News Article: Who tracks the game for us like Dubas does now for Leafs?

[operasen]

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=457789

Interesting hire. Articles talks a little about the "new" system of GMing a team. Chicago, Los Angeles, now Leafs are doing it.

Who does this for us? With 2 asst GMs, does one look after this aspect?

Do we need this type of system implemented? One that finds "value" in using advanced statistics.

Click to read more...

 

[BonkTastic]

AFAIK, it used to be Tim, then that job went to Dorion... though with Bryan's health, we seem to be running on a skeleton crew as far as upper management is concerned at he moment. I wouldn't be surprised to see another head office hire before the season starts, pending Murray's decision on how involved he plans on being, and what his timetable looks like.

 

[Mr Invidious]

I really wish we could have just swooped in and hired Dubas.

Lifelong Sens fan.

 

[Senator Stanley]

Unless there's a "real hard worker" statistic, I don't see our front office having much use for this stuff.

 

[BonkTastic]

Unless there's a "real hard worker" statistic, I don't see our front office having much use for this stuff.

Disagree, in fact, I think it's the opposite.

Our front office seems to be all about wins-per-dollar. Seems like it should be right up our alley.

 

[Quo]

I really wonder what Don Boyd's role in the organization is. That's a lot of experience just hanging around. 'Scouting Consultant' is fairly ambiguous.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I really wish we could have just swooped in and hired Dubas.

Lifelong Sens fan.

Maybe he is working for us. Secret double agent; taking the Leafs down from the inside.

 

[Upgrayedd]

As per the sens model they have had a guy doing this for years, Yost! I mean why pay for those things when you can get it for free, cost per point etc...half joking here.

Seriously though i hope the team has been into this for ahwile now as it was failry clear to most critical thinkers when hockey advanced stats first came to light that there was certainly something relevant and useful there. Another tool to add to the arsenal so to speak.

 

[PuckPoise]

Not much indicating they are into these types of things at all.

I mean, obviously they want to have the puck, everyone does, but they have done very little to indicate they're deep into analytics.

 

[BankStreetParade]

It's pretty clear the sens use advanced stats analysis to evaluate players. Just look at their draft record. There's always this feeling that they know something everyone else doesn't. That's not just from the eye test. They must have some underlying algorithms or analysis that supports their viewings of players.

 

[Knave]

"Advanced stats" is so overrated it's unbelievable.

At least with baseball it's hitter against pitcher and you can kind of justify it but even in baseball...

 

[Do Make Say Think]

I don't know if it's still true today but we, along with San Jose, were the only two teams in the NHL that kept stats for Gordie Howe Hattricks

I think we have people crunching the numbers within the Senators. Dubas is getting a lot of press because
-He's 28 (I mean wow!)
-He was hired by Toronto

No one cares about us so the fact that we don't hear much about it shouldn't lead us to wonder if we have people working on this

 

[Lenny the Lynx]

Maybe he is working for us. Secret double agent; taking the Leafs down from the inside.

Just like Tim in Buffalo. Taking over the division one team at a time, soon all the prospects will be ours.

 

[BonkTastic]

"Advanced stats" is so overrated it's unbelievable.

That's what Leafs fans were saying in November.

... not so much in March...

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

"Advanced stats" is so overrated it's unbelievable.

At least with baseball it's hitter against pitcher and you can kind of justify it but even in baseball...

I say the more information you can compile the better, but you have to know the limitations of all these advanced statistics and you can't treat numbers as gospel in hockey.

When I had to do my final thesis type thing for my graduate degree I had two parts to my project, one was compiling a lot of data which was all quantitative through the use of ESRI and government economic development outlets, and the other was going out and speaking to people through interviews, which was all qualitative data.

The qualitative data provided me much more insight in my opinion.

 

[Sensation]

"Advanced stats" is so overrated it's unbelievable.

At least with baseball it's hitter against pitcher and you can kind of justify it but even in baseball...

Can you elaborate on why you think they are overrated? I'm new to advanced statistics but there appears to be a correlation between Corsi/Fenwick, and overall team success/failure.

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

I know for a fact that the team tracks advanced statistics internally but doesn't really communicate them for fear of alienating casual fans. No idea WHO tracks them, but they definitely are monitored.

 

[Upgrayedd]

That's what Leafs fans were saying in November.

... not so much in March...

It's amazing to see the people who don't understand the value/how they work or those just stubbornly set in their way pull a complete 180 on the subject.

The best are those that attempt to downplay there initial distain for them a la leafs!

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

It's amazing to see the people who don't understand the value/how they work or those just stubbornly set in their way pull a complete 180 on the subject.

The best are those that attempt to downplay there inital distain for them a la leafs!

The thing that bothers me are the people who replace watching games with citing advanced statistics to form an opinion, because people always have to have an opinion about something and it's difficult for people just to say "I dont know, I havent watched ____ much."

 

[mcnorth]

With Dubas working for the Leafs and his mandate 'advanced stats'... we should be able to get a player, a pick, and a prospect for Condra.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Condra would definitely be a player the Leafs should look at acquiring but not at that price even if he is on a steal of a contract for the value he brings

 

[BloodRedArmy]

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=457789
Articles talks a little about the "new" system of GMing a team. Chicago, Los Angeles, now Leafs are doing it.

Who does this for us?

Jim O'Brien, obvs.

 

[Knave]

It's amazing to see the people who don't understand the value/how they work or those just stubbornly set in their way pull a complete 180 on the subject.

The best are those that attempt to downplay there initial distain for them a la leafs!

Oh, I understand statistics very well and I understand their use, limitations.

If your go-to strategy to find players, build a team is basically HockeySabreMetrics - you're in trouble.

Statistical work can complement scouts, interviews (if possible) with the player and other things but the weight put on the stats in particular in recent years is wrong... in my opinion.

The movie Moneyball was fun but you have to remember the Oakland As didn't run Sabremetrics to an extreme like the movie would have you believe.

Edit: And apparently it won't let me edit to Sabremetrics. Lame. Edit2: REALLY? Sabre metrics. Edit3: for ****s sake e and THEN r

 

[operasen]

I figure Tim Murray was aware of what the potential was and tracked what he needed - and all of that is now transported into Sabresland.

Dorian would be the natural choice to take on this aspect, but I've heard nothing about it in any of the materials I've read or listened to.

If this is a piece of the new system teams are developing to win, we need to be onboard. Given the history of the current regime, they do not do change very well.

The point make about wins/dollar is fair. And the point about being in the "information collection age" is solid. If the Sens are doing it, they should promote it. Fans, especially connected, savvy fans, would like it, I think.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Edit: And apparently it won't let me edit to Sabremetrics. Lame. Edit2: REALLY? Sabre metrics. Edit3: for ****s sake e and THEN r

It's "sabre" and "centre" in Canada

We use proper English unlike the Americans