Who Wants To See Phil Kessel Play For For The Habs?

[Ohashi_Jouzu*]

I wouldn't. He could put us over the top and he'd be worth the gamble.

How we'd fit him into the salary cap though is another problem altogether. I'd find a way though.

But see, that's where it starts. Proves to be easier said than done without doing more harm than good sometimes.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

But see, that's where it starts. Proves to be easier said than done without doing more harm than good sometimes.

DD and Emelin would be a good place to start...

 

[groovejuice]

Any team other than Toronto and I might actually argue about getting this guy but I hate the idea of helping the Leafs with our picks and prospects. The cap is a whole other mess we'd obviously have to deal with.

I personally still think we need help on the wings more than anywhere.

Then I'd aim for Yakupov as a winger. He'd be relatively cheap, considering his reputation and poor production.

We have McCarron that might very well make the team out of camp, or possibly as a black ace this season, and Scherbak who, like Chucky, might make the team in camp. Our O prospects look better than our D, excluding Tinordi.

We need a solid D. And, honestly, maybe a new D coach. There's an abundance of under-performance.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

DD and Emelin would be a good place to start...

PAP as well. 4.5 right there. Gonchar is a goner, so is Allen too.

I would sign him no problem.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Then I'd aim for Yakupov as a winger. He'd be relatively cheap, considering his reputation and poor production.

We have McCarron that might very well make the team out of camp, or possibly as a black ace this season, and Scherbak who, like Chucky, might make the team in camp. Our O prospects look better than our D, excluding Tinordi.

We need a solid D. And, honestly, maybe a new D coach. There's an abundance of under-performance.

I don't think Yakupov would come cheap. I think Kessel might be even cheaper (trade wise not cap wise) due to his salary. The other thing is that Yakupov is still a bit of a mystery box.

I think you'd be paying more for the lesser player with the hope that he someday becomes the superstar you hope he'll be. With Kessel at least you know what you're getting. At least you'd be getting the younger player with Yakupov though and his best days are definitely ahead of him.

 

[Pricef*]

Kessel would ruin this team. I donèt want him anywhere near this group.

 

[bipolarhabfan]

Yes to his skill, but a big no to his attitude. He is not a Bergevin-type player and will be poison in the dressing room.

 

[RandR]

Yes to his skill, but a big no to his attitude. He is not a Bergevin-type player and will be poison in the dressing room.

A resounding NO from me too, and for basically the same reasons.

The Habs have a good thing going these days; no need to risk that by adding such a selfish player. It wouldn't be worth the price to acquire him anyway.

 

[Kriss E]

You're only looking at one stat also, points for, but you won't look at points against, what good is it if you're on the ice for 100 goals for if you're gonna be on the ice for 115 goals against.. is that productive?? No, yet this is what's happening and you're trying to convince me that this is good...

I put more importance on his production because that's why he's paid to do. He is not paid to be a two way player or defensively responsible. He's paid to help the Leafs win by scoring goals. You can always compensate for a cheating or weaker defensive winger by pairing him with good two way players.
You also assume that Kessel is somehow responsible for that fictitious 115 goals against number. That whatever - is attributed to him is a direct result of his poor defensive game, which is completely naive.

And why did he have a +23 in Boston the one year they actually had a good team? Did he suddenly know how to be defensively responsible and then decided to stop the next years? +/- is a stat that is highly influenced by many different factors. There is no debate about it being a poor stat to measure any type of impact.

If Kessel produced the most points at even strength, then he's got to be the guy that has the most points against at even strength, cause this is how +/- is measured, at even strength, how is this good?? It don't matter what you throw my way with his goals, or assist, or what he did in Boston 5yrs ago, I can come back with the polar opposite and more...and please, don't give me this he just got on the ice when the opposition scored cause he hoped on the ice just as his teammates scored just as often and was credited with a +, it balances itself out at the end of the season. Kessel is a good offensive player, no denying that, better point producer than Gallagher, absolutely, but I'm still opting for Gally, hell, I'd take Dustin Brown over Kessel and Kessel's numbers are much better, wouldn't you??

I'm not quite sure what you are really debating about anymore. Who ever said his +/- is good? Who ever said Kessel was good defensively?
I said his flaws are overrated and every time you give more weight to the +/- rating than his production you're essentially proving my case.
And again, you simply assume Kessel is responsible for every goal scored against while he's on the ice. It's a ridiculous assumption.

I've already compared his +/- with his teammates a few post ago, what, did you already forget?? "you can look at that stat from within the same team" is what you said..ok, here it is...again

The post you quoted of me wasn't directed at you. It was responding to someone who compared players of different teams. So please try to follow.

