Your top 10 playoff performers of all-time
- Thread starter Big Phil
- Start date
Crease
Chief Justice of the HFNYR Court
- Jul 12, 2004
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Aside from the obvious names (Gretzky, Howe, Lemieux, Orr) I was thinking Sakic, Messier, and Beliveau probably make the cut. For forwards, it would be interesting to see a list of highest percentage increase in PPG from regular season to playoffs (with some sort of minimum playoff GP threshold).
jigglysquishy
Registered User
tjcurrie
Registered User
DisgruntledGoat*
Registered User
- Dec 26, 2010
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In no particular order:
Gretzky
Lemieux
Orr
Roy
Messier
Beliveau
Richard
I think that group is the elite group. Theres probably some debate to fill out the next three spots.
Gretzky
Lemieux
Orr
Roy
Messier
Beliveau
Richard
I think that group is the elite group. Theres probably some debate to fill out the next three spots.
gudzilla
Registered User
- Aug 9, 2012
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no sakic? i think aprent should be in the discussion but dont know enough about him, but i know he was the big reason of the two flyers cups
Hobnobs
Pinko
- Nov 29, 2011
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Not a single euro has been mentioned 
Ill mention Kurri, Tikkanen and Forsberg to the hottest candidates, Tikkanen being a bit of an outsider on a list like this maybe but I still think that he was one of the best playoff performers even in his older years. Then we have Fedorov...
Surprised that no one has mentioned Bobby Hull or Paul Coffey...
Toe Blake?
Underrated playoff performer would be Thomas Gradin, never had a bad playoff but sadly played for the Canucks most of his career in the 80s..
Ill mention Kurri, Tikkanen and Forsberg to the hottest candidates, Tikkanen being a bit of an outsider on a list like this maybe but I still think that he was one of the best playoff performers even in his older years. Then we have Fedorov...
Surprised that no one has mentioned Bobby Hull or Paul Coffey...
Toe Blake?
Underrated playoff performer would be Thomas Gradin, never had a bad playoff but sadly played for the Canucks most of his career in the 80s..
DisgruntledGoat*
Registered User
- Dec 26, 2010
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- 27
Sakic probably has a spot in the next group of three. Parent as well is a guy I considered.
I haven't thought about it enough to figure it out exactly. But the ones I mentioned are the slam dunks.
1. Gretzky
- holds just about every playoff record -- single period, single game, single season and, of course, career
- highest PPG average in a season and also a career
- has the top 4 PPG average playoff seasons ever (min 9 games played)
- has 4 of the top 5 playoff scoring seasons of all time, including the top one
- 4 Cups
- 2 Conn Smythes (could have had 3 or 4 quite easily....remember 1984?)
- 10 playoff hat tricks (the most ever)
- best game 7 performance ever in any sport (according to ESPN)
2. Patrick Roy
- 4 Cups, split between two different teams
- a record 3 Conn Smythes
- a record 151 playoff wins
- single handedly won the Cup in 1993
3.......
- holds just about every playoff record -- single period, single game, single season and, of course, career
- highest PPG average in a season and also a career
- has the top 4 PPG average playoff seasons ever (min 9 games played)
- has 4 of the top 5 playoff scoring seasons of all time, including the top one
- 4 Cups
- 2 Conn Smythes (could have had 3 or 4 quite easily....remember 1984?)
- 10 playoff hat tricks (the most ever)
- best game 7 performance ever in any sport (according to ESPN)
2. Patrick Roy
- 4 Cups, split between two different teams
- a record 3 Conn Smythes
- a record 151 playoff wins
- single handedly won the Cup in 1993
3.......
Personally, I’d keep goalies separate from skaters.
Skaters:
Wayne Gretzky
Maurice Richard
Gordie Howe
Jean Beliveau
Bobby Orr
Joe Sakic
Mark Messier
Mario Lemieux
Nik Lidstrom
Mike Bossy
Goalies:
Patrick Roy
Dominik Hasek
Ken Dryden
Bernie Parent
Jacques Plante
Turk Broda
Terry Sawchuk
Johnny Bower
Martin Brodeur
Billy Smith
Skaters:
Wayne Gretzky
Maurice Richard
Gordie Howe
Jean Beliveau
Bobby Orr
Joe Sakic
Mark Messier
Mario Lemieux
Nik Lidstrom
Mike Bossy
Goalies:
Patrick Roy
Dominik Hasek
Ken Dryden
Bernie Parent
Jacques Plante
Turk Broda
Terry Sawchuk
Johnny Bower
Martin Brodeur
Billy Smith
vadim sharifijanov
Registered User
- Oct 10, 2007
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Pominville Knows
Registered User
Yes he sure does, but i think we're mostly interested about guys not playing on those Edmonton teams occupying most spots on the all time points list.
