Post-Game Talk: Yay, we suck as bad as the Avs!

TatarTangle

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Sep 28, 2011
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That is a completely unreasonable expectation.

There are plenty of forwards who aren't really "defensive" guys who are valuable parts of the lineup. Mantha is a rookie who is on a 53 point pace and time to grow as a player. He got scratched, had a bad game, and now people are turning on him. I find it to be incredibly short-sighted.
Phil Kessel. Laziest player in recent history, would be welcomed on my team instantly. Why? Guy can score at will. I don't give a rat's butt if he can't play defense, that isn't his job.

People are crazy, it's pack mentality now. Absolutely no reason why Mantha should be thrown under the bus, especially with Blashill driving it.
 

njx9

Registered User
Feb 1, 2016
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Weird that a late season benching and getting knocked around did nothing in the face of the coaching staff's obvious favoritism to less talented players with no real future. Almost like that couldn't have been foreseen.

If the team pushes Mantha out, it's just further proof of how poorly run the entire front office has been over the last ~6 years.

Further, you don't lost to bloody Colorado because the guy tied for third on the team scoring was the only one floating. It's absurd that anyone wants to pin this on Mantha, but I guess it provides a convenient way to ignore how bereft of talent the rest of the roster really is. Which is sort of what happens when you don't draft high, and when you don't hit on your late round picks for the better part of 25 years.
 

AD1066

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Sep 30, 2011
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There are plenty of forwards who aren't really "defensive" guys who are valuable parts of the lineup. Mantha is a rookie who is on a 53 point pace and time to grow as a player. He got scratched, had a bad game, and now people are turning on him. I find it to be incredibly short-sighted.

I don't understand it either. Yes, I'd like to see more engagement from him, but there's a litany of problems with this team and he is far, far down the list.

He's 6th in PPG out of his entire draft class, albeit a 60 game sample. And outside of Burakovsky, none of the other picks in the vicinity have amounted to much so far: Gauthier, Poirer, Shinkaruk, McCarron, Theodore, Dano, Klimchuk, Dickinson, Hartman...

We have a non-existent core, mediocre talent locked up long-term, bloated contracts, Larkin and Mrazek regressing, clueless coaching, a 14 min/night forward with zero goals, etc.-- and the problem is rookie Anthony Mantha?
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
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That is a completely unreasonable expectation.

There are plenty of forwards who aren't really "defensive" guys who are valuable parts of the lineup. Mantha is a rookie who is on a 53 point pace and time to grow as a player. He got scratched, had a bad game, and now people are turning on him. I find it to be incredibly short-sighted.

Pretty much this. A lot of knee-jerk reactions to last night's game. I thought Mantha was solid last night, I liked his decisions with the puck. There's really nothing left to play for at this point, and most of the team is playing like it IMO.
 

Ezekial

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People are turning on him, really?


Just cuz Dotter takes it to extreme doesn't mean everyone does. He had a poor game with the microscope over him, he'll bounce back.



It's comical how "people are turning on him" but a majority of posters are defending him and the way he plays.
 

Heaton

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Feb 13, 2004
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People are turning on him, really?

Just cuz Dotter takes it to extreme doesn't mean everyone does. He had a poor game with the microscope over him, he'll bounce back.

It's comical how "people are turning on him" but a majority of posters are defending him and the way he plays.

It's just a weird dynamic, the Wings organization obviously thinks more highly of Mantha and AA than they do of any other of the players since they get singled out the most. Guys like Abdelkader who just signed a lifetime deal won't hit 25 points and Darren Helm won't hit 20 points, yet they get free passes on production because they 'work hard'. I can find 100 players who work just as hard as them that cost the league minimum.

I have no problem holding Mantha to a standard, I DO have a problem not holding anyone else to a standard because the perception is that they're a hard working player. Working hard without results doesn't mean jack ****.
 

Lazlo Hollyfeld

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Mar 4, 2004
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The Wings now have the fewest ROW in the league with 19.

So with the exception of the shootout there's an argument to be made that we're actually worse than the Avs (and Arizona. And everyone else).
 

ArGarBarGar

What do we want!? Unfair!
Sep 8, 2008
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People are turning on him, really?


Just cuz Dotter takes it to extreme doesn't mean everyone does. He had a poor game with the microscope over him, he'll bounce back.



It's comical how "people are turning on him" but a majority of posters are defending him and the way he plays.

Dotter has an extreme stance, but the person I quoted was Shoalzie who stated he should be learning how to play better defense if he can't score 3-4 goals a night.

I'm not saying the majority are. But I find it concerning that there are people who are.
 

Ezekial

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It's just a weird dynamic, the Wings organization obviously thinks more highly of Mantha and AA than they do of any other of the players since they get singled out the most. Guys like Abdelkader who just signed a lifetime deal won't hit 25 points and Darren Helm won't hit 20 points, yet they get free passes on production because they 'work hard'. I can find 100 players who work just as hard as them that cost the league minimum.

I have no problem holding Mantha to a standard, I DO have a problem not holding anyone else to a standard because the perception is that they're a hard working player. Working hard without results doesn't mean jack ****.

I don't find it all that surprising, talent and tenacity are two different things. Talent can't be taught and Mantha has that in excess. Benching Helm or Abby isn't going to make them more talented players, benching Mantha could help make him more tenacious. I've brought it up a ton, but we saw that with AA, he was benched came out like he never wanted to watch a hockey game again. What we got last night was a tepid Mantha, and it genuinely surprised me - I thought he was going to be the hungriest player out there. I guess that's where the disappointment comes from, he just didn't respond as I thought he would.

I don't think the initial benching was a bad move, I think benching him 2 games was for sure a mistake. One game sends a message but 2 games could be a confidence killer.

