Which line would be better this season - Matthews/McDavid/Laine or Ovechkin/Crosby/Malkin

Pick the best line


  • Total voters
    222
  • Poll closed .

flamesforcup

Registered User
Sep 5, 2017
3,026
3,539
Including Matthews rookie season Ovechkin has a whopping .03 points per game more than Matthews and Matthews has a .04 higher goals per game. We all know who the better defensive player is, it's not exactly an outlandish opinion.
How is Matthews the better defensive player? Where did this myth Matthews is a good defensive player come from? Is it just because he is a big centre u automatically assume hes good defensively? Everything ive seen of him indicates he is average defensively nothing special and really floaty. Just because something is repeated over and over again doesn't make it true.
 

authentic

Registered User
Jan 28, 2015
25,858
10,919
That's a convenient argument, since 2016-2017 was a poor year for Ovechkin. That poor year, by the way, broke a streak of 4 straight Rockets. Are you just going to overlook the fact Ovechkin put up 49 goals last season, and won the Rocket? Even if you want to play the pace argument for Matthews, despite missing 20 games last season, his pace was still below Ovechkin in both goals and points.

How many 50-goal seasons does Ovechkin have? How many Rockets? In the last 5 seasons, even including Ovechkin's poor 2016-2017 season, he has a 49 goal season, a 50 goal season, a 51 goal season, and a 53 goal season. In the last 5 seasons, he has 4 Rocket Richard Trophies.

You're barking up the wrong tree here. Matthews might have a better defensive game, and personally I think he gets overrated in that category, but Ovechkin is unquestionably the better goal scorer. Not just in terms of his career, but in terms of current ability.

We'll find out by the end of the season. Matthews has 44 goals in his last 73 games.
 

bobholly39

Registered User
Mar 10, 2013
22,255
14,886
Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin could be said to be the top 3 favorites to win the Conn Smythe trophy this year. That's pretty powerful
The young guys are quicker and maybe could do better - but for just this year i'd definitely take the other trio
 
  • Like
Reactions: Plural

WetcoastOrca

Registered User
Jun 3, 2011
38,339
22,262
Vancouver, BC
Proclaim? He's been a better hockey player since he entered the NHL, Ovechkin is a slightly better goal scorer at best. It's okay to proclaim Pettersson is better than Matthews though because... 10 games right?
Nonsense. Matthews is no where close to Ovechkin. You can start chirping if and when he ever wins a Rocket. For now he hasn’t even cracked 80 points.
You should try watching players not wearing the blue and white sweaters.
You might learn something.
 

authentic

Registered User
Jan 28, 2015
25,858
10,919
How is Matthews the better defensive player? Where did this myth Matthews is a good defensive player come from? Is it just because he is a big centre u automatically assume hes good defensively? Everything ive seen of him indicates he is average defensively nothing special and really floaty. Just because something is repeated over and over again doesn't make it true.

Oh dear god what you must be joking. :lol:
 

Sojourn

Registered User
Nov 1, 2006
50,523
9,377
We'll find out by the end of the season. Matthews has 44 goals in his last 73 games.

I'm sure you'd love to try to make that argument, but people who actually pay attention will note that Ovechkin is accomplishing what he does in entire seasons. He actually has 50 goal seasons, in a full 82 game season. That means, over a lengthy and difficult season that routinely sees players slow down, Ovechkin has proven he can maintain his pace enough to score 50 goals. And that's a feat that few NHL players accomplish, in large part because the 82 game season wears you down.

With Matthews, you can only take it in bits and pieces. Playing 82 games, in bits and pieces, and equaling 50 goals is not remotely the same as playing a full 82 game season, without the breaks, and equaling 50 goals. When the NHL starts awarding goal scoring trophies based on chunks of multiple seasons, then maybe you have an argument.

You might call Matthews a 50-goal scorer if he can put together 82 games where he scores 50 goals, regardless of them being 82 games in a row with breaks inbetween, but no one else will. Certainly no one who doesn't cheer for Toronto.

So, no. We won't find out this season. We may find out the next one, if Matthews can stay healthy enough to play enough games to have a shot at 50 goals. A ridiculously hot start this season would have gone a long way, but he was already slowing down before his injury, so who knows? On the other hand, we already know Ovechkin can do it. Repeatedly.
 
