Proposal: Zibanejad to the Avs

[Dr Quincy]

You're right. The difference is actually only 0.94 P/60, which is not quite a full point lead for Kerfoot.

I know you're joking, but back to the original point:

A couple years ago all of the Avs Fs were really not putting up points. When offers were made for them, many Avs fans would say "Points aren't everything." and "Nobody is scoring so the good guys aren't going to put up big numbers".

Now that their team is doing better all of a sudden, I guess pts are everything and team scoring context doesn't matter any more.

Not saying this to single out Avs fans, as I think lots of people do this- they'll argue contradictory points depending on their team's situation. Anyone who thinks Kerfoot is anywhere close to Mika is crazy.

That said, like I said on page 1, the Rangers likely wouldn't get 1 of those 2 pieces from the Avs, nevermind 2.

 

[Goulet17]

Well, this seems to be going well.

 

[Foppberg]

Would I like Zib on the Avs? Hell yeah.

Would I give up Makar or OTT 1st? Hell no.

 

[kanuck87]

Lol @ Makar and/or Ott 1st needing to be in a deal for Zibanejad, whose career high for points in a season is 51. O'Reilly and Turris, both of whom are better than Zibs, didn't return nearly that high of a price.

 

[Nopuckluck]

Avs 1st + Timmins + Greer counter offer.

I'd assume that's declined though, even though Timmins is a very good RHD prospect.

I’d actually take that

 

[Justin17]

Lol @ Makar and/or Ott 1st needing to be in a deal for Zibanejad, whose career high for points in a season is 51. O'Reilly and Turris, both of whom are better than Zibs, didn't return nearly that high of a price.

Turris is better than Zibanejad?

 

[One Winged Angel]

I don't trade Zibanejad without Ottawa's 1st coming back. I can't see Gorton doing so either without that pick involved.

Colorado's 1st and a prospect could be good for Hayes, who I think would do a world of good for Colorado, but I don't see a fit for a Zibanejad deal.

Not that I think it's worth it for Colorado to give that Ottawa pick up in a deal for Zibanejad, I just think that's the only thing that would make Gorton even consider moving him right now as Zibanejad is young and has term left on a great deal and if dealt, it would kill the Rangers center depth.

In other words, to use the typical HF line, it would take an overpayment to get them to deal Zibanejad.

 

[Hasbro]

to Avalanche
Mika Zibanejad

to Rangers
Ottawa 1st this year
A good right d prospect

Rangers continue to stockpile assets and futures while Colorado gets an elite 2nd line center to compliment McKinnon

 

[Hasbro]

Do you sell used cars as well?

He's been in the league since 2011 and his career high is 51 points.

60ish rounding up.

 

[kanuck87]

Turris is better than Zibanejad?

Why don't you think so?

 

[Justin17]

Why don't you think so?

Similar production but Zibanejad is 4 years younger, and on a better contract. He’s worked a lot on his defensive game, and has 19 points so far while playing with Namestnikov and Fast. This is just my opinion, and I haven’t seen Turris play that often. Also, I agree that a Colorado shouldn’t trade Makar or the Ottawa first for him.

 

[kanuck87]

Similar production but Zibanejad is 4 years younger, and on a better contract. He’s worked a lot on his defensive game, and has 19 points so far while playing with Namestnikov and Fast. This is just my opinion, and I haven’t seen Turris play that often. Also, I agree that a Colorado shouldn’t trade Makar or the Ottawa first for him.

Turris still has the edge on Zibanejad when it comes to production over the last few seasons. I didn't say Turris was a lot better than Zibanejad, just that he's better. In any case, the point was that Zibs isn't worth either the Ott 1st or Makar and we both agree on that.

 

[El Travo]

You want Rantanen too?

No thanks. I have to laugh at the term "Elite 2nd-line centre". He's not elite if he's only a 2nd-line player.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

Rangers aren't moving Zibanejad, Avs aren't moving that pick. /thread

I'm definitely surprised with Avs fans opinions of Zibanejad though. Pretty obvious based on these posts that you don't watch him play. He is that good

If you've seen our trade boards, quite a few of us would like Zibanejad and see him as a low end 1-c. But none of us are prepared to offer Ottawa's 1st or Makar to make that dream happen.