Hopefully tonight we see the version of Mantha that should've showed up last night.
 

Run the Jewels

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yeah dudes a bust we should trade him for a late draft pick while we still can before other teams catch on to the fact that he only has 30 even strength points in 51 games as a rookie

Similar to Larkin, looked great on Z's wing and then there was a steep drop off when they got moved to another line.
 

jolly roger

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Aug 4, 2013
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I don't find it all that surprising, talent and tenacity are two different things. Talent can't be taught and Mantha has that in excess. Benching Helm or Abby isn't going to make them more talented players, benching Mantha could help make him more tenacious. I've brought it up a ton, but we saw that with AA, he was benched came out like he never wanted to watch a hockey game again. What we got last night was a tepid Mantha, and it genuinely surprised me - I thought he was going to be the hungriest player out there. I guess that's where the disappointment comes from, he just didn't respond as I thought he would.

I don't think the initial benching was a bad move, I think benching him 2 games was for sure a mistake. One game sends a message but 2 games could be a confidence killer.

Hopefully tonight we see the version of Mantha that should've showed up last night.

I agree with your analysis and I also think that the team has to believe that Blabhill is done after this season. Whether he is or not, getting taught a lesson by Blabhill wouldn't come with any credibility.
It's not like Scotty Bowman teaching you a lesson.
 

Dotter

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Franzen had mental issues. I am starting to wonder if Mantha has deeper issues than we know.

Whatever the case, how he responded last night is unacceptable. If he plays like that again, I will be all for sending him back down to the AHL so he can work it out on a lower level. Maybe he can't handle the pressure of the NHL.
 

Run the Jewels

Make Detroit Great Again
Jun 22, 2006
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I thought Mantha played a poor game.

Yeah, if you actually watched the game he was hesitant and wasn't engaged. He's over thinking everything, so congrats to Jeff Blashill who offered up a ******** quote about how his sitting Mantha is going to turn him into a great player. He'll be in the NHL much longer than Blashill, that's for sure.
 

Lil Sebastian Cossa

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Jul 6, 2012
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The Wings now have the fewest ROW in the league with 19.

So with the exception of the shootout there's an argument to be made that we're actually worse than the Avs (and Arizona. And everyone else).

Aren't we like 18 points up on Colorado? ROW aren't the be-all, end all. Yeah, we're not a good team, but Colorado has been putrid. Sure, they beat us... but we beat Chicago and we are nowhere even in the same zip code as them.
 

Winger98

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Feb 27, 2002
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Yeah, if you actually watched the game he was hesitant and wasn't engaged. He's over thinking everything, so congrats to Jeff Blashill who offered up a ******** quote about how his sitting Mantha is going to turn him into a great player. He'll be in the NHL much longer than Blashill, that's for sure.

Yeah, I thought he looked hesitant and like he was thinking too much, too. For want of a better description I thought he looked lost. When Mantha first moved to the AHL, I thought he seemed to have a transition period of about a season before settling into it and finding his pace. He was productive, but he wasn't impressive. For his first NHL season, I think he's done well, and we'll see him settle in and build off of it next year.

For comparison's sake, Mantha has had a higher PPG this season than Z had in his rookie year. It should be harder to be down on his play this year.
 

njx9

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Feb 1, 2016
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Don't worry guys!!! Lashoff has just been called up!!!

Ugh, why? Is someone hurt, or is it just really critical to make sure that a non-NHL player with no future gets some more reps at the expense of guys who might still have something to learn or some room to grow?

Or, trying to be less pessimistic, does this have something to do with sending someone down for the AHL playoffs in Lashoff's place?
 

HIFE

Registered User
May 10, 2011
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Reading Mantha's name this morning is bizarre. He played about the same as the last 50 games, albeit without Zetterberg. There are 20 other players who had their usual cringe-worthy performances, no talk of them? How about the sloth Abdelkader, how many shots did he have? Darren Helm had his normal 10 shots deflected off of opponents sticks that's for sure. Nielsen, Tatar, Nyquist, as quiet as an empty room.

Larkin takes the cake though. Such a stupid and immature player he's shown himself to be. It's hard to watch him anymore. The idiotic pass attempts, turnovers, giveaways, deflected shots, lost battles, ugh it's depressing. His play is further evidence of how deep a pit Detroit has dug without a hope to get out for a long, long time.
 

ColdToiletSeats

Registered User
Jul 10, 2006
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So.. we beat the Pens, Hawks, and Caps.. but lose to worst team by far in the NHL this season lol

That has to be the biggest throw ever, no doubt in my mind they want that 1 round overall. I don't blame them either we need a Matthews or Laine.
 

Bench

3 is a good start
Aug 14, 2011
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Aren't we like 18 points up on Colorado? ROW aren't the be-all, end all. Yeah, we're not a good team, but Colorado has been putrid. Sure, they beat us... but we beat Chicago and we are nowhere even in the same zip code as them.

Detroit's perfect 7-0 shootout record accounts for 14 points.

And ROW absolutely is the best metric of a team that wins points that matter. Shootout skills don't mean anything in the playoffs.
 

Retire91

Stevey Y you our Guy
May 31, 2010
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So does this mean the rivalry is renewed?

Just curious of Kronwall's knees are starting to affect him more here?

I hurt my knee on a climbing wall the other day and honestly my first thought was how do Kronner and Erickson play like this lol
 
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Retire91

Stevey Y you our Guy
May 31, 2010
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I can't wait until Mantha hits UFA and leaves this team and becomes a 40 goal scorer with proper use on a decent team. And I hope AA follows him.

This team and it's fans deserve exactly that.

Haha what, we don't deserve that. Management does but not us :D
 

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