Which country has a stronger football team: USA or Canada?

[bluesfan94]

I mean if it’s not gospel, then why should USA be considered automatically better than Canada if they haven’t beaten Canada recently and they qualified behind them? Still can’t get a straight answer for this. And I think the full qualification cycle is a better measure than FWR because it’s not being biased by less recent results. I don’t see why this is absurd

They beat them last year.

There are other results besides qualification

 

[Live in the Now]

Holy shit this is dumb

This is why I randomly bow out of conversations or decide not to respond without saying anything. The amount of goalpost moving here is incredible.

 

[Savant]

They beat them last year.

There are other results besides qualification

But which is weighted higher according to the holy FIFA rankimgs

 

[bluesfan94]

But which is weighted higher according to the holy FIFA rankimgs

 

[WarriorofTime]

I mean if it’s not gospel, then why should USA be considered automatically better than Canada if they haven’t beaten Canada recently and they qualified behind them? Still can’t get a straight answer for this. And I think the full qualification cycle is a better measure than FWR because it’s not being biased by less recent results. I don’t see why this is absurd

better question is why would Canada be considered better when

USA nations league champion, same region
USA gold cup champion, same region
advanced further in 2022 FIFA world cup ratings
higher FIFA ranking
higher ELO rating

we are right back to the Savant "trust me, bro" rankings

lmao

 

[keonsbitterness]

Roughriders all day long

Well, we did invent gridiron football and introduced it to the Americans when McGill went down to Harvard in 1874. When the game took off down there, they invented the myth that Princeton-Rutgers played the first game in 1869.

 

[bluesfan94]

Well, we did invent gridiron football and introduced it to the Americans when McGill went down to Harvard in 1874. When the game took off down there, they invented the myth that Princeton-Rutgers played the first game in 1869.

This just isn't true tho

 

[keonsbitterness]

This just isn't true tho

Of course it is.
First use of an oblong ball in the United States: 1874
First carrying of the ball: 1874
First tackling of a ball carrier (because someone was carrying it): 1874
First carrying the ball and touching the ball down at the end of the field (a.......touchdown?) to make a score: 1874
First (very crude) system of downs: 1874

1869 isn't a myth because nothing happened between Princeton and Rutgers. It's a myth because (depending on which account you read) there were at least 15 players per team standing in a straight-line or semi-circle at a moderate distance from each other trying to kick a round ball through the opposing line of players. That was the only way a team could score. In terms of modern sports, it was more like soccer than anything else. Princeton-Rutgers can be called the first American intercollegiate athletic contest, but no way was it gridiron football. Walter Camp, the father of American football, played at Yale at the exact time when Harvard adopted and adapted the McGill game. The rules he established in 1880s were based on Harvard, not Princeton-Rutgers.

The oldest and still-existing gridiron trophy is Canadian. But don't worry, you guys did invent the passing game in 1906, which Canada later adopted. Not like you guys didn't do anything.

 

[Savant]

better question is why would Canada be considered better when

USA nations league champion, same region
USA gold cup champion, same region
advanced further in 2022 FIFA world cup ratings
higher FIFA ranking
higher ELO rating

we are right back to the Savant "trust me, bro" rankings

lmao

These are all better points than you have made all day. What took so long?

On national league, I could to be a bit of a hater and say that I don’t think that’s a real competition, but instead I will say it’s not as recent as some of the other results. Gold Cup definitely fair Point national league? I don’t know how serious of a competition, I wouldn’t say Gold Cup is a household name and this is even lower on the totem pole. But again those are fair points

Third bullet point isn’t a real thing, don’t need to rehash.

Regarding rankings I think it’s pretty obvious my feelings there.

As I have said I think going into the World Cup, Canada should have been higher ranked. USA will come out of the World Cuo higher ranked. USA has not impressed me, but I will apologize if they get past the Netherlands.

As someone who has been to A LOT of USA games and has certain expectations, I can say that May be making me harsh on them but believe it or not I do see the positives too, but I have not been happy about the last eight years, and there hasn’t been enough positive to bring me back to thinking things are in the right direction. Not sure if things are trending up besides in the midfield. Don’t love the manager, but even if it is (or isn’t) the best team in CONCACAF, it is certainly the deepest 1-23/26. And that’s okay.

