isn't daydreaming about rushing up the ice with the puck, is above average, but no where near fantastic but above average.
And about the Cowen thing everyone is arguing about, someone in page 5 posted what happened on all of the goals, I looked at them all, and I was just SMH at the Cowen goals.
I understand he is recovering from injury, but those were mental errors, very bad ones especially the Iginla one.
But he is young, so bleh.
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DrEasy
Out rumptackling
I think he'll be a good one, but in the meantime he needs sheltered minutes on the third pairing. But for that to happen we need to acquire a solid top 4 veteran somehow.
The Islanders kind of gave up on Chara - after 5 years. Cowen hasn't even been with the big club for 3 years and we've given up?
I remember playing the Islanders with Chara and our forwards Havlat, Hossa, Afly would skate circles round the guy. He absolutely sucked with them. Where is he now?
Does Cowen have the same passion and determination as Chara? Chara did so much on ice and off ice training to become the player he has.
StefanW
Registered User
The point is that we don't know because none of us can see into the future. I think comparing him to Chara is unfair, because a lot of exceptional top 4 D already in the league don't measure up to that standard. I would be thrilled if in 3-5 years he becomes a solid 3/4 guy who plays a simple no-nonsense, physical game
Obviously comparing him to Chara with what we know now is unfair. But at the time, Chara was simply another prospect for the Islanders, quite similar to Cowen's situation with us. He really didn't hit his prime until, I would argue after he left Ottawa which would put him at around 30. Cowen is 22? My point is, give the kid some time.
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