Last edited:

authentic

Registered User
Jan 28, 2015
25,858
10,919
I'm sure you'd love to try to make that argument, but people who actually pay attention will note that Ovechkin is accomplishing what he does in entire seasons. He actually has 50 goal seasons, in a full 82 game season. That means, over a lengthy and difficult season that routinely sees players slow down, Ovechkin has proven he can maintain his pace enough to score 50 goals. And that's a feat that few NHL players accomplish, in large part because the 82 game season wears you down.

With Matthews, you can only take it in bits and pieces. Playing 82 games, in bits and pieces, and equaling 50 goals is not remotely the same as playing a full 82 game season, without the breaks, and equaling 50 goals. When the NHL starts awarding goal scoring trophies based on chunks of multiple seasons, then maybe you have an argument.

You might call Matthews a 50-goal scorer if he can put together 82 games where he scores 50 goals, regardless of them being 82 games in a row with breaks inbetween, but no one else will. Certainly no one who doesn't cheer for Toronto.

So, no. We won't find out this season. We may find out the next one, if Matthews can stay healthy enough to play enough games to have a shot at 50 goals. A ridiculously hot start this season would have gone a long way, but he was already slowing down before his injury, so who knows? On the other hand, we already know Ovechkin can do it. Repeatedly.

I'm not calling him any of this, I'm strictly stating what he's done on a per game basis and it's extremely indicative of his ability as a player. He finished 2nd in the NHL in goals as a 19 year old rookie, I'm not worried about him maintaining his recent paces.
 

flamesforcup

Registered User
Sep 5, 2017
3,026
3,539
How much he's played since the start of last season? Or we include his 40 goal rookie season where Ovechkin had a down year but I was told that's not fair.
Oh ya i forgot he got injured last year too makes sense. Smh so many injurys. But its a moot point because pace doesnt always equal actual results we have seen it many times. Unless he can do it over a full season it doesnt mean anything
 

authentic

Registered User
Jan 28, 2015
25,858
10,919
Nonsense. Matthews is no where close to Ovechkin. You can start chirping if and when he ever wins a Rocket. For now he hasn’t even cracked 80 points.
You should try watching players not wearing the blue and white sweaters.
You might learn something.

You should try not being so obsessed with another teams player, I think Matthews is a better player and what you think of that opinion is completely irrelevant.
 

Sojourn

Registered User
Nov 1, 2006
50,523
9,377
How much he's played since the start of last season? Or we include his 40 goal rookie season where Ovechkin had a down year but I was told that's not fair.

I didn't say it wasn't fair. I said it was convenient. You could also say misleading.

Just like trying to combine multiple chunks of games into 73 games, and trying to suggest it's the same as playing 73 games straight.
 
  • Like
Reactions: dukeofjive

Sojourn

Registered User
Nov 1, 2006
50,523
9,377
I'm not calling him any of this, I'm strictly stating what he's done on a per game basis and it's extremely indicative of his ability as a player. He finished 2nd in the NHL in goals as a 19 year old rookie, I'm not worried about him maintaining his recent paces.

It's indicative of his ability to produce, without the wear and tear of an NHL season slowing him down as much as others who do play a full season. You're right on that.

And you were pretty clearly trying to call him that, since you said in the last 73 games he has 44 goals. You didn't care to mention the fact that there are massive gaps between those 73 games. Like, an entire off-season, or a stretch of games where he was injured, and able to rest. You could have very easily said that we would find out next season, hoping that he would play 82 games, or close enough to it to try to match Ovechkin's ability to score 50 goals.

And, by the way, that 73 game pace you brought up? It's still shy of 50 goals, even if you round it. In fact, he would have to maintain it almost exactly to score 49 goals, to match what Ovechkin did in 82 straight games. And those numbers include his incredibly hot start this season. Just some food for thought. Maybe Ovechkin really is better, despite all the fiddling you need to do to close the gap.
 