 

[WarriorofTime]

These are all better points than you have made all day. What took so long?

On national league, I could to be a bit of a hater and say that I don’t think that’s a real competition, but instead I will say it’s not as recent as some of the other results. Gold Cup definitely fair Point national league? I don’t know how serious of a competition, I wouldn’t say Gold Cup is a household name and this is even lower on the totem pole. But again those are fair points

Third bullet point isn’t a real thing, don’t need to rehash.

Regarding rankings I think it’s pretty obvious my feelings there.

As I have said I think going into the World Cup, Canada should have been higher ranked. USA will come out of the World Cuo higher ranked. USA has not impressed me, but I will apologize if they get past the Netherlands.

As someone who has been to A LOT of USA games and has certain expectations, I can say that May be making me harsh on them but believe it or not I do see the positives too, but I have not been happy about the last eight years, and there hasn’t been enough positive to bring me back to thinking things are in the right direction. Not sure if things are trending up besides in the midfield. Don’t love the manager, but even if it is (or isn’t) the best team in CONCACAF, it is certainly the deepest 1-23/26. And that’s okay.

We had our A team for nations league and a B team for gold cup lol

Canada “should have been” ranked higher like wtf does that even mean lmao. Every team in the world knows the criteria for getting a higher seed. It’s not a secret. Do you watch the nhl playoffs and go “yeah my team was WC2, but they shoulda been higher just cuz”

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The US has been banking on natural progression to lift them up for two decades meanwhile there is no one here or on the horizon who has come close to replacing Dempsey, Donovan, McBride etc.

Once Mexico gets their feet sorted, they'll easily return to being the kings of Concacaf

Except all of this is actually wrong.

Worry about your team. We like where our team is headed. We’re in the Round of 16 with the youngest playing squad at the tournament.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Statement #1: Extremely accurate.

Statement #2: Absurd. None of those three are as good as David (obviously), and all three are a wash with Buchanan.

Sorry, but 2 goals, 4 assists in 2181 minutes for a team in Belgium is not a wash with players such as Reyna, Aaronson, and Weah.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Canada qualified ahead of USA, won the most recent head to head against them, and had to deal with a much tougher group. I thought Canada’s 90 minutes against Belgium, a game they were very unlucky to lose, were better than any 90 minute effort USA did. Again, I don’t think this is a hard concept. You are looking at arbitrary rankings and win/loss records; which is fair - but I also think Canada would have qualified in Group B and USA would have had a tough time/May not have qualified in Group F. I don’t think this is really controversial.

If you want to play that game, USA beat Morocco 3-0 in June, and now we’re seeing that this Belgium team was a pot 1 paper tiger that had plenty of infighting.

These head to heads in World Cup qualifying when one team is home and the other away are very different from the World Cup on neutral territory. These World Cup qualifiers were 3 games in like 6 days with all kinds of crazy travel and conditions. Not close to as good of a judge of where teams are as the World Cup, let alone a continental championship.

I seriously don’t see what more you’d like out of this US team in this World Cup so far. They’ve taken the game to every team they’ve played, they’ve given up one goal, they’ve not lost or trailed in a game. It’s possible we get beaten by Netherlands by a few goals and that puts a damper on the mood of this tournament, but I don’t see the well founded leg to stand on to say Canada’s results or performances have been more impressive.

 

[bluesfan94]

Of course it is.
First use of an oblong ball in the United States: 1874
First carrying of the ball: 1874
First tackling of a ball carrier (because someone was carrying it): 1874
First carrying the ball and touching the ball down at the end of the field (a.......touchdown?) to make a score: 1874
First (very crude) system of downs: 1874

1869 isn't a myth because nothing happened between Princeton and Rutgers. It's a myth because (depending on which account you read) there were at least 15 players per team standing in a straight-line or semi-circle at a moderate distance from each other trying to kick a round ball through the opposing line of players. That was the only way a team could score. In terms of modern sports, it was more like soccer than anything else. Princeton-Rutgers can be called the first American intercollegiate athletic contest, but no way was it gridiron football. Walter Camp, the father of American football, played at Yale at the exact time when Harvard adopted and adapted the McGill game. The rules he established in 1880s were based on Harvard, not Princeton-Rutgers.

