When will Rich Tocchet be fired (or otherwise cease being our head coach)?

[Bonsai Tree]

Can we trade RT for a 1st line forward?

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Can we trade RT for a 1st line forward?

Seriously, folks, we live and die by the roster, not Tocchet. I don’t even care if they retain RT after they improve the roster. I just want better players.

 

[Grimes]

Now this Morgan article makes more sense.

 

[rt]

Now this Morgan article makes more sense.

Hahahahahahah
Hhahahahahahhhahahahhaaaaghahavag

hahahahahahahahahahga

hahahahahah hahahahaha hahaha

hahaha hahaha

 

[Coyotedroppings]

The odd line from Pedeson in "Platoon" seems to fit here - "Morgan's got his head so far up Toc's ass, he's gotta be Pinochio"

All one ever needed to do is watch/listen to a Morgan/RT interview, or presser.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Morgan just came out strongly supportive of Tocchet. While I don't see Tocchet as the "miracle worker" ascribed to by Morgan, I agree with him that the roster is so porous that it is impossible to evaluate Tocchet's performance negatively.

I think it's pretty clear that tactically Tocchet is completely lost. Where he might excel is in player relationships, I dunno. But I've seen enough of this team folding late in games, turtling, being wholly unable to adapt to on-ice situations, no matter who is on the ice, to ever believe that Tocchet will lead us anywhere but to mediocrity.

 

[rt]

I think it's pretty clear that tactically Tocchet is completely lost. Where he might excel is in player relationships, I dunno. But I've seen enough of this team folding late in games, turtling, being wholly unable to adapt to on-ice situations, no matter who is on the ice, to ever believe that Tocchet will lead us anywhere but to mediocrity.

10,000 likes.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

I think it's pretty clear that tactically Tocchet is completely lost. Where he might excel is in player relationships, I dunno. But I've seen enough of this team folding late in games, turtling, being wholly unable to adapt to on-ice situations, no matter who is on the ice, to ever believe that Tocchet will lead us anywhere but to mediocrity.

To me this is on the players. You can't get blood from a stone.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

To me this is on the players. You can't get blood from a stone.

True, but the only way Tocchet gets blood from a stone is by having someone fall on it by accident.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

I have, for the longest time, believed that Tocchet is not the reason why the Coyotes are playing at a mediocre level. As to tactics, I am not knowledgeable in hockey tactics or strategy to the point where I can look at RT's individual decisions and criticize them on a a moment to moment basis.
I hear the constant complaint about overplaying the goalies. I find this less than persuasive when the goal of the organization is to make the playoffs this year rather than tank and rebuild, and the #2 goalie is actually number 5 on the depth chart. One would think that the decision to tank and rebuild v go for the playoff slot is made a the GM and ownership level, not the coaching level.

I have no particular fondness for Tocchet, and find him abrasive. However, it is unfair to blame Tocchet for the sins of a dysfunctional organization.

 

[Mosby]

Remember, in an offseason where all of Rod Brind’Amour, John Tortorella, Travis Green, Bruce Boudreau, and Gerald Gallant could all be looking for work, Rick Tocchet will be in demand.

He also wants a raise.

Sure.

 

[Summer Rose]

Remember, in an offseason where all of Rod Brind’Amour, John Tortorella, Travis Green, Bruce Boudreau, and Gerald Gallant could all be looking for work, Rick Tocchet will be in demand.

He also wants a raise.

Sure.

Give us Gerard Gallant. Yesterday.

 

[MIGs Dog]

To me this is on the players. You can't get blood from a stone.

Good leaders get people to do things they don't think they can do.

 

[cobra427]

I have, for the longest time, believed that Tocchet is not the reason why the Coyotes are playing at a mediocre level. As to tactics, I am not knowledgeable in hockey tactics or strategy to the point where I can look at RT's individual decisions and criticize them on a a moment to moment basis.
I hear the constant complaint about overplaying the goalies. I find this less than persuasive when the goal of the organization is to make the playoffs this year rather than tank and rebuild, and the #2 goalie is actually number 5 on the depth chart. One would think that the decision to tank and rebuild v go for the playoff slot is made a the GM and ownership level, not the coaching level.

I have no particular fondness for Tocchet, and find him abrasive. However, it is unfair to blame Tocchet for the sins of a dysfunctional organization.

I read the Morgan article, he makes good points in defending RT. There is no question we don't have the talent to be a cup contender right now, nobody disputes that. What Morgan didn't talk about was the teams inconsistency from game to game, players leaving and thriving elsewhere or coming to Az and not doing as well. Morgan talks about Raanta/Kuemper being out but Hill has an equal save percentage. Outside of hot goal tending in stretches the last few years, it doesn't seem like RT gets the most out of his players. I always felt like TIP got the most out of his players and we certainly have way more talent now than Tip had for a few years.

We have the worst shot differential in the NHL right now, are we the worst team talent wise? I don't think so. It seems like we have been really lucky with many come from behind wins against the ducks as an example or last second goals this year.

Bottom line is that we never over achieve as a team for any length of time, we do under achieve though for the talent we do have. RT has had 4 years to show us who he is and what he is capable of, no reason to keep him around past this year.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Give us Gerard Gallant. Yesterday.

I have a fondness for Torts. I love good theatre.

