Why is Mike Babcock being made the scapegoat for the Maple Leaf's problems?

[gabeliscious]

Babcock is the type of coach that NEEDS the players to buy into his system and style. He needs everyone to be on the same page. That being said, as someone who's favorite team has been coached by him, I'm in the camp of his style just isn't right for today's hockey.

is it not that coaches responsibility to get the players to buy in.

i think the source of frustration is his inability to be agile on the roster and put people and the team in positions to succeed.

 

[Kranix]

He cursed himself by scratching Spezza on opening night. The curse of Spezza.

 

[Pilky01]

Because you can't fire 30 players.

 

[Nizdizzle]

is it not that coaches responsibility to get the players to buy in.

i think the source of frustration is his inability to be agile on the roster and put people and the team in positions to succeed.

I mean, it kinda is.

 

[Hammettf2b]

is it not that coaches responsibility to get the players to buy in.

i think the source of frustration is his inability to be agile on the roster and put people and the team in positions to succeed.

It depends of why the players aren't buying in imo. Are the players being primadonnas or do they just don't believe in what the coach is doing. In the end though it doesn't matter, the coach will need to be replaced regardless as to why the players aren't buying in.

 

[Sniper99]

Mike Babcock’s tenure nearly ended last spring. Another first-round exit will seal the deal | The Star

If you need "evidence" beyond reporter sources, then you couldn't report anything.

The same Feschuk that went behind managements back and called Kessel's mom for a status update on Kessel I believe it was?

No thanks.

 

[bobholly39]

Because you can't fire 30 players.

Its that simple really. Welcome to professional sports. Its easier to do a coaching change than complete roster overhaul

 

[shaner8989]

Zach Hyman got more ice time then Matthews
Hyman hasn't played hockey in 6 months

f***ing MORON

 

[MLSE]

I mean the team itself might be a problem but I've noticed the last couple years plus this year that Mike Babcock does what I describe as, trying to put square pegs through circle holes.

Never ever, ever... adjusts... Just seems to jam harder.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Rule 1: Always blame the coach first.

As long as Ive been a fan of sports this has definitely been true among fanbases.

 

[harmonica]

Its that simple really. Welcome to professional sports. Its easier to do a coaching change than complete roster overhaul

Especially when the GM has shown complete incompetence in all facets of his job.

 

[Pilky01]

Especially when the GM has shown complete incompetence in all facets of his job.

Dubas knows what this roster needs.

1 more $11 Million forward.

 

[Dr Pepper]

The same Feschuk that went behind managements back and called Kessel's mom for a status update on Kessel I believe it was?

No thanks.

James Reimer, who was out with a concussion at the time.

Feschuk looked up Mrs. Reimer in the phonebook and got an update on her son.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

You said "most, if not all coaches, do" when one coach did last year - Babcock.

While it is true that the Pens have played Jarry on all 4 back-to-backs this season, it is not the case that most, if not all coaches, do - in fact despite it being early in the season, already Pittsburgh is the only team in their division to do so.




None of the 5 times were early in the season. Good coaches don't play struggling goalies in the second of back-t0-backs.

LA - December 15th
Toronto - February 2nd
Montreal - March 2nd
Boston - March 10th
Philly - March 17th

Okay, fair enough. But it still seems like a cop-out to blame Babcock for the poor efforts shown by the team during those back to back games. Maybe he's not doing the backup goalie any favors, but neither are the players in front of that goalie by not even showing up.

Not every team looks like they don't have a pulse in the second game of a back to back. They may wear down eventually in the third period sometimes, but they don't play all 60 minutes as though they've just ran a marathon. Toronto, for both Hutchinson and Kaskisuo, look like they mail in the game right at the opening faceoff.

Again, I'm not saying Babcock shouldn't be fired. I'm just saying that there's certain things that won't magically go away with him being replaced. One of those things seems to be a consistent work ethic by the players.

 

[SensontheRush]

This is one of those "Boomer" threads. You can even play Bingo with these:

-Young, "unprofessional" team; coach blameless

-inexperienced GM can't properly assess talent

-coach is being made into a scapegoat

-players in general are turning into primadonnas

-Karlsson, Burns and Subban don't actually know how to play defense.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

What a silly thread.

There's generally an order to how things are done when an NHL team is struggling and everyone is searching for answers.

First you fire the coach and see if anything changes
Second you trade some players to see if that helps
If none of that works, you fire the GM and start the cycle over

Not entirely true. The Pens looked like rubbish last season and there was a lot of talk about "should Sullivan be fired?", "do they need a new coach/voice?". Instead, Rutherford overhauled the roster, added more players that play Sullivan's style, and the Pens look better this year than they have since their 2017 Cup team. Had Rutherford fired Sullivan and kept the exact same roster intact, the Pens are probably looking like a disorganized mess again this year.