Take a guy like Claude Lemieux, and why not Martin St. Louis who has had a shortened carrer but has been consistantly excellent while in the playoffs. Hard to swallow that Hockey Canada has been saying no to a winner like that.
quoipourquoi
Goaltender
Whenever we do this evaluation (and I think we did it a month ago), I find it hard to separate performance and performance elevated from regular season expectations. Some of the elites don't necessarily see their stock rise in a playoff evaluation the same way a Claude Lemieux does - of the top-15 scorers of all-time, only Mark Messier sees his point-per-game production increase in the post-season (and this was true even prior to his post-1997 regular season adventures).
Gretzky and Roy are the clear #1 and #2 to me.
Richard and Messier seem like no-brainers for top-10, and arguably top-5.
Orr, Lemieux, Beliveau, and Howe should be at least top-10.
Maybe Dryden and Kennedy to round it off, with respect to Parent and Forsberg.
Gretzky and Roy are the clear #1 and #2 to me.
Richard and Messier seem like no-brainers for top-10, and arguably top-5.
Orr, Lemieux, Beliveau, and Howe should be at least top-10.
Maybe Dryden and Kennedy to round it off, with respect to Parent and Forsberg.
I thought the question was, "Top 10 of all time", no? As for guys from "those Edmonton teams" occupying most of the spots on the all time points list, most of my points under Gretzky were not for "all time points". I was talking mostly about single seasons, and I even narrowed it down to games. It just so happens that when you have enough amazing single performances, they all add up to the best career. It isn't the other way around, unfortunately. Otherwise, Howe would have all the records.
Pominville Knows
Registered User
Yes i understand that and that Gretzky fits the bill there is no doubt about, but whenever i look at the all time stats there it's a thumb in the eye the kind of era and surrounding advantage those players had statistically as a group.
quoipourquoi
Goaltender
Not a single euro has been mentioned
The problem here, and I've said this before, is that the European players that might be fighting for a top-10 spot played in the same generation as Gretzky, Roy, Messier, and Lemieux, so if we try to shoehorn Kurri or Forsberg onto the top-10 list, we're saying that the 25-year period from the WHA merger to the 2005 lockout contains half of the best playoff performers of all-time. For that reason, I think it's a little unfair to the rest of history to include one of the top Europeans like Kurri and Forsberg or one of the top North Americans of the era like Sakic.
I mean, I get that the introduction of four-rounds gives us a bigger sample size, but that's not really fair to everybody who played before it.
