Which markets do you think will get teams 33 and 34?

[WaW]

Once Giannis leaves the Bucks won't be very popular again. I'm assuming hockey is far more popular than hoops in Wisconsin. In a hypothetical fantasy scenario have the Bucks move to Seattle or KC, and have an NHL team come to Milwuakee. win win?

Its a bit more complicated than that. Wisconsin as a whole is pretty hockey-crazy, but Milwaukee demographics to not even come remotely close to reflecting those of the rest of the state.

Just to give a sense of that, Milwaukee is about 38% white, 40% black, 17% hispanic. Wisconsin as a state is 86% white. Milwaukee is by far the largest city. No matter which way you look at it, hockey is a sport that primarily appeals to white people and due to it having been an old white boys club for so long in its history, its appeal to the lack community although having grown at least a little bit, leaves a ton to be desired.

Proximity to the metro area of Madison would be crucial to a Milwaukee franchise being successful, but make no mistake in that market basketball will remain king, whether Giannis is there or not.

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

Wonder if Austin Mahomes is interested in bringing an NHL team to Kansas City after being part-owner of the Royals.

 

[mouser]

The league is in rough shape too many contracts at inflated salaries and far too much term on many of them. The league could implode back to 18 teams if fans are not back in the seats and the arenas opened up by Jan 2021.

No, it can’t. There’s no need to be ridiculous.

Doesn’t matter how big or long the player contracts are. At the end of the day the players still only get 50% of the revenue the teams make. If teams are shut down and not making revenue then the single biggest team expense—the players—get their salaries shut down too.

 

[PurpleMouse]

If anything, I'd guess Covid will make the league grow. No easier way to make up for lost revenue from a few down years then by adding teams with big expansion fees- provided things can get back to normal-ish soon.

 

[Byrddog]

No, it can’t. There’s no need to be ridiculous.

Doesn’t matter how big or long the player contracts are. At the end of the day the players still only get 50% of the revenue the teams make. If teams are shut down and not making revenue then the single biggest team expense—the players—get their salaries shut down too.

What is ridiculous is is how the league is ran. The lockout long ago missing a year in order to implement a salary cap to control spending for the lower income teams and dismantle teams like the old Red Wings( A team I deplore). The GM's learned nothing. They are still handing out bloated contracts to the few and crippling teams. You can not deny the three 11 million dollar contracts in Toronto has neutered that team now that the Cap is frozen for at least two years. As I pointed out in another post there are 18 teams over or within a million of the Cap today. Many of them are going to be forced to shed Cap Other than the reprieve of Seattle leveling it somewhat this year the league will have problems. Many of the teams with Cap room are going to struggle with profitability due to no butts in seats. TV money can only go so far the loss of revenue from games concessions and apparel combined with the profits from other events in most of the arenas is going to impact this short sighted contract. While you are correct only 50% will go to the players thats real dollars. I have seen nothing that addresses the Cap of course it can correct it self in 6 years or so when the large contracts expire.

If you have not noticed this virus seems to be surging yet again looks like MLB will soon suspend play. While the NHL has IMO done a good job the way they have reopened to protect the players and curtailing the play to two cities this could fail as well. I was surprised by the games yesterday for the most part the players did look ok but just ok. Not Playoff ready by a long shot. How often has it been pointed out on HF that the regular season is just not important its all about the playoffs. Well we are going to see the sloppiest playoff in league history as Bettman tries to save the league economically. This will not promote the sport well. Canada will never lose fans but in the states I assure you casual fans will move on and the league can not endure with Canadian money alone. The less stable teams league wide are going to struggle to remain afloat. There are not enough cities that can support a NHL team that relocates much less expands again. The season should have been canceled and all this worked out to start a delayed 2021 season. The owners had insurance to cover most of the losses I am sure but if this playoff does not work out well or the league shuts down again it will take ten years for it to recover. Refer to the lockout that implemented the Cap salaries were depressed for that whole contract and the Cap never topped out the 05 Cap was 39 mil and was supposed to increase to 70 mil by 2012. Then look at the 2013 projections that the cap would be 89.5 mil by the start of the 2021 season. Even without the virus that Cap could not have increased 8 mil to meet this projection. If one takes the 8 mil shortfall for each team into consideration that is a 248 million dollar miss in the projections. That is on top of all the price increases for tickets concessions parking apparel and other revenue streams increasing. Now consider coming out on the other side of this virus unemployment in the states is predicted to be above 9% until 2023. Higher than the great recession a time in which the Cap only increased 4 mil over a 6 year time frame. This contract is unsustainable.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Once pandemic is over, economy rebounds and NHL can expand again (all big ifs, naturally), and this project gores through,



