Confirmed with Link: Wings out of the bidding for Lecavalier, according to Khan (post #743)

[BF3]

I dont understand how anyone can possibly feel calle jarnkrok will be a better AND more productive NHL player then vinny lecavalier in the next five years.

the chances any of our prospects turn into an art ross, hart trophy winner are almost ziltch at best and even if one should AND it be in the next five years well then at that point you can move vinny all you want out of the way in any one of numerous ways

but given its been 7 years now for filppula and he is still nowehere near the player vinny is and he is demanding 5 plus million a season it should give you all the info you need to have to know not offering five year at 5 million to vinny is a huge mistake under the presumption some non-nhl ready mid rd draft pick, with half the size and half the pedigree as vinny will be better, more productive and better suited for the 2nd line centre duties anytime soon

when does it stop?

We are getting 2013 Vinny, not 2006 Vinny. I don't think any prospects or Vinny is going to do what you are describing.

 

[SportsballChic]

Personally, I would have supported 3 years, 19.5M.

I think with the likelihood that Datsyuk and Zetterberg have both lost a step or two within two years time, we simply can't sign a big name forward of Vinny's age/production curve, for 5 years.

But I do like to play Devil's advocate:
5 year means Vinny is finished at 38.
Datsyuk will be 39 when his deal is done.

In before someone reminds you Vinny hit the NHL at 18 while Pavel didn't until he was 23. Plus, something something about Datsyuk not getting lined up and drilled much b/c he's so shifty and that increasing his longevity.

 

[Nemesis Prime]

5 year deal wouldn't have been bad.

Surely he couldn't be as bad at 38 as Cleary is now.

 

[JmanWingsFan]

Do people not realize the logjam at center/forward we have in Grand Rapids, and the problems signing Vinny for 5 years that escalate because of this?

 

[bababooeyII]

2013 Vinny is still way better than anything we currently have, and probably will be for the next few years. Aren't the Wings always lamenting how they'd like to get bigger but "those guys don't grow on tress"? well here is their chance to grab one for free

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

We are getting 2013 Vinny, not 2006 Vinny. I don't think any prospects or Vinny is going to do what you are describing.

i know that, 2013-2014 DRW vinny would easily put up 55-65pts and be a big bodied cup winning centremen

the chances any of our prospects turn into that anytime in the next 5 years is minimal at best, i hope one does, but that talk is only for when it happens not for well before it does

 

[bababooeyII]

Do people not realize the logjam at center/forward we have in Grand Rapids, and the problems signing Vinny for 5 years that escalate because of this?

Which prospect or forward will be better than Vinny in 2yrs, 3yrs even? and if one happens to be, well you now have options, what's wrong with that? what a great problem to have

 

[mindfly]

Do people not realize the logjam at center/forward we have in Grand Rapids, and the problems signing Vinny for 5 years that escalate because of this?

The problem is though....
....KH doesn't intend to give those center/forwards playing time anytime soon, why would he change this season compared to the last few?

 

[BF3]

But I do like to play Devil's advocate:
5 year means Vinny is finished at 38.
Datsyuk will be 39 when his deal is done.

Mostly agree with everything else you said, but Vinny started in the NHL ...

In before someone reminds you Vinny hit the NHL at 18 while Pavel didn't until he was 23. Plus, something something about Datsyuk not getting lined up and drilled much b/c he's so shifty and that increasing his longevity.

DAMN IT. Well, I wasn't going to say the second part.

Yes, the last year of Datsyuk's deal may not be the best performance to money spend, but then again, Datsyuk is Datsyuk. He's ours.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Do people not realize the logjam at center/forward we have in Grand Rapids, and the problems signing Vinny for 5 years that escalate because of this?

how many of them can you GUARNTEE will be better then Vinny?

how many have we produced in the last 6 or 7 years that are better then vinny today? zero?

IF(thats a big if) that day were to come then you worry about it then not beforehand

 

[ScottyBowman]

Do people not realize the logjam at center/forward we have in Grand Rapids, and the problems signing Vinny for 5 years that escalate because of this?

Vinny is an improvement over the likes of Cleary, Eaves, Emmerton, Bertuzzi, Tootoo, Samuellson, Abdelkader, Miller, Brunner, etc... Datsyuk and Zetterberg aren't getting any young either.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Amen. He would offer Stamkos 3 years 9 mil contract. The Red Wings are so damn cheap. Gone are the old days when money fell out of the sky, the current management is turning into some small market team down south.

We just signed Datsyuk to a contract he's going to have a hard time living up to.
We've got Zetterberg and Franzen and Kronwall signed until they are 40.

We sign our guys. <--- and that's OK.
But we sign them until forever. <----- and that's OK too.

The problem is, we also spend a lot of money on mediocre players and refuse to relinquish positions to cheap youngsters until there are no other choices <----- And for about 5 years now, I've been telling you that this is ****ed up.

In the cap era, you can only spend so much on depth players.
'
The Wings continually try to get deals from stars so they can overpay mediocre players.

Maybe that's not the plan. But that's the result.

And bringing back Miller and Samuelsson and Bertuzzi and Quincey and talking about Cleary --- while balking at Semin and Lecavalier --- that's just not good management

 

[RedWingsNow*]

In before someone reminds you Vinny hit the NHL at 18 while Pavel didn't until he was 23. Plus, something something about Datsyuk not getting lined up and drilled much b/c he's so shifty and that increasing his longevity.

