Proposal: Would you trade McDavid for Eichel and Taylor Hall?

[Zip15]

there's 2 whole other zones that are involved in hockey.

I'm sure you wouldn't want Kane for the same reasons. This is the part where you try to draw a distinction between the two even though they had very similar numbers through their first four seasons.

You switch Kane and Hall and Kane is a selfish, me-first loser, while Hall is the high scoring, clutch winger.

 

[Jame]

I'm sure you wouldn't want Kane for the same reasons. This is the part where you try to draw a distinction between the two even though they had very similar numbers through their first four seasons.

You switch Kane and Hall and Kane is a selfish, me-first loser, while Hall is the high scoring, clutch winger.

Lazy

 

[Paxon]

My sincere hope is that this conversation lasts all the way through the draft, regardless of whether we get the #1 pick or not.

 

[Zip15]

Lazy

What's lazy is the baseless smear job people are trying to put on Hall to justify saying no to a trade that'd be a lopsided win for us.

 

[Jame]

What's lazy is the baseless smear job people are trying to put on Hall to justify saying no to a trade that'd be a lopsided win for us.

There nothing baseless about my personal observations, what's consistent is your disregard for those types of observations

But feel free to use Derek roy's point totals over a particular period of time, while dismissing my position

 

[BakedBuffalo]

"I haven't watched these guys, but i've read a lot about them, and want to yell about anyone who has their own opinion"

I've likely seen McDavid and Eichel more than you have.

 

[Zip15]

There nothing baseless about my personal observations, what's consistent is your disregard for those types of observations

But feel free to use Derek roy's point totals over a particular period of time, while dismissing my position

What does Derek Roy have to do with this? I like how desperate you're getting to paint Hall as the type of player we couldn't use. You're trying to use all the buzz words that make Sabres fans quiver: selfish, Derek Roy, etc. It's so transparent.

Eichel and Hall make this team better, short term and long term, than McDavid.

 

[Jame]

What does Derek Roy have to do with this? I like how desperate you're getting to paint Hall as the type of player we couldn't use. You're trying to use all the buzz words that make Sabres fans quiver: selfish, Derek Roy, etc. It's so transparent.

Eichel and Hall make this team better, short term and long term, than McDavid.

I'm not using Derek Roy in comparison to Hall, im using it as an example of your dismissal of non-stat components of a players game and make up...things I find very important to player analysis and obviously team success

I'd rather miss out on good player by making that type of assessment and being wrong, than not make that type of assessment at all.

 

[Zip15]

ICYMI, the thread on the polls page was closed down because the poll was so lopsided. Final tally: 84%-16% in favor of doing the trade for the team getting Eichel/Hall.

 

[Jame]

I've likely seen McDavid and Eichel more than you have.

I know you have.

 

[BakedBuffalo]

It's just making a simple situation more complex than it has to be: McDavid is obviously the better prospect, no one denies that. They are still both projected to be franchise players. I'd rather have 2 elite players than 1. (in case it's unclear, 1 is more than 2). This talk that McDavid will make any winger amazing.. perhaps, but why can't Eichel? (Also a franchise prospect) Toews makes his wingers better, and he isn't the best center in the league.

 

[Jame]

It's just making a simple situation more complex than it has to be: McDavid is obviously the better prospect, no one denies that. They are still both projected to be franchise players. I'd rather have 2 elite players than 1. (in case it's unclear, 1 is more than 2). This talk that McDavid will make any winger amazing.. perhaps, but why can't Eichel? (Also a franchise prospect) Toews makes his wingers better, and he isn't the best center in the league.

It's so easy, anyone can do it!

 

[CatsforReinhart]

i posted this before, and should've included this time... im not making a direct comparison of eichel to tavares, just the level of impact. Tavares is a damn good franchise center was the point

That was not what I meant.

If McDavid is number one and Eichel number two then Crosby "in prime" would be one and perhaps Malkin or Ovechkin "in prime" would be number two since that is how your comparison works.

 

[Jame]

That was not what I meant.

If McDavid is number one and Eichel number two then Crosby "in prime" would be one and perhaps Malkin or Ovechkin "in prime" would be number two since that is how your comparison works.

There is a "likelihood to reach ceiling" component.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Guys, debate the post not the poster.

 

[vcv]

I want the guy that has a chance to be the best player of my generation. I'm willing to turn down excellent value if my forward depth can handle it.

Whether or not the Sabres forward depth will be good enough in a few years is certainly highly debatable.

tl;dr best player, generational, yes plz.

 

[shelf]

why do people keep bringing up having to re-sign Hall in a couple years. Hall is signed for 6 million for 5 years after this season is up. That is a great deal. If you are looking at free agency the best you are gonna find is a 50-ish point for 6 million.

 

[Zman5778]

why do people keep bringing up having to re-sign Hall in a couple years. Hall is signed for 6 million for 5 years after this season is up.

RIP Capgeek.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

McDavid
I'll take the best chance at the best player of this generation since Crosby.

McDavid vs Eichel
They're in a tier above Hannafin, but if Eichel is a bacon and 3 cheese macaroni casserole then McDavid is the delicious slightly burnt and crispy corners that everyone fights over. To put it another way, I think the next decade will have a handful of Eichels (3 or 4), but if we are all really lucky there might be 1 other McDavid. There's Crosby and there's the rest of the league.