Bundle of lesser parts, Avs 1st, 2nd, Bowers, Timmins, Kaut, sure. But not a blue chip defender pre-NHL debut and a pick that could very well land a better player than Zibanejad. Both players (Makar and Mystery Draftee) would be on ELCs during the theoretical Avs contention period, a seriously valuable asset by itself in the cap era.d

 

[tucker3434]

I know you're joking, but back to the original point:

A couple years ago all of the Avs Fs were really not putting up points. When offers were made for them, many Avs fans would say "Points aren't everything." and "Nobody is scoring so the good guys aren't going to put up big numbers".

Now that their team is doing better all of a sudden, I guess pts are everything and team scoring context doesn't matter any more.

Not saying this to single out Avs fans, as I think lots of people do this- they'll argue contradictory points depending on their team's situation. Anyone who thinks Kerfoot is anywhere close to Mika is crazy.

That said, like I said on page 1, the Rangers likely wouldn't get 1 of those 2 pieces from the Avs, nevermind 2.

Well, we were kinda proven right.

I’d take Zibby over Kerfoot for sure. He’d be great on our 2nd line, but there isn’t a need to pay a large premium for that upgrade.

 

[bleedgreen]

I could see the Avs giving up their own pick, but that sens pick is like a gold ticket to the Willie Wonka factory.

Z is not remotely worth that, though I imagine the Avs own pick could be potentially in play. He’s probably worth a first, or maybe a second and a legit prospect not named Makar.

 

[hooverdam]

I know you're joking, but back to the original point:

A couple years ago all of the Avs Fs were really not putting up points. When offers were made for them, many Avs fans would say "Points aren't everything." and "Nobody is scoring so the good guys aren't going to put up big numbers".

Now that their team is doing better all of a sudden, I guess pts are everything and team scoring context doesn't matter any more.

Not saying this to single out Avs fans, as I think lots of people do this- they'll argue contradictory points depending on their team's situation. Anyone who thinks Kerfoot is anywhere close to Mika is crazy.

That said, like I said on page 1, the Rangers likely wouldn't get 1 of those 2 pieces from the Avs, nevermind 2.

The point isn't "Kerfoot is as good as Zibanejad". The point is "we're getting good production out of Kerfoot, similar to that of Zibanejad right now, so why spend considerable assets to upgrade?"

I would love Zibby on this team. He's good friends with the captain and he's a legit talent. But if the Rangers are asking for a premium on him, it doesn't make sense to spend that when we're developing our own point producers who are holding their own.

Sakic preached patience and wanted to see how the homegrown secondary scoring would fare before he swung for outside help. Right now, the secondary scoring is starting to deliver, so fans of other teams telling us we need to pay them blue chippers to fix a problem we may not have is annoying.

 

[bernmeister]

to Avalanche
Mika Zibanejad

to Rangers
Ottawa 1st this year
A good right d prospect

Rangers continue to stockpile assets and futures while Colorado gets an elite 2nd line center to compliment McKinnon

AVs do not do this.
When Colorado was playing better earlier on and looked like it was gonna compete but was a one line team and desperately needed depth, I offered an entire 2nd line including Zib for the Sens pick + Meloche and maybe a cap dump, don't remember exactly.

That was more reasonable given the situation.
That wuz not enuf and AV's slide hasn't helped incline for a deal.

Zib is a 1C value, and commands as such, no more, no less.
NY will not take less to accommodate Colorado there are other takers
and
if Colorado does not want to pay market rate, let alone a premium b'c supply and demand, 1Cs are not usually made available unless there is baggage or some other issue, that is their prerogative.

Despite being ideal complement to Kreider as I said he would be, Zib needs to be moved.
He has NMC pending which kicks in after this season and there is more value to moving him now than later.
Once we are all said and done, no more NMCs ever by Rangers, ever.
Generous NTC policy would be enough to protect player and give club flexibility.