They need to look hard at San Diego.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Once pandemic is over, economy rebounds and NHL can expand again (all big ifs, naturally), and this project gores through,



They need to look hard at San Diego.

Many ifs. Far too many.

If the NHL chooses to expand again... Just about impossible since they're on paper saying they have no interest of expanding past 32. The pandemic doesn't change this.

If the project gets approved... Difficult considering the sheer expense and only one option includes an arena big enough to host a NHL or NBA team.

If the people in control of the arena want a NHL team there... Difficult considering the NBA seems like a much better fit.

If they can find an owner willing to pay at least $650 million... Difficult considering there are less than a few hundred people in all of North America that can afford a team, let alone ones interested, let alone ones interested in putting one in San Diego.

If the NHL actually wants to put a team there... Difficult considering the Southern California market is so crowded to the point where the Anaheim Ducks barely break even. The population is huge, far larger than the second most populous state Texas and double the population of New York State, but there are limitations. This is likely one of them.

If they don't want to expand elsewhere instead... Near impossible considering the sheer number of better expansion options.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Many ifs. Far too many.

If the NHL chooses to expand again... Just about impossible since they're on paper saying they have no interest of expanding past 32. The pandemic doesn't change this.

Money talks. I don't see why 32 is the definite number to stop expanding. And San Diego really does need a new arena.

Also who says it has to be expansion? Relocation could be an option.

If the NHL actually wants to put a team there... Difficult considering the Southern California market is so crowded to the point where the Anaheim Ducks barely break even. The population is huge, far larger than the second most populous state Texas and double the population of New York State, but there are limitations. This is likely one of them.

If they don't want to expand elsewhere instead... Near impossible considering the sheer number of better expansion options.

San Diego is pretty far away from Anaheim. You won't see whole lot of Kings or Ducks fans in San Diego.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Money talks. I don't see why 32 is the definite number to stop expanding. And San Diego really does need a new arena.

Also who says it has to be expansion? Relocation could be an option.

I mean, besides saying he is done with expansion, refusing even discuss expansion with Fertitta, and a laundry list of other reasons, there is no definite number. Unfortunate when you take those things into account though. When another league expands past 32, perhaps you will see it. Teams still have a lot more to lose than to gain when considering expansion. The money made from the expansion fee isn't made up from the amount they permanently lose in the future by admitting another member in. It also inherently makes their own franchise less valuable, despite what the NHL has done to artificially raise franchise values.

And last time I checked, no NHL teams are even close to considering expansion, let alone looking at it in the future. So unless you have a few candidates you would care to bring up, it is as unlikely as them expanding.

San Diego is pretty far away from Anaheim. You won't see whole lot of Kings or Ducks fans in San Diego.

It is well under 100 miles away. That is not very far and more than reasonably enough in "Los Angele's territory" despite being outside the limit that would require a territory indemnity fee. The number and loyalty of pre-existing NHL fans there is well down the list of things the NHL looks at in a market.

 

[JMCx4]

... Also who says it has to be expansion? Relocation could be an option. ...

Well, the OP for one, when they named this thread: "Which markets do you think will get teams 33 and 34?"

 

[Bixby Snyder]

It's hilarious there are people who still think Quebec has a shot. There's no logical reason for the NHL to add any more teams in Canada.

 

[Bixby Snyder]

Once pandemic is over, economy rebounds and NHL can expand again (all big ifs, naturally), and this project gores through,



They need to look hard at San Diego.

San Diego would be a great market for the NHL.

Portland, San Diego, Atlanta, and Houston for teams 33 - 36.