Doesn't matter.
Datsyuk didn't spend those 5 years sitting on a beach. He spent those years playing hockey - and I'm pretty sure he suffered a couple or semi-serious injuries during those years

 

[SportsballChic]

Doesn't matter.
Datsyuk didn't spend those 5 years sitting on a beach. He spent those years playing hockey - and I'm pretty sure he suffered a couple or semi-serious injuries during those years

I won't claim to be a doctor but I suspect Dats right *now* is in better physical condition than Vinny; which is sort of the point.

That having been said, I won't argue it into oblivion. I wanted Larionov gone forever and Datsyuk projects to age much the same way. *shrug*

Edit: and before anyone says "why, because they're both Russian?": no. It's because the hands never go, the accuracy never goes, the vision never goes. What goes, and goes FAST might I add is burst, speed and shot velocity. In that regard, Larionov and Datsyuk can be projected to age similarly. Although that scares the crap out of me because I remember watching Larionov "skate" at 39.....

 

[Vladdy84]

What logjam in Grand Rapids at Center? Jarnkrok then..... a couple guys who are bottom 6'ers at the next level.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Do people not realize the logjam at center/forward we have in Grand Rapids, and the problems signing Vinny for 5 years that escalate because of this?

Not that hard to work around. You could put Helm and Andersson at Wing-- after a couple years Vinny would have to be a winger.
None of those guys are going to be 2nd line center anytime soon.


13-14 Datsyuk/Lecavalier/Helm/Andersson
14-15 Datsyuk/Lecavailier/Helm/Jarnkrok
15-16 Datsyuk/Lecavalier/Jarnkrok/ Sheahan
16-17 Datsyuk/Jarnkrok/Sheahan/Whoever
17-18 Zetterberg/Janrrok/Sheahan/Whoever

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Which prospect or forward will be better than Vinny in 2yrs, 3yrs even? and if one happens to be, well you now have options, what's wrong with that? what a great problem to have

and what if Vinny wants a NMC or something like that? That's not such a great problem to have.

 

[lilidk]

We should trust Holland .He knows something we don't know . There is a reason why Tampa don't wont him and there is connection between to franchises. He probably looking for cheaper power forward

 

[odin1981]

Do people not realize the logjam at center/forward we have in Grand Rapids, and the problems signing Vinny for 5 years that escalate because of this?

Do you understand that outside of ironhook we have no center that even shows a iota of 2nd line center playability let alone top line center acumen?

Do you also understand that as of right now that ironhook might actually only be ready for a nd line center role in maybe 2.5-3 years?

Outside of him we have jack **** in the top 6 capable department.

 

[Vladdy84]

We should trust Holland .He knows something we don't know . There is a reason why Tampa don't wont him and there is connection between to franchises. He probably looking for cheaper power forward

Like?

 

[Gyldenlove]

We just signed Datsyuk to a contract he's going to have a hard time living up to.
We've got Zetterberg and Franzen and Kronwall signed until they are 40.

We sign our guys. <--- and that's OK.
But we sign them until forever. <----- and that's OK too.

The problem is, we also spend a lot of money on mediocre players and refuse to relinquish positions to cheap youngsters until there are no other choices <----- And for about 5 years now, I've been telling you that this is ****ed up.

In the cap era, you can only spend so much on depth players.
'
The Wings continually try to get deals from stars so they can overpay mediocre players.

Maybe that's not the plan. But that's the result.

And bringing back Miller and Samuelsson and Bertuzzi and Quincey and talking about Cleary --- while balking at Semin and Lecavalier --- that's just not good management

A lot of teams do this. Look at Ryan Mallone, Bickell, Bolland, Brent Burns etc.

The problem with giving money and term is that you end up not being able to resign your own players or having to send away pieces you need for peanuts. Look at the Blackhawks, they have 1 center on the roster. You either have a balanced team, play moneyball and try to have a lot of players make 2-4 million per year or you have the Penguins with a few players making a ton and a lot of players making minimum wage. Right now there seems to be no clear indication that going one way is superior to the other, and given the problems you can end up in by giving money and term the risk is certainly less by taking a lot of players on middling contracts and shorter terms.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Poor Vinny I suppose he will be happy and content playing for another team like Dallas that will never win a cup in a 5 year period while he's there. I guess the money is more important to him then playing for a winner.

 

[InjuredChoker]

Poor Vinny I suppose he will be happy and content playing for another team like Dallas that will never win a cup in a 5 year period while he's there. I guess the money is more important to him then playing for a winner.

With Nill on board, Dallas could very well win the cup in next 5 years.

Montreal has pretty good chance too, STL..

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Poor Vinny I suppose he will be happy and content playing for another team like Dallas that will never win a cup in a 5 year period while he's there. I guess the money is more important to him then playing for a winner.

Dallas isn't that bad, they have some nice pieces graduating from the minors. Their biggest weakness is up the middle and this is a big answer for them. They could also chase Stastny should he become available, they start to look like an entirely different team. Keep in mind that division should be the weakest in hockey for the next couple years. Although there will be a monster sitting at the top of it in Chicago.

 

[Bench]

With Nill on board, Dallas could very well win the cup in next 5 years.

Go tell Dallas fans that to make them feel better. They don't have a #1 or #2 center right now, or a #1 defender, so they could use the pep talk.