Yzerman to Ottawa
- Thread starter Stephen
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I still think the Red Wings definitely win a Cup sometime in the next few years. I bet Yashin would've fit in just fine in Detroit, what with the bigger market and a whole bunch of other Russians to play with. Yashin would've been just as effective as Yzerman in Detroit.
As for Ottawa, it's more interesting to wonder. Ottawa had a bunch of really good teams from '99 onwards, any of which might've plausibly won the Cup (with the exception of 'the 2001-02 squad, which was dealing, amongst other things, with losing Yashin). If one went back in time and had it all run through again, I think it's fairly likely Ottawa wins one. I don't think they get better with Yzerman, though. In the short-term he's an equal replacement to Yashin, but as he gets older he's still going to lose some of his effectiveness, and the Senators would never have gotten the massive haul of Chara and Spezza for him, that kept them great moving forward.
As for Ottawa, it's more interesting to wonder. Ottawa had a bunch of really good teams from '99 onwards, any of which might've plausibly won the Cup (with the exception of 'the 2001-02 squad, which was dealing, amongst other things, with losing Yashin). If one went back in time and had it all run through again, I think it's fairly likely Ottawa wins one. I don't think they get better with Yzerman, though. In the short-term he's an equal replacement to Yashin, but as he gets older he's still going to lose some of his effectiveness, and the Senators would never have gotten the massive haul of Chara and Spezza for him, that kept them great moving forward.
Stephen
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It is conceivable that Yashin's career could have worked out very differently in the company of other star Russians who could mentor him and also be in a stable organization and not be maligned as he was in Ottawa and New York.
I wonder what kind of dimension Yzerman's career would have taken on had he led his hometown Senators from the basement to contender status? He probably would have assumed the same two way leadership role with the likes of Alfredsson, Hossa, Havlat coming up. Maybe he would have become a kind of Dave Andreychuk like character in Tampa who helps mold the kids to victory or at least a feel good story like Lanny McDonald in Calgary.
I wonder what kind of dimension Yzerman's career would have taken on had he led his hometown Senators from the basement to contender status? He probably would have assumed the same two way leadership role with the likes of Alfredsson, Hossa, Havlat coming up. Maybe he would have become a kind of Dave Andreychuk like character in Tampa who helps mold the kids to victory or at least a feel good story like Lanny McDonald in Calgary.
#66
Registered User
Its funny seeing this with the OP avatar. Bowman was after Sundin at the 94 draft too.
I think the Red Wings are just what Yashin needed as a player. He was good when playing a puck support system but just couldn't thrive when asked to do to much by himself and never the type to carry a team.
I think the Red Wings are just what Yashin needed as a player. He was good when playing a puck support system but just couldn't thrive when asked to do to much by himself and never the type to carry a team.
tony d
Registered User
I think it would have worked out for both teams. Yzerman would have given Ottawa a good #1 centre who had leadership abilities in the late 90's. Also Yashin would have fit in nicely as a #2 centre in Detroit.
Perhaps Yashin would have benefited but regardless of where they play, Yzerman would always be a much better player. I would take him over Sakic to be completely honest in those polls.
vadim sharifijanov
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i remember reading on more than one occasion that one of the reasons yashin always treated the sens with such bad faith when it came to contracts is because early on they kept pumping up daigle, calling him the star, marketing him, sending his reel to the writers that vote for the calder, even though yashin was the one carrying the team. of course, daigle also made multiples of yashin's first contract.
i wonder whether similar problems would have occurred in detroit if yashin were to be playing in fedorov's much bigger shadow.
i wonder whether similar problems would have occurred in detroit if yashin were to be playing in fedorov's much bigger shadow.
RabbinsDuck
Registered User
Good point - Yashin had just as much of a chance for spectacular failure in Detroit as he did for success.
JSmith81x
Your weapon is guilt
Yes, Ottawa told Yashin they didn't have much money for his first contract, so he took ~$650,000/year ... then Ottawa gave Daigle at least four times that.
I like the possible comparision of Yzerman to Andreychuk or McDonald in Ottawa. He would probably win one cup there with Alfie, Hoss, Havlat, Redden and Chara.
Yashin would be probably different player. I definitely see him as really good PPG overall player.
Interesting question is, who would win #1 center battle: Fedorov or Yashin?
Yashin would be probably different player. I definitely see him as really good PPG overall player.
Interesting question is, who would win #1 center battle: Fedorov or Yashin?
Given the typical usage of the first two lines, I bet Yashin would've been the #1 just because by the time '96-97 rolled around he was the stronger, offensively, of the two (and only getting better).
Sens wouldn't have Chara.
Yashin probably would've seen a cup in Detroit. Fedorov was always better offensively when he was "The Man" and Yashin would be a secondary scoring option.
Germz
4th liners ftw
I doubt Yashin would have resented playing in Fedorov's shadow. His resentment of Daigle was exacerbated by a) Daigle's underwhelming on-ice performance and b) the obvious Canadian favouritism that was being shown to a bilingual Canadian player in Ottawa.
Playing second fiddle to a Russian superstar like Fedorov would have been an honour by comparison. Yashin was proud, perhaps greedy, but he was not stupid.