 

[WeaponOfChoice]

It's hilarious there are people who still think Quebec has a shot. There's no logical reason for the NHL to add any more teams in Canada.

Yeah, the NHL and its teams are against making money and getting a higher Canadian tv contract.

 

[LEAFSANDBILLSFAN]

It's hilarious there are people who still think Quebec has a shot. There's no logical reason for the NHL to add any more teams in Canada.

You're right. I mean I know you have this weird anti-Canada vibe thing going on for whatever reason, but you are not wrong.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Once pandemic is over, economy rebounds and NHL can expand again (all big ifs, naturally), and this project gores through,



They need to look hard at San Diego.

yea, and how much is Anaheim investing in San Diego if the Spanos deal backfired on them....

 

[Stumbledore]

It's hilarious there are people who still think Quebec has a shot. There's no logical reason for the NHL to add any more teams in Canada.

It's hilarious there are people who still think the NHL is always guided solely by logical reasons. No logical reason to put a team in Winnipeg, but lots of emotional ones and an emergency sale and there you go.

PS: One of the best steaks I've had in America was down your way in Antiquity. Is that place still running? It's one fine steakhouse that Covid should never kill.

 

[johnjm22]

Austin, TX.

I believe Austin is the largest metro area in the USA without a pro sports team. The population is also growing rapidly. The citizens have high disposable income and seem to fit the demographic of NHL fans.

I think Austin would be another Vegas/Nashville/SJ type success.

There's also something to be said for being first to market.

But there's no arena...

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Austin, TX.

I believe Austin is the largest metro area in the USA without a pro sports team. The population is also growing rapidly. The citizens have high disposable income and seem to fit the demographic of NHL fans.

I think Austin would be another Vegas/Nashville/SJ type success.

There's also something to be said for being first to market.

But there's no arena...

Austin, Texas is a non-starter...... if Houston is a non-starter,b and appears as is now San Antonio, good luck trying to get Dallas out of that metro, as they have uber control of that market, no matter if it's technically Cedar Park or not

 

[Pandemonia]

Austin, TX.

I believe Austin is the largest metro area in the USA without a pro sports team. The population is also growing rapidly. The citizens have high disposable income and seem to fit the demographic of NHL fans.

I think Austin would be another Vegas/Nashville/SJ type success.

There's also something to be said for being first to market.

But there's no arena...

Any David Thompson types in Austin willing to fund an arena just for the helluvit?

 

[Pandemonia]

It's hilarious there are people who still think the NHL is always guided solely by logical reasons. No logical reason to put a team in Winnipeg, but lots of emotional ones and an emergency sale and there you go.

PS: One of the best steaks I've had in America was down your way in Antiquity. Is that place still running? It's one fine steakhouse that Covid should never kill.

Since when did moose roam as far south as New Mexico? LOL

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Any David Thompson types in Austin willing to fund an arena just for the helluvit?

University of Texas is building a new arena right now. But by the looks of it, its not hockey compatible.

 

[ArmadilloThumb]

Why do some people take the words of the NHL as set in stone, handed down from on high, to which they are bound by all the forces of the universe.

Its a private club and they are free to change their mind about anything anytime they want. Like, thought I'd have the steak, maybe I'll have the lobster tonight instead.

32 is no more magic than 36.

Who the hell would go to a hockey game in downtown Portland???

So... Houston, San Antonio, San Diego (if they get the rink), and one of Oklahoma City/Salt Lake City. That's where the population shift is going.

 

[mouser]

Austin, TX.

I believe Austin is the largest metro area in the USA without a pro sports team. The population is also growing rapidly. The citizens have high disposable income and seem to fit the demographic of NHL fans.

I think Austin would be another Vegas/Nashville/SJ type success.

There's also something to be said for being first to market.

But there's no arena...

Some would argue U of Texas football is bigger then many pro sports teams.

 

[johnjm22]

Some would argue U of Texas football is bigger then many pro sports teams.

Maybe. But they only play 6 games in Austin per year.

I think a pro sports team would thrive there.

 

[Aero 75]

Some would argue U of Texas football is bigger then many pro sports teams.

That's because they are.