 

[Jakey53]

Using the roster as an excuse for Tocchet is rich. He has had a say in how this thing was built up. So if it's a crappy roster, he's part of the issue with it.

Plus, yea... you turn players into crap and then complain your roster is crap. Good way to dodge responsibility. It's definitely easier when you lie about what you are doing with the players, too. "Oh, pulled Kuemper to spark the team. No injury "

Here's a thought for you. Tocchet, the miracle man, played Stepan with crazy TOI last year. Stepan is traded to a rebuilding team with low expectations... and didn't get very much TOI before he was injured. Strange eh? If Tocchet is so damn good with his decisions, why wouldn't a different coach want to utilize the same strategy with one of his key players?

I will go one better. RT had Stepan AND Fischer AND Panik on the PP for the whole year, and I they got a total of 5 points. RT should have been fired for that alone.

 

[JasonDemersWasOkay]

To me it’s not just that Craig defends Tocchet, it’s also the dismissiveness towards anyone who wants to shift some blame to tocchet. No one has any substantive arguments for criticizing tocchet’s system? Really? Have you read the comments on your articles?

 

[Summer Rose]

I have a fondness for Torts. I love good theatre.

As long as we sign only a 2-3 year contract with no intention to renew. He’s a good coach, but has a short shelf life.

 

[Jakey53]

Seriously, folks, we live and die by the roster, not Tocchet. I don’t even care if they retain RT after they improve the roster. I just want better players.

If you or I were coach they could give us a team of allstars and we would still suck. Coaching is very very important. Don't get me wrong, you need players to succeed, but when you get to the SC playoffs, all teams have good players and that is where a good coach get's paid the big bucks. Look back the last ten years of the SC final and see how many RT's you find. What you will find is that both the winning and losing teams of the SC final had experienced and proven coaches. It's not by coincidence.

 

[Jakey53]

Good leaders get people to do things they don't think they can do.

Bingo. Good coaches can do that. I think RT does also, like how many of our players knew how to turtle when they have a lead before RT got here?

 

[BUX7PHX]

I have, for the longest time, believed that Tocchet is not the reason why the Coyotes are playing at a mediocre level. As to tactics, I am not knowledgeable in hockey tactics or strategy to the point where I can look at RT's individual decisions and criticize them on a a moment to moment basis.
I hear the constant complaint about overplaying the goalies. I find this less than persuasive when the goal of the organization is to make the playoffs this year rather than tank and rebuild, and the #2 goalie is actually number 5 on the depth chart. One would think that the decision to tank and rebuild v go for the playoff slot is made a the GM and ownership level, not the coaching level.

I have no particular fondness for Tocchet, and find him abrasive. However, it is unfair to blame Tocchet for the sins of a dysfunctional organization.

He may not be the reason why the team plays at a mediocre level. However, he may be the reason why we can't transcend above mediocrity.

The truth is that while we may not be the most skilled team, there are many times when the most skilled team does not necessarily win, due to an effective game plan in reducing that skill difference. Coaches have an effect on creating that game plan and giving the team an edge in that sense.

 

[Jakey53]

As long as we sign only a 2-3 year contract with no intention to renew. He’s a good coach, but has a short shelf life.

Why? JT has a .550% and besides the Canuck mess he had stops of five or more years for CBJ, Rangers and Tampa. That's pretty good shelf life for a coach. Has the same winning % as Gallant whom everyone here seems to want, and he had very short stops with every NHL organization as HC. We could do a hell of a lot worse than JT.

 

[Summer Rose]

Why? JT has a .550% and besides the Canuck mess he had stops of five or more years for CBJ, Rangers and Tampa. That's pretty good shelf life for a coach. Has the same winning % as Gallant whom everyone here seems to want, and he had very short stops with every NHL organization as HC. We could do a hell of a lot worse than JT.

Perhaps 2-3 years is underselling it. I just feel like he tends to lose the room after a few seasons.

 

[XX]

To me it’s not just that Craig defends Tocchet, it’s also the dismissiveness towards anyone who wants to shift some blame to tocchet. No one has any substantive arguments for criticizing tocchet’s system? Really? Have you read the comments on your articles?

Did he really say that? I don't give Craig money. Remember he's the guy that thought Tocchet was responsible for Pittsburgh's offense and PP.

One would think Tocchet's .480 win percentage, inability to adjust, inability to manage the game (goalies, timeouts), and inability to get a consistent effort out of guys would be self evident. The only thing consistent about Tocchet is his inability to consistently beat basement dwelling teams, even when rested. It's probably not a great sign when you struggle to beat an Anaheim team that is Buffalo tier bad repeatedly. But I'm sure it's just the players. It's like Craig was completely asleep from the moment Hall arrived onward last year.

I don't think I've ever seen a coach trade more on his reputation as a player than Tocchet. Although, when you think about it, it's kind of out of necessity. There just isn't much merit there.

I bet Craig thinks Tocchet is responsible for guys like Garland and Bunting too.

 

[CoyoteDave]

It is almost like what he does behind closed doors and in the locker room means more than the on ice results. How would anyone of us keep our job because we try hard, but yet get no results/sales/profit. At some point, it isn't the way you do it but what you do that should count. Tocchet does not have a winning record. That should be the final deciding point.