 

[FoxysExpensiveNYDigs]

AVs do not do this.
When Colorado was playing better earlier on and looked like it was gonna compete but was a one line team and desperately needed depth, I offered an entire 2nd line including Zib for the Sens pick + Meloche and maybe a cap dump, don't remember exactly.

That was more reasonable given the situation.
That wuz not enuf and AV's slide hasn't helped incline for a deal.

Zib is a 1C value, and commands as such, no more, no less.
NY will not take less to accommodate Colorado there are other takers
and
if Colorado does not want to pay market rate, let alone a premium b'c supply and demand, 1Cs are not usually made available unless there is baggage or some other issue, that is their prerogative.

Despite being ideal complement to Kreider as I said he would be, Zib needs to be moved.
He has NMC pending which kicks in after this season and there is more value to moving him now than later.
Once we are all said and done, no more NMCs ever by Rangers, ever.
Generous NTC policy would be enough to protect player and give club flexibility.

So much wrong with this post.

The Avs current slide? You mean the one where they've won 4 straight and are tied for 2nd place in the Central?

No your proposal sending an entire line to the Avs for Ottawa's 1st and Meloche + cap dump was not more reasonable.

Finally the Rangers not offering NMCs ever is the dumbest thing I've ever read. They are a reality of the cap world. Rangers refusing to offer them would lead to never retaining talent.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Jost, kaut and a 1. At minimum.

He has term and is having a very good year.

Hayes is a better fit in Colorado.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I know you're joking, but back to the original point:

A couple years ago all of the Avs Fs were really not putting up points. When offers were made for them, many Avs fans would say "Points aren't everything." and "Nobody is scoring so the good guys aren't going to put up big numbers".

Now that their team is doing better all of a sudden, I guess pts are everything and team scoring context doesn't matter any more.

Not saying this to single out Avs fans, as I think lots of people do this- they'll argue contradictory points depending on their team's situation. Anyone who thinks Kerfoot is anywhere close to Mika is crazy.

That said, like I said on page 1, the Rangers likely wouldn't get 1 of those 2 pieces from the Avs, nevermind 2.

Everyone does it because context matters. Obviously, Mika is the better overall player right now, but the main reason people claim that we need to make a trade is to address the secondary scoring we allegedly don't have. So, if we're making a move to improve our scoring, points are extremely relevant to that decision making process. Points aren't really relevant when good young players whose value are based mostly on potential are trying to be poached for pennies on the dollar by people disingenuously trying to use low point totals to devalue them. Should we call Larkin a 60 point player when discussing his value, or is he rightfully worth more than that?

As for the trade being proposed here, we're in complete agreement. The Sens 1st is essentially a non-starter at this point.

 

[Machinehead]

You want Rantanen too?

No thanks. I have to laugh at the term "Elite 2nd-line centre". He's not elite if he's only a 2nd-line player.

He does everything as a 1st line rate and he's a center, but you're probably not winning the Cup if he's your 1C.

What would you call that?

 

[avsfan09]

Asking for Ottawa 1st + Cale Makar for Mika Zibanejad isn't far off from the Avs asking for NYR 1st + Lias Andersson for Tyson Barrie.

No I'm pretty sure it is haha. Anderson is okay but doesnt compare to two top five picks. And Barrie imo is more valuable than Zib.

 

[Nopuckluck]

I never mentioned Makar in my proposal. I said the Ottawa 1st and a legit RD prospect

So based on the responses from Avs fans let’s tweak the deal.
Colorado’s 1st and anynprospect we want not named Makar

 

[avsfan09]

Rangers aren't moving Zibanejad, Avs aren't moving that pick. /thread

I'm definitely surprised with Avs fans opinions of Zibanejad though. Pretty obvious based on these posts that you don't watch him play. He is that good

I think our reactions are more about the Value than Zib himself. Hed be a good 2c for us. Although I personally think we have the pieces that we can do better. But than again weve been spoiled at C in Colorado.