The oldest and still-existing gridiron trophy is Canadian. But don't worry, you guys did invent the passing game in 1906, which Canada later adopted. Not like you guys didn't do anything.

Just because you played rugby doesn’t change anything

 

[Savant]

If you want to play that game, USA beat Morocco 3-0 in June, and now we’re seeing that this Belgium team was a pot 1 paper tiger that had plenty of infighting.

These head to heads in World Cup qualifying when one team is home and the other away are very different from the World Cup on neutral territory. These World Cup qualifiers were 3 games in like 6 days with all kinds of crazy travel and conditions. Not close to as good of a judge of where teams are as the World Cup, let alone a continental championship.

I seriously don’t see what more you’d like out of this US team in this World Cup so far. They’ve taken the game to every team they’ve played, they’ve given up one goal, they’ve not lost or trailed in a game. It’s possible we get beaten by Netherlands by a few goals and that puts a damper on the mood of this tournament, but I don’t see the well founded leg to stand on to say Canada’s results or performances have been more impressive.

I will say I was always shorting Belgium this cycle.

As I said, hanging on for dear life in the majority of the second half against two of the worst teams in the tournament has not impressed me. Their best result is a 0-0 where they didn’t look like scoring besides hitting the bar and didn’t show a ton of urgency. I’ve been impressed by the midfield three but nothing else has stood out to me. If they get past Netherlands I will gladly apologize

 

[SJinNewJersey]

Well considering the last times the two teams went head-to-head, Canada's record against the States is a win and a tie with 3GF and 1GA, I'd say Canada

If you are going to bring up results from last year 2021 September, then you must also include the game played 49 days before in July 2021 and I am sure you know who won that head-to-head. meeting.

 

[bluesfan94]

If you are going to bring up results from last year 2021 September, then you must also include the game played 49 days before in July 2021 and I am sure you know who won that head-to-head. meeting.

I’m not.

 

[SJinNewJersey]

I’m not.

US beat Canada 1-0.

 

[bluesfan94]

US beat Canada 1-0.

Oh I know what happened in the Gold Cup. You said you were sure our friend knew. I’m not so sure.

 

[Gecklund]

Has there really been basically 2-3 pages arguing about a semantics point and the definition of rankings?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I will say I was always shorting Belgium this cycle.

As I said, hanging on for dear life in the majority of the second half against two of the worst teams in the tournament has not impressed me. Their best result is a 0-0 where they didn’t look like scoring besides hitting the bar and didn’t show a ton of urgency. I’ve been impressed by the midfield three but nothing else has stood out to me. If they get past Netherlands I will gladly apologize

Adjust for the score then. When the games were tied, USA wasn’t holding on. What you say comes down to bad coaching by Berhalter. Playing excessively negative with a lead. Throwing on defenders or the less talented MLS players. It got better though from the Wales game to Iran game when they had the lead. Against Wales, they shifted the mentality right as the second half started. Against Iran, the first 30 minutes of the second half was pretty good.

 

[willy702]

Has there really been basically 2-3 pages arguing about a semantics point and the definition of rankings?

More like a therapy session for poor Canadians getting handed the harsh reality that winning qualification doesn't mean jack shit.

 

[Savant]

Adjust for the score then. When the games were tied, USA wasn’t holding on. What you say comes down to bad coaching by Berhalter. Playing excessively negative with a lead. Throwing on defenders or the less talented MLS players. It got better though from the Wales game to Iran game when they had the lead. Against Wales, they shifted the mentality right as the second half started. Against Iran, the first 30 minutes of the second half was pretty good.

I don’t agree at all, but that’s okay.

let’s see what happens tomorrow. I’m done with this topic for now

 

[Basement Cat]

Hallelujah!

 

[Gecklund]

More like a therapy session for poor Canadians getting handed the harsh reality that winning qualification doesn't mean jack shit.

I mean it definitely means something. Just not much in terms of the World Cup.