The need for a top line winger
McDavid turns any top 6 winger he plays with into a top 3 winger.

The need for elite level forward depth
Agree, would be great to have another top 30 player in the top 6. What I really want is to have him on a different line driving a true multi-line threat. What I don't agree with is that Hall + Reinhart pushes that multi-line threat to anyplace particularly special compared to Reinhart + something else. Hall's game to game impact doesn't impress me in a way that I think, this type of player is not attainable in any other way. If you want a player like Hall, I think we can get him with either a 2016 1st at the draft, or with the 2016 1st in a trade.

McDavid vs Eichel + Hall
The value is there and I don't think it's an arguable point. The arguable point is whether it's worth giving up the best player for that value. What's the value of knowing that on any given night you have the best player on the ice? From a selfish perspective, what's the value of having that player as a Buffalonian? Even if he doesn't become the next Jim Kelly he will be a Sabre and the Sabres are Buffalo's so by extension I get to strut that around every airport I fly through.

The team
If I'm trading McDavid, the only check box on my list is "does this trade take the team to a level that they cannot achieve in any other way?" I don't believe it does. I believe that getting a Hall type player is not something that we won't be able to do in any other way. Following the 2015 draft we will have 2 seasons that, up until it's demonstrated that the Sabres won't be drafting top 5, will have 1st rounders with immense value. With the new draft rules they will probably both be lotto tickets of more value then the pick we got for Vanek. There's enough depth in the prospect pool that combined with those picks we can find our way into another top 6 forward. Heck if Edm fails to get in on the McEichel dealings we may be able snag Hall anyway.

 

[Dzoniy]

Don't like Hall and i think that McDavid will be better than Eichel, but it was still easy YES from me. In a few years:

Hall-Eichel-XXXX
Girgensons-Reinhart-XXXX
Moulson-Grigorenko-Ennis

With Armia,Fasching,UFA/trade, or someone from prospect pool at RW's. Why not?

 

[joshjull]

why do people keep bringing up having to re-sign Hall in a couple years. Hall is signed for 6 million for 5 years after this season is up. That is a great deal. If you are looking at free agency the best you are gonna find is a 50-ish point for 6 million.

Because they (Including myself) were probably looking at NHLnumbers which only projects out 3 years. Whereas http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=edm projects out the full length of contracts.

And you're correct that Hall signed for another 5yrs at 6mil is great deal.

It greatly diminishes the argument that re-signing him will be an issue since his contract doesn't expire at the same time as Eichel's ELC does. It would still have 2 years left.

 

[BakedBuffalo]

McDavid
I'll take the best chance at the best player of this generation since Crosby.

McDavid vs Eichel
They're in a tier above Hannafin, but if Eichel is a bacon and 3 cheese macaroni casserole then McDavid is the delicious slightly burnt and crispy corners that everyone fights over. To put it another way, I think the next decade will have a handful of Eichels (3 or 4), but if we are all really lucky there might be 1 other McDavid. There's Crosby and there's the rest of the league.

The need for a top line winger
McDavid turns any top 6 winger he plays with into a top 3 winger.

The need for elite level forward depth
Agree, would be great to have another top 30 player in the top 6. What I really want is to have him on a different line driving a true multi-line threat. What I don't agree with is that Hall + Reinhart pushes that multi-line threat to anyplace particularly special compared to Reinhart + something else. Hall's game to game impact doesn't impress me in a way that I think, this type of player is not attainable in any other way. If you want a player like Hall, I think we can get him with either a 2016 1st at the draft, or with the 2016 1st in a trade.

McDavid vs Eichel + Hall
The value is there and I don't think it's an arguable point. The arguable point is whether it's worth giving up the best player for that value. What's the value of knowing that on any given night you have the best player on the ice? From a selfish perspective, what's the value of having that player as a Buffalonian? Even if he doesn't become the next Jim Kelly he will be a Sabre and the Sabres are Buffalo's so by extension I get to strut that around every airport I fly through.

The team
If I'm trading McDavid, the only check box on my list is "does this trade take the team to a level that they cannot achieve in any other way?" I don't believe it does. I believe that getting a Hall type player is not something that we won't be able to do in any other way. Following the 2015 draft we will have 2 seasons that, up until it's demonstrated that the Sabres won't be drafting top 5, will have 1st rounders with immense value. With the new draft rules they will probably both be lotto tickets of more value then the pick we got for Vanek. There's enough depth in the prospect pool that combined with those picks we can find our way into another top 6 forward. Heck if Edm fails to get in on the McEichel dealings we may be able snag Hall anyway.

I'm genuinely curious, if McDavid can, why can't Eichel? They're both franchise prospects.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

http://stats.nhlnumbers.com/teams/BUF?year=2015

At the top of the player list there is a medium gray bar that includes years past and an "expand" button which then shows nine years out. The font size is small so it's easy to miss.

Why so much debate over a fantasy trade scenario that will never happen? Slow week I guess.

 

[joshjull]

http://stats.nhlnumbers.com/teams/BUF?year=2015

At the top of the player list there is a medium gray bar that includes years past and an "expand" button which then shows nine years out. The font size is small so it's easy to miss.

Why so much debate over a fantasy trade scenario that will never happen? Slow week I guess.

Week? Try season

 

[BakedBuffalo]

Week? Try season

Yea, I think we're all slowly going mad from this season