Last edited:

WetcoastOrca

Registered User
Jun 3, 2011
38,339
22,262
Vancouver, BC
You should try not being so obsessed with another teams player, I think Matthews is a better player and what you think of that opinion is completely irrelevant.
You should try not just watching the Leafs.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but you simply show a lack of objectivity and hockey knowledge when you claim that Matthews is currently better than Ovechkin based on an 11 game hot start for Matthews.
Let’s wait until he at least produces for a whole season at Ovechkins pace.
 

Sojourn

Registered User
Nov 1, 2006
50,523
9,377
You should try not just watching the Leafs.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion but you simply show a lack of objectivity and hockey knowledge when you claim that Matthews is currently better than Ovechkin based on an 11 game hot start for Matthews.
Let’s wait until he at least produces for a whole season at Ovechkins pace.

To be fair, it was a ridiculously hot start. It was dampened a bit by going four games straight with no points prior to his injury. He got off to a pretty hot start last season too. That might be a theme with him. Those hot starts cushion his numbers a bit, when you start making pace arguments, and I'd like to see how he does in a full NHL season(when he isn't a rookie).

I suspect, last season, he would have finished with maybe 77-78 points, and 42-43 goals. That's my feeling. He was just barely above a PPG, with 62 games played, and his goal pace was just shy of 45. With a full season, I'd expect those to dip a bit, but he had already amassed enough numbers that he should have hit 75 points and 40+ goals. I don't think I'm being too conservative here with these numbers.

Those are very, very good numbers, but they fall short of some of the claims we see made by certain individuals about just how good he currently is. Especially when you consider he's on one of the best offensive teams in the league, which is going to help inflate things a bit. Compare that to someone like Kopitar, who not only won the Selke, but put up 92 points last season on an average offensive team in Los Angeles. Which is more impressive? Or how about MacKinnon, and his 97 points in 74(!!) games?
 
Last edited:

DJJones

Registered User
Nov 18, 2014
10,239
3,543
Calgary
Laine's the clear weak link. Then I'd say Matthews after that.

McDavid is always scary in transition but I think the old guys would dominate in the offensive zone while Crosby and Malkin would do a much better job in defending the other way
 
  • Like
Reactions: dukeofjive

WetcoastOrca

Registered User
Jun 3, 2011
38,339
22,262
Vancouver, BC
To be fair, it was a ridiculously hot start. It was dampened a bit by going four games straight with no points prior to his injury. He got off to a pretty hot start last season too. That might be a theme with him. Those hot starts cushion his numbers a bit, when you start making pace arguments, and I'd like to see how he does in a full NHL season(when he isn't a rookie).

I suspect, last season, he would have finished with maybe 77-78 points, and 42-43 goals. That's my feeling. He was just barely above a PPG, with 62 games played, and his goal pace was just shy of 45. With a full season, I'd expect those to dip a bit, but he had already amassed enough numbers that he should have hit 75 points and 40+ goals. I don't think I'm being too conservative here with these numbers.

Those are very, very good numbers, but they fall short of some of the claims we see made by certain individuals about just how good he currently is. Especially when you consider he's on one of the best offensive teams in the league, which is going to help inflate things a bit. Compare that to someone like Kopitar, who not only won the Selke, but put up 92 points last season on an average offensive team in Los Angeles. Which is more impressive? Or how about MacKinnon, and his 97 points in 74(!!) games?
Agreed.
For the record I think that Matthews is a really good young player and is likely going to end up in that elite group of a few young players behind McDavid.
But first he needs to show it for a full season. As of now he hasn’t put up the numbers of MacKinnon and a few others. But he’s only in his third year. He could get there.

Ovechkin is still the goal scoring king imo until someone, most likely Laine, dethrones him. Matthews is just behind Laine in goal scoring but that can easily switch. Would not surprise me if Matthews wins a Rocket either as he’s come close. But he still needs to do it before we can say he’s currently as good as Ovechkin. Obviously we’re unlikely to see anyone pass Ovechkin as the career best for a long time.
 
Last edited:

nowhereman

Registered User
Jan 24, 2010
9,264
7,657
Los Angeles
Crosby and McDavid are about a wash. OV and Malkin, however, are clearly superior to their comparables. Give me the group with a combined 4 Conn Smythes, 7 Stanley Cups, 6 Harts, 7 Lindsays, 5 Art Ross trophies, and 9 Richards.
 
Last edited:

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad