Where will the Jackets finish this season

[CarolinaBlueJacket]

Others, huh? Like who?

I don't have any idea. But as a team goes down players jump ship. Just a fact.

 

[CarolinaBlueJacket]

Since the season is bout to start, and the 'poll' becomes a bit obsolete, can we morph this into the 'the organizational low point' thread? I got a couple contenders...

There are many to choose from. Like I said, I hope I am wrong and will happily admit it if it happens.

I just watched those highlights. That's your low point for the organization? There are many worse moments than that.

 

[major major]

I don't have any idea. But as a team goes down players jump ship. Just a fact.

The only examples I can think of are teams that are historically awful. Do you have something else in mind? I don't think we'll see an exodus because the team just can't be that bad, there's too much talent. And almost everyone is an RFA.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

I hope I am wrong but I get the feeling that if Bob and Panarin both abandon ship that the morale will plummet and the team will sink to the bottom, then others will want out. This team is not on the verge of losing their best player they currently have, but the best TWO players they have EVER had! They are going to lose them both at the same time for nothing. How do you recover from that? This will be an organizational low point imo. I hope I am wrong.

You mean fans, right?

 

[JacketsDavid]

Way too many low points for us to even consider that (having 2 captains request to be traded is on top of list).
Bob wants to be here if we decide to pay him.
Panarin will have earned the right to be an UFA after that season. He's not saying it sucks here just he doesn't choose to be here for 6-7 years. it happens. Can't blame him a lot of folks that leave Columbus (for whatever profession) want either something bigger or better weather. That was a risk we assumed with trading for him.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Low point of the franchise was definitely the 2011-12 season. Starting with the Jeff Carter trade here and ending with the Rick Nash trade request. Not to mention how bad that team was. We spent a lot of money that year to be that bad.

 

[Jovavic]

Ever the pessimist, I say the wheels fall off in November (injuries, poor play, whatever) and we limp to an 80 point finish....now, go out there and prove me wrong!

 

[thebus88]

Bob wants to be here if we decide to pay him.

Where are people getting this? It keeps getting thrown out there. I know its pretty much the last or only "hope" for the people who want him on the CBJ moving forward, that the CBJ will eventually offer him a huge contract, but in the interviews he had a few weeks ago, he makes it seem, like Panarin, he also is goin to free agency.

"The team knows my plans".....means what you think?

 

[CBJFan827]

Where are people getting this? It keeps getting thrown out there. I know its pretty much the last or only "hope" for the people who want him on the CBJ moving forward, that the CBJ will eventually offer him a huge contract, but in the interviews he had a few weeks ago, he makes it seem, like Panarin, he also is goin to free agency.

"The team knows my plans".....means what you think?

It could mean "I'm insulted and now I'm going to UFA no matter what they do now." It could also mean, "I'm going to get PAID. If you're unwilling to give me the contract, someone else will."

Sure, I lean toward the likelihood of one over the other, but both are valid possibilities to what he meant. Much more is just speculation and conjecture.

Can the games start already? I think we're all about to kill each other.

 

[major major]

It could mean "I'm insulted and now I'm going to UFA no matter what they do now." It could also mean, "I'm going to get PAID. If you're unwilling to give me the contract, someone else will."

Sure, I lean toward the likelihood of one over the other, but both are valid possibilities to what he meant. Much more is just speculation and conjecture.

Can the games start already? I think we're all about to kill each other.

I think it means the latter.

And Bob's visibly angry at the FO, so I have to ask why he would be angry if he's set on leaving? He obviously wants something from them.

 

[JacketsDavid]

Where are people getting this? It keeps getting thrown out there. I know its pretty much the last or only "hope" for the people who want him on the CBJ moving forward, that the CBJ will eventually offer him a huge contract, but in the interviews he had a few weeks ago, he makes it seem, like Panarin, he also is goin to free agency.

"The team knows my plans".....means what you think?

I 100% believe he want to be here for right terms. 7 years, close to $10M per year.
I think the CBJ are hoping to get him at 4 years and $10M.

I could be wrong, but I think he wants to stay.
I think end of day the team does break down and gives him too much term and too many dollars but will take him coming back a little (negotiating).

 

[Forepar]

I'm not sure Mr. Jones was the guy with the thing going on.