And he would have been playing second fiddle. Fedorov at the time of the would-be trade was light years ahead of Yashin in every respect.
Playing second fiddle to a Russian superstar like Fedorov would have been an honour by comparison. Yashin was proud, perhaps greedy, but he was not stupid.
And he would have been playing second fiddle. Fedorov at the time of the would-be trade was light years ahead of Yashin in every respect.
Stephen
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Under the right tutelage in Detroit under the wing of the Russian Five and Bowman, Yashin probably could have fulfilled his immense potential, which probably would have been a Sundin+ on Detroit, 35-40 goals on a consistent basis, over a point a game, which he provided anyway, but combined with championship pedigree and likely a much longer NHL career without the buyout fiasco.
Rhiessan71
Just a Fool
Spot on. The only thing Yashin would do better is score and even that might be debatable. He is just so far off from Yzerman.
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Big Phil
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I guess I'll go against the grain and remind people just how terrible of a playoff performer Yashin was. You might say: "Well he would have had a star studded cast in Detroit." True, he'd have a better team, but he was on a team very capable of making deep runs in Ottawa. The Sens were not slouches back then. He had 27 points in 48 playoff games. That's awful. His "best" playoff run was 1998 when he had 8 points in 11 games. He got out of the first round once in his career. Once. Not to mention you can pinpoint a lot of the blame towards him for why the Sens faltered the way they did.
1999 - 0 points in a sweep. Couldn't shake Mike Peca off of him the whole series. The irony is that this was the time Yashin demanded more money.
2001 - Forced to play in Ottawa again. Managed one assist in another sweep at the hands of Toronto. Showed no heart - again.
After that, 4 first round exits with the Islanders and a grand total of 12 points in 22 games. In 1999 and 2001 his team was widely considered the favourite and had home ice advantage.
Yashin not only held out for more money in 1999-'00 despite having a contract and despite being the main reason the Sens were bounced out of the playoffs but the Sens also fell to the Leafs in the first round in 2000. He was a piriah.
Compare that to Yzerman. While his offense was dropping in the 1990s his heart and desire and leadership rose. He sacrificed for the team. He would block a shot in the dying seconds even if he knew he'd get a deep bruise. Would Yashin? That was a rhetorical question. We know he didn't and wouldn't. Yzerman was a team player. He didn't sulk in the middle of the Wings' great years and want more money. He took a paycut in 2001-'02 to allow more star studded players to play for Detroit. Ask yourself if Yashin would do that. Again, a rhetorical question.
Give me Stevie Y over a prime Yashin 8 days a week. Even an old Yzerman. If Yashin and Fedorov were in Detroit can you really say for sure that Yashin is the #1 center? And if he isn't is he okay with that? History suggests he probably wouldn't have been.
1999 - 0 points in a sweep. Couldn't shake Mike Peca off of him the whole series. The irony is that this was the time Yashin demanded more money.
2001 - Forced to play in Ottawa again. Managed one assist in another sweep at the hands of Toronto. Showed no heart - again.
After that, 4 first round exits with the Islanders and a grand total of 12 points in 22 games. In 1999 and 2001 his team was widely considered the favourite and had home ice advantage.
Yashin not only held out for more money in 1999-'00 despite having a contract and despite being the main reason the Sens were bounced out of the playoffs but the Sens also fell to the Leafs in the first round in 2000. He was a piriah.
Compare that to Yzerman. While his offense was dropping in the 1990s his heart and desire and leadership rose. He sacrificed for the team. He would block a shot in the dying seconds even if he knew he'd get a deep bruise. Would Yashin? That was a rhetorical question. We know he didn't and wouldn't. Yzerman was a team player. He didn't sulk in the middle of the Wings' great years and want more money. He took a paycut in 2001-'02 to allow more star studded players to play for Detroit. Ask yourself if Yashin would do that. Again, a rhetorical question.
Give me Stevie Y over a prime Yashin 8 days a week. Even an old Yzerman. If Yashin and Fedorov were in Detroit can you really say for sure that Yashin is the #1 center? And if he isn't is he okay with that? History suggests he probably wouldn't have been.
agentblack
Registered User
This is fascinating, the trade works for both teams. And yet something tells me neither would win a cup.
ottawa would have won a cup with stevie y and alfredsson together
at the same time i think Yashin would have fit right in with the wings and all of there europeans they have had
at the same time i think Yashin would have fit right in with the wings and all of there europeans they have had
Perhaps I might have been a bit hard on Yashin but it might be because I have never been a fan of his in the least. I would take Kovalev over him to be honest.
Royal Canuck
Taco Enthusiast
I think Detroit would've still won a cup between '96-'04 somewhere.
Ottawa would be strong from '99-'06, but I couldn't see a cup winning team.
sr edler
gold is not reality
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what's a piriah? a pariah? or a piranha? or a combo?
but i fully agree with the sentiment of your post, i don't think yashin would have worked out very well in detroit at all, and he definitely would have played second fiddle to fedorov who was the infinitely better player, yashin wasn't the kind of player to lead a team full of stars
Big Phil
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Pariah of course.
I also don't understand the people on here who felt Yashin would be a good fit in Detroit. Yashin wasn't a good fit ANYWHERE. Have we forgotten the cancer he was already?