Kessel's line is combined -29 as of a few days ago, I'm sure it got worse cause they've been shut out 3 out of 4 games
Kadri's line with Winnik and Santorelli (if they're still playing together) is a +16 last time I checked
You can gnaw on that for a while and come up with an excuse as to why Kessel is such a great well rounded hockey player

Nobody ever argued Kessel was a great well rounded player. You can be a terrible two way player and have a positive rating, you can be a great defensive player and still be in the minuses. Your +/- stat is irrelevant. There are too many factors that influence that stat.
Kessel spent about 55% of his ES ice time with JVR and Bozak, yet you cling to that -29 rating. Kadri spent 17% of his total ES time with Santo-Winnik. He's actually currently a -1.
Kessel is a -7 in January and I'm assuming it's mostly because he only has 2pts in 8 games. In Oct-Nov, he was just a -1 in 23 gp, was he better defensively then?

Kessel is usually good for 30 goals+. You're scared of his defensive side, then pair him up with good two way players. That's it. He's not going to make Plekanec into a - player on a top team.

 

[hf27]

I put more importance on his production because that's why he's paid to do. He is not paid to be a two way player or defensively responsible. He's paid to help the Leafs win by scoring goals. You can always compensate for a cheating or weaker defensive winger by pairing him with good two way players.
You also assume that Kessel is somehow responsible for that fictitious 115 goals against number. That whatever - is attributed to him is a direct result of his poor defensive game, which is completely naive.

And why did he have a +23 in Boston the one year they actually had a good team? Did he suddenly know how to be defensively responsible and then decided to stop the next years? +/- is a stat that is highly influenced by many different factors. There is no debate about it being a poor stat to measure any type of impact.


I'm not quite sure what you are really debating about anymore. Who ever said his +/- is good? Who ever said Kessel was good defensively?
I said his flaws are overrated and every time you give more weight to the +/- rating than his production you're essentially proving my case.
And again, you simply assume Kessel is responsible for every goal scored against while he's on the ice. It's a ridiculous assumption.


The post you quoted of me wasn't directed at you. It was responding to someone who compared players of different teams. So please try to follow.



Nobody ever argued Kessel was a great well rounded player. You can be a terrible two way player and have a positive rating, you can be a great defensive player and still be in the minuses. Your +/- stat is irrelevant. There are too many factors that influence that stat.
Kessel spent about 55% of his ES ice time with JVR and Bozak, yet you cling to that -29 rating. Kadri spent 17% of his total ES time with Santo-Winnik. He's actually currently a -1.
Kessel is a -7 in January and I'm assuming it's mostly because he only has 2pts in 8 games. In Oct-Nov, he was just a -1 in 23 gp, was he better defensively then?

Kessel is usually good for 30 goals+. You're scared of his defensive side, then pair him up with good two way players. That's it. He's not going to make Plekanec into a - player on a top team.

Kessel is garbage unless he is paired with a good two way player!? wow

 

[Kriss E]

Kessel is garbage unless he is paired with a good two way player!? wow

No idea how you came to this conclusion from reading my post. I said if you're worried about his defensive game, pair him up with players that are responsible. It is a very common method used.

 

[Jigger77]

Kessel would ruin this team. I donèt want him anywhere near this group.

And you don't have to worry about it happening. I'm no betting man but I'd bet anything on that. Well, almost anything.

 

[Pricef*]

The fact that some here would even consider adding this guy makes me extremely happy that they don't run this team. Further proof they would run it into the ground.

 

[TofoEmptyNt]

Hell no, we don't need the Leafs sloppy seconds. For years we were a soft team, easy to play against. Now we can actually grind down teams and make them uncomfortable. Adding a soft, one dimensional Kessel is not the right direction for us.

Maybe if it was a short term, gun for hire situation for 1-2 years I'd consider it. But Kessel for 8 years at 8 per is a terrible idea for the future of this team. I'd rather reserve that money for future players that we're raising in the organization, who will actually care about the team and play with a team first mentality. Let Kessel cheat for his 80 points elsewhere.

 

[Mr. Hab]

Yes to his skill, but a big no to his attitude. He is not a Bergevin-type player and will be poison in the dressing room.

Let Kessel and Phaneuf continue their great NHL careers in...Toronto.
Why is this thread continuing?! It's a slap to our Bleu, Blanc, Rouge!
Kessel in a Hab jersey...YUCK!!

Only interested in...:
Franson (would have prefered him when value was not high)
JVR (maybe...only if Price is very right)
Lupul (but always injured)

Kessel would ruin this team. I dont want him anywhere near this group.

Exactly...and why would we want Toronto's overpriced/overrated garbage (Kessel, Phaneuf, Clarkson,etc).

I want Kessel and Phaneuf to stay in Toronto for a long long time!

 

[Kriss E]

The fact that some here would even consider adding this guy makes me extremely happy that they don't run this team. Further proof they would run it into the ground.

Only in Montreal do some fans believe adding an 80pt player=running team into the ground.

 

[Pricef*]

Only in Montreal do some fans believe adding an 80pt player=running team into the ground.

Yep. Sure do love his long known history of character

 

[Kriss E]

Yep. Sure do love his long known history of character

Well then please show me this long known history.

 

[axman88]

He can't be coached....

MT can't coach...

PERFECT!

Sign me up!

 

[Beige Van]

Great player, but too much money/term. The key to winning is to grow these players from within so you can get some bang for your buck and have a deep team. Kessel provides lots of bang but also for lots of bucks!

 

[Teufelsdreck]

I don't think Bergevin would trade for Kessel. He'd be too costly in many ways.

 

[jaffy27]

I put more importance on his production because that's why he's paid to do. He is not paid to be a two way player or defensively responsible. He's paid to help the Leafs win by scoring goals. You can always compensate for a cheating or weaker defensive winger by pairing him with good two way players.
You also assume that Kessel is somehow responsible for that fictitious 115 goals against number. That whatever - is attributed to him is a direct result of his poor defensive game, which is completely naive.

And why did he have a +23 in Boston the one year they actually had a good team? Did he suddenly know how to be defensively responsible and then decided to stop the next years? +/- is a stat that is highly influenced by many different factors. There is no debate about it being a poor stat to measure any type of impact.


I'm not quite sure what you are really debating about anymore. Who ever said his +/- is good? Who ever said Kessel was good defensively?
I said his flaws are overrated and every time you give more weight to the +/- rating than his production you're essentially proving my case.
And again, you simply assume Kessel is responsible for every goal scored against while he's on the ice. It's a ridiculous assumption.


The post you quoted of me wasn't directed at you. It was responding to someone who compared players of different teams. So please try to follow.



Nobody ever argued Kessel was a great well rounded player. You can be a terrible two way player and have a positive rating, you can be a great defensive player and still be in the minuses. Your +/- stat is irrelevant. There are too many factors that influence that stat.
Kessel spent about 55% of his ES ice time with JVR and Bozak, yet you cling to that -29 rating. Kadri spent 17% of his total ES time with Santo-Winnik. He's actually currently a -1.
Kessel is a -7 in January and I'm assuming it's mostly because he only has 2pts in 8 games. In Oct-Nov, he was just a -1 in 23 gp, was he better defensively then?

Kessel is usually good for 30 goals+. You're scared of his defensive side,then pair him up with good two way players. That's it. He's not going to make Plekanec into a - player on a top team.

Man, you're just as stubborn as Kessel, he probably thinks the same way you do, "I get paid to score, not to play well defensively, not my problem if we get scored against, I get paid to score goals", yup, this is truly the way to build a championship team, commitment to one side of the ice. Sure L.A and Chicago are loaded with these type of players, ready to trade for them at a moments notice!
Damn right I'm scared of his defensive side, he has none, well documented too, this is not how you win in the playoffs and you know it. And about that Boston quote, are you really going to believe Jonathan Cheechoo is a 50 goal scorer because he scored 50 once in his lifetime?? Kessel's +23 was a fluke, just like Cheechoo's 50 goals
About that quote that wasn't directed at me, Ya, I knew that already, I can read the replies and who they are directed at thank you, just trying to point out the facts to you since I Know you read my posts, you told someone +/- can only be measured from the same team, when a few posts earlier I had mentioned the +/- of 2 different lines on the same team and Kessel's was much worst than any other combination on the team. Thank you for Bringing my facts to the forefront.
The only +/- I cling to is Kessel's -50 career stat, he doesn't win you games, he loses you games, it's not the fregging Edmonton Oilers we're talking about here, it's not Dallas Eakins coaching, it's Ron Wilson and Carlyle man, guys who have had success in the postseason. Guys that can implement a system but when your primary offensive threat doesn't buy in, well, you see where the Leafs are now, and both coaches are out of a job. Is it entirely Kessel's fault, no...is he partly responsible....yyyyessss!
Keep Kessel, I'm keeping Gallagher thank you, cause that's the real debate here isn't it!

 

[jaffy27]

Well then please show me this long known history.

He already did....don't you get it, there is none!!!!!

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

Wouldn't take Kessel for free cause it would mean parting with someone really good to make cap space for him for a long time and if he acts like a 10 yr old brat in TO can't imagine what Montreal pressure would do to him, would be Scotty Gomez 2.0 but at least Scotty was likeable if not productive

 

[jaffy27]

Wouldn't take Kessel for free cause it would mean parting with someone really good to make cap space for him for a long time and if he acts like a 10 yr old brat in TO can't imagine what Montreal pressure would do to him, would be Scotty Gomez 2.0 but at least Scotty was likeable if not productive

It would be such a side show...if you're gonna get an 8million dollar player, get something better then that jerk, character and team chemistry is something huge in hockey, don't think Kessel is uhhhh....that type.