Well, you are right, but the post prior sparked my memory of the song...one of the best blues/R&B/Motown songs of all time.
And for the longest time, I always thought that the thing Mrs. Jones had going on turned out to be with Mr. Jones! But as usual, I was overly optimistic....and wrong!

 

[Forepar]

I 100% believe he want to be here for right terms. 7 years, close to $10M per year.
I think the CBJ are hoping to get him at 4 years and $10M.

I could be wrong, but I think he wants to stay.
I think end of day the team does break down and gives him too much term and too many dollars but will take him coming back a little (negotiating).

Without any knowledge of any other facts to back it up, I agree with your thought that Bob wants to stay. I.e. Why would he be upset if he wanted to leave?

Some team will offer Bob max term at something close to $10M.
Whether he is worth that money AND term is the debate, but some team(s) will say yes, he is worth it.

Should the Jackets? That's the unknown...I'd love to have him on a 4-year deal. I'd hate to see him leave, PO woes included. But not sure I'd commit to a 30-yr old goalie for 8 years at $10M.
I've read Major's and other's posts...I get that goalies may have longer shelf life than skaters...not arguing against Bob being worth it, just is he worth it to the CBJ? Asking the question doesn't answer the question for me. FO is in a tough spot....That's a lot of cap space for a long period.

Given the nature of guaranteed contracts in the NHL, there is no way Bob's agent allows him to sign for anything less than max term with anyone. Malpractice if he does, unless there are no other offers for max term (or near).
A career-ending injury during a 4-year term would leave Bob with nothing for the last 3-4 years of what would be the back half of his guarantied contract - close to $40M.
Shoot, even if it is Bob's plan to leave the NHL in 4 years, it would still be negligent to not sign for max term. He and his agent could figure the exit strategy out later, if needed.

I've read in various threads the idea of front-loading Bob's salary...What am I missing? I understand it from a cash and perhaps buy-out perspective, but aren't there restrictions in the CBA on the percentage that can be front-loaded/back-loaded? And the contract gets averaged for cap purposes anyway. What am I missing?

 

[major major]

I've read in various threads the idea of front-loading Bob's salary...What am I missing? I understand it from a cash and perhaps buy-out perspective, but aren't there restrictions in the CBA on the percentage that can be front-loaded/back-loaded? And the contract gets averaged for cap purposes anyway. What am I missing?

I wasn't a part of those discussions, but one advantage of a front-loaded contract is that you can move the player in the later years to a cash-poor team that is trying to make the cap floor.

Also, per wikipedia: "The [CBA] also limits salary variance on contracts from year to year to no more than 35% and no year can be less than 50% of the highest year." So you could conceivably go 12 12 12 9 9 6 6 6 .

 

[JacketsDavid]

I wasn't a part of those discussions, but one advantage of a front-loaded contract is that you can move the player in the later years to a cash-poor team that is trying to make the cap floor.

Also, per wikipedia: "The [CBA] also limits salary variance on contracts from year to year to no more than 35% and no year can be less than 50% of the highest year." So you could conceivably go 12 12 12 9 9 6 6 6 .

Exactly or more to point of paying what is fair value at the time. I get it some goalies age well but I would rather pay him handsomely for 2-4 years then start decreasing it.
The trading thing also plays into it. My primary concern is to not have a (potentially) broken down 35-37 year old goalie making $10M.

 

[213 Sentinel]

I favor a front-loaded contract, too, but can't find an example of one. At least not one that's prominent enough to pop up in a cursory search. I don't think they're popular with players.

 

[EspenK]

Front loaded, back loaded, evenly loaded it makes no difference for the cap. Where it does make a difference obviously is cash flow. To me the bigger issue is the inclusion of signing bonuses which are not "buyoutable" and are being used heavily to make players whole in anticipation of a lockout in 2020. The other obvious advantage to the team of a front loaded deal is that it makes it a bit easier to trade the player towards the end of the deal because the acquiring team doesn't
take a big cash hit.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

Front loaded, back loaded, evenly loaded it makes no difference for the cap. Where it does make a difference obviously is cash flow. To me the bigger issue is the inclusion of signing bonuses which are not "buyoutable" and are being used heavily to make players whole in anticipation of a lockout in 2020. The other obvious advantage to the team of a front loaded deal is that it makes it a bit easier to trade the player towards the end of the deal because the acquiring team doesn't
take a big cash hit.

He's on a NMC right now so I'd guess he'd probably have another included. Though it probably will be with his new team.