 

[biotk]

Okay, fair enough. But it still seems like a cop-out to blame Babcock for the poor efforts shown by the team during those back to back games. Maybe he's not doing the backup goalie any favors, but neither are the players in front of that goalie by not even showing up.

Not every team looks like they don't have a pulse in the second game of a back to back. They may wear down eventually in the third period sometimes, but they don't play all 60 minutes as though they've just ran a marathon. Toronto, for both Hutchinson and Kaskisuo, look like they mail in the game right at the opening faceoff.

Again, I'm not saying Babcock shouldn't be fired. I'm just saying that there's certain things that won't magically go away with him being replaced. One of those things seems to be a consistent work ethic by the players.

I agree that the Leafs' show no effort in back to back games - I have been pounding that drum since last December.

But where the blame goes for that is another question. Craig Button was on Landsberg's radio show this morning and he summed up pretty well what happens when players have lost complete confidence in their coach (is he right? I don't know, but I agree with him). He says that they continue to try hard, and tell themselves to try hard, but things just don't work because you don't have any confidence in the coach or the system or the ability to battle back with the coach in charge. So what do you get? A team that looks terrible and comes out flat (the leafs have been scored on first 17 times out of 22 games I believe), that sucks at special teams, and that can't battle back but instead collapses, etc.

I don't think that all of the issues with the team are on the coach. But I don't think that can sort out what those other issues are under this coach. It has been no secret that a chunk of the roster have strongly disliked this coach for a while. Then you start this season with the scratching of Spezza - a player who Babs helped recruit, who signed a league minimum contract, who happily agreed to show up early in the summer to help the Leafs' young players work on faceoffs and positioning, and quickly became loved by his teammates, whose attitude was that he was just happy to be a Leaf and was willing to do anything and everything to help the team, and whose friends and family bought like 30 tickets (in the most expensive building in the league) to watch him play in the home opener for his local team. Babs showed his players on game one that he hadn't changed a bit and that things would continue to be all about Babs.

 

[LeHab]

It depends how they are under performing though, the Leafs biggest on-ice issue is keeping the puck out of their own net, something every non-Leafs fan has been saying for some time, but now with even more poor contracts (their biggest off-ice issue), they lost too much depth and their deficiencies are more obvious now.

Indeed, comes to assessing if the players are actually under performing or perhaps assessment of capabilities is wrong and expectations should be lowered. Seems majority are expecting Leafs to be performing better as a group than we observed for the past year now.

 

[robertmac43]

It's far too easy for Leafs fans and the media to make him the scape goat

 

[Icejoker]

They have 4 top players Reilly,Matthews,Marner and Nylander, then they got Tavares, the problem start when they choose him to Captain the old top four has no confidence for him as captain

 

[Paperbagofglory]

Even Prime Scotty Bowman couldn't do anything with that defense. Also a good backup goalie could earn a few extra wins. They are all in on Anderson and they cant afford a decent back up or decent steady veteran defenseman. Signing Tavares made no sense for this core. They needed that money for a blue line.

 

[LeafGrief]

Not entirely true. The Pens looked like rubbish last season and there was a lot of talk about "should Sullivan be fired?", "do they need a new coach/voice?". Instead, Rutherford overhauled the roster, added more players that play Sullivan's style, and the Pens look better this year than they have since their 2017 Cup team. Had Rutherford fired Sullivan and kept the exact same roster intact, the Pens are probably looking like a disorganized mess again this year.

You're right, it's not entirely true and there are plenty of scenarios where it's best to skip one step or reverse the order a little. Good on Rutherford for sticking with his guy and finding success, by no means do I think that there's a set in stone way of doing things. Perhaps overhauling the Leafs roster and keeping Babcock is the ideal way forward, but I think there's a mountain of evidence against Babcock and he doesn't have anywhere near the level of success with the core players that Sullivan did. There's a real difference between sticking with the guy that won you two cups as recently as two years ago and sticking with a guy who hasn't won squat with your team.

 

[tsujimoto74]

It just seems like a huge organizational failure that the 2 guys at the helm of the team seem to fundamentally disagree about play style/roster construction. You've got a coach whose whole thing, his entire career (this wasn't some secret before Toronto hired him) is playing physical, clutch-and-grab hockey. And then you've got a GM who might not know grit if you slapped him in the face with a piece of sandpaper.

 

[hockeyes]

Yea, no team in the history of the league has ever struggled and then turned things around with a new coach and a fresh approach. Nope, it has to be scapegoating by the totally unique Leafs.

 

[AvroArrow]

Because Hyman is getting more ice time than Matthews. Babcock has no idea how to adjust and use the roster he's given. This thread just seems like an excuse to take shots at the leafs core. Anyone with half a brain that's watched more than 3 leafs games this year can tell you how awful Babcock really is.