Crease
Chief Justice of the HFNYR Court
- Jul 12, 2004
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With regards to the bolded, I took a fairly crude approach in trying to figure this out. I compiled a list of the top 100 players with the highest playoff ppg (minimum 50 gp). Then compared their playoff ppg to their career regular season ppg. This is a list of the top 20 in terms of elevation:
Jude Drouin | C | 0.94 | 0.68 | 38.24
Steve Payne | LW | 0.99 | 0.76 | 30.26
Craig Simpson | RW/LW | 1.01 | 0.78 | 29.49
Danny Briere | C | 1.01 | 0.78 | 29.49
Claude Giroux | RW | 1.1 | 0.87 | 26.44
David Krejci | C | 0.91 | 0.73 | 24.66
Kevin Stevens | LW | 1.03 | 0.83 | 24.1
Darryl Sutter | LW | 0.84 | 0.69 | 21.74
Brian Leetch* | D | 1.02 | 0.85 | 20
Toe Blake* | LW | 1.07 | 0.91 | 17.58
Mark Messier* | C/LW | 1.25 | 1.07 | 16.82
Martin St. Louis | RW | 1.08 | 0.93 | 16.13
Gregg Sheppard | C/LW | 0.88 | 0.76 | 15.79
Valeri Kamensky | LW | 0.91 | 0.79 | 15.19
Saku Koivu | C | 0.87 | 0.76 | 14.47
Ken Linseman | C | 1.06 | 0.94 | 12.77
Steve Shutt* | LW | 0.99 | 0.88 | 12.5
Dave Gagner | C/LW | 0.84 | 0.76 | 10.53
Paul Reinhart | D | 0.93 | 0.86 | 8.14
Some other notables:
Sergei Fedorov | C/RW | 0.96 | 0.94 | 2.13
Jean Beliveau* | C | 1.09 | 1.08 | 0.93
Bobby Hull* | LW | 1.08 | 1.1 | -1.82
Gordie Howe* | RW | 1.02 | 1.05 | -2.86
Evgeni Malkin | LW/C | 1.17 | 1.22 | -4.1
Wayne Gretzky* | C | 1.84 | 1.92 | -4.17
Peter Forsberg | C | 1.13 | 1.25 | -9.6
Bobby Orr* | D | 1.24 | 1.39 | -10.79
Guy Lafleur* | RW | 1.05 | 1.2 | -12.5
Mario Lemieux* | C/LW | 1.61 | 1.88 | -14.36
Mike Bossy* | RW | 1.24 | 1.5 | -17.33
Steve Yzerman* | LW/C | 0.94 | 1.16 | -18.97
Defensemen only:
Brian Leetch* | D | 1.02 | 0.85 | 20
Paul Reinhart | D | 0.93 | 0.86 | 8.14
Doug Wilson | D | 0.84 | 0.81 | 3.7
Al MacInnis* | D | 0.9 | 0.9 | 0
Paul Coffey* | D | 1.01 | 1.09 | -7.34
Denis Potvin* | D | 0.89 | 0.99 | -10.1
Bobby Orr* | D | 1.24 | 1.39 | -10.79
Raymond Bourque* | D | 0.84 | 0.98 | -14.29
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Fred Taylor
The Cyclone
- Sep 20, 2011
- 3,174
- 31
1. Gretzky
2. Roy
3. Richard
4. Lemieux
5. Orr
6. Beliveau
7. Harvey
8. Forsberg
9. Potvin
10. Lafleur
HM: Messier, Bossy, and Hasek.
2. Roy
3. Richard
4. Lemieux
5. Orr
6. Beliveau
7. Harvey
8. Forsberg
9. Potvin
10. Lafleur
HM: Messier, Bossy, and Hasek.
vadim sharifijanov
Registered User
- Oct 10, 2007
- 28,844
- 16,334
those are mostly the right names, imo.
i'd re-shuffle the order a bit, and replace forsberg altogether, but there's a lot of contenders for that last spot.
my thinking:
roy
richard
gretzky (in my intuitive order, but could go any number of ways on those three)
[gap]
beliveau
[small gap]
orr
mario (orr ahead of mario, he has a third finals)
[gap]
lafleur
potvin
harvey (in any order)
[not much of a gap, if any]
sawchuk, howe, plante, parent, dryden, trots, bossy, sakic, lidstrom. i don't know enough, or really anything, about the pre-red wings dynasty era, but seems like teeder kennedy belongs here too.
for me, forsberg is in the next tier. fedorov too, if we're counting off the best european guys.
BraveCanadian
Registered User
- Jun 30, 2010
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Dennis Bonvie
Registered User
1. Roy
2. Richard
3. Gretzky
4. Lemieux
5. Orr
6. Howe
7. Bossy
8. Lidstrom
9. Plante
10. Beliveau
2. Richard
3. Gretzky
4. Lemieux
5. Orr
6. Howe
7. Bossy
8. Lidstrom
9. Plante
10. Beliveau
Uncle Rotter
Registered User
Here's how they compare in terms of elimination games plus Game 6's:
Joe Sakic 28 13 13 26
Peter Forsberg 21 6 8 14
Either I didn't see this thread or have forgotten it but Foppa was every bit, if not more important, as Sakic and man was he consistent.
It's pretty easy to drop Anderson for him.
I think there is also room for Feds/Potvin/Lidstrom over Mario who was great but it's only 107 GP.
I would go Feds off the top of my head, very consistent just like Foppa was.
a different list of 10 at each of F/D/G would be very interesting.
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