 

[BluejacketNut]

Without any knowledge of any other facts to back it up, I agree with your thought that Bob wants to stay. I.e. Why would he be upset if he wanted to leave?

Some team will offer Bob max term at something close to $10M.
Whether he is worth that money AND term is the debate, but some team(s) will say yes, he is worth it.

Should the Jackets? That's the unknown...I'd love to have him on a 4-year deal. I'd hate to see him leave, PO woes included. But not sure I'd commit to a 30-yr old goalie for 8 years at $10M.
I've read Major's and other's posts...I get that goalies may have longer shelf life than skaters...not arguing against Bob being worth it, just is he worth it to the CBJ? Asking the question doesn't answer the question for me. FO is in a tough spot....That's a lot of cap space for a long period.

Given the nature of guaranteed contracts in the NHL, there is no way Bob's agent allows him to sign for anything less than max term with anyone. Malpractice if he does, unless there are no other offers for max term (or near).
A career-ending injury during a 4-year term would leave Bob with nothing for the last 3-4 years of what would be the back half of his guarantied contract - close to $40M.
Shoot, even if it is Bob's plan to leave the NHL in 4 years, it would still be negligent to not sign for max term. He and his agent could figure the exit strategy out later, if needed.

I've read in various threads the idea of front-loading Bob's salary...What am I missing? I understand it from a cash and perhaps buy-out perspective, but aren't there restrictions in the CBA on the percentage that can be front-loaded/back-loaded? And the contract gets averaged for cap purposes anyway. What am I missing?

This is on the front office for only signing him to a 4 year deal. Now here we are

It depends what happens with Bob and Panarin. I dont see Bob getting traded as you dont normally see goaltenders traded much, if a contending team loses their goalie, that may change that. I think with Bob we can be a playoff team, even if we end up trading Panarin. So if we dont lose Bob I think we make it in maybe as 2nd in the division. If we somehow end up trading Bob, we may still be able to get a wild card spot, but it may come down to the final games of the season

 

[blahblah]

For some reason I feel like we're going to struggle this season. I think I'll avoid a guess beyond if we make it in, we'll probably be another wildcard entry.

 

[major major]

I favor a front-loaded contract, too, but can't find an example of one. At least not one that's prominent enough to pop up in a cursory search. I don't think they're popular with players.

We should assume that players prefer them and owners hate them. If you're paying 12 12 12 9 9 6 6 6 , that's $9m paid out early that you could have invested in the meantime. The "present cost" of the deal to an owner is $1m+ higher than if it was paid out evenly.

This is on the front office for only signing him to a 4 year deal. Now here we are

I'd argue we have better reasons to sign him long term now than we did 4 years ago. Bob didn't have much of a track record at that point.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

I favor a front-loaded contract, too, but can't find an example of one. At least not one that's prominent enough to pop up in a cursory search. I don't think they're popular with players.

Connor McDavid - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Here's a crazy one that can't be done under the most recent CBA:

Shea Weber - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

 

[Forepar]

I wasn't a part of those discussions, but one advantage of a front-loaded contract is that you can move the player in the later years to a cash-poor team that is trying to make the cap floor.

Also, per wikipedia: "The [CBA] also limits salary variance on contracts from year to year to no more than 35% and no year can be less than 50% of the highest year." So you could conceivably go 12 12 12 9 9 6 6 6 .

Thanks MM. The percentage of permitted variance is higher than I recalled.
I hadn't thought about cash-poor teams being a potential suitor. That makes sense - unless/until they put another NMC in the contract.
Too early to say much else - hopefully the start playing better.

 

[Steely Van]

Guarantee Columbus will make the playoffs and win the Stanley Cup

Why?
Spread out scoring
2 Dmen and Goalie are Studs

Toronto No
-Goaltending/Defense not good enough
Tampa Bay No
-Columbus better goaltending and defense
Boston No
-Rask isn't as good as he once was. Only have to shut down top line.
Florida No
-Luongo falls asleep and loses games in last 5 minutes by allowing a bad goal
Washington
-recovering from hangover
Nashville
-Rinne overachieved last year
Winnipeg
-Hellybuck comes back to Earth
Vegas
-Fleury's gettin old

Congratulations

The only question is, who wins the Conn Smythe for Columbus

 

[KCbus]

The Blue Jackets will finish the season... in Ottawa.

You're welcome.