What would be considered a successful season?

[Dubi Doo]

Once you've had Eichel for 4 seasons and Dahlin's entering his second season- it's playoffs or bust. Botts better be shown the door if they aren't playing meaningful games in April. None of this longterm bullshit- that's a whack ass excuse. We're not in rebuild mode.

 

[Derg12]

Getting out of the bottom 8 would be a start - but that has been the "standard" for the last how many years now? I would imagine that during that time frame, challenging for a wild card spot would be the goal.

So... I would imagine that a successful season lies between a wild card spot and/or out of the bottom 8.

 

[1point21Gigawatts]

We've waited too long. It's playoffs or bust.

 

[Jim Bob]

It was for the Isles and Blues. I am not laying the blame at the feet of RK if they do not, I will save that for the guy that had a year plus from the end of the streak for that.

Those two teams were in very different places than the Sabres were entering this season.

And like has been talked about all, it wasn't just the coaching change that got the Blues from worst to first. They also called up Binnnasty who went on a heater in net.

And if you think RK is Trotz v2.0, well....

 

[Jim Bob]

Is there really a single person our there who thinks this team can make the playoffs? That's not "success," that's a miracle.

I'm reading all the "playoffs are a must" posts and thinking that it is like expecting a 6 month old baby to run a sub 5 second 40 yard dash in the next week.

"Sorry kid, but you aren't getting that D1 scholarship by rolling over! We need to raise the bar, son!"

 

[Dirty Dog]

It’s a league where 16 teams make the playoffs. I’m an optimist about this team, but come on, short of the playoffs is a disappointment

 

[Jim Bob]

This team finished 22 points out of the playoffs last year.

They would have to leapfrog 5 teams to make the playoffs.

Setting the bar at making the playoffs this year is setting yourself up to be disappointed, IMO.

 

[enthusiast]

This team finished 22 points out of the playoffs last year.

They would have to leapfrog 5 teams to make the playoffs.

Setting the bar at making the playoffs this year is setting yourself up to be disappointed, IMO.

I'm sure I'll be disappointed, but for me that doesn't change the fact that it ought to be the standard.

 

[Onry]

Low hanging fruit for me.

A successful season would be witnessing hard, invested effort. No cruising. No pity us. I want to see committed, hard working professionals...all season, regardless of standings

 

[Buffaloed]

A successful season is if no one says "we should have kept Housley".

 

[Jim Bob]

I'm sure I'll be disappointed, but for me that doesn't change the fact that it ought to be the standard.

I think the bar for what is a successful season will change depending on where the team is entering said season.

For instance, Tampa Bay isn't setting the bar as to whether there season is a success at making the playoffs.

The same thing for Toronto and other teams.

But, the Sabres weren't on their either of their levels last year and they haven't made enough moves over the off season to get on their levels entering this season.

If the Sabres are 15-20 pts better than last year and miss the playoffs, I would be hard pressed to say that the season wasn't a success overall. Especially if they looks way better in the second half of the season.

 

[Buffaloed]

This team finished 22 points out of the playoffs last year.

They would have to leapfrog 5 teams to make the playoffs.

Setting the bar at making the playoffs this year is setting yourself up to be disappointed, IMO.

On the other hand, setting expectations so low that they don't bring any joy when they're met is despair.

 

[Dubi Doo]

I'm reading all the "playoffs are a must" posts and thinking that it is like expecting a 6 month old baby to run a sub 5 second 40 yard dash in the next week.

"Sorry kid, but you aren't getting that D1 scholarship by rolling over! We need to raise the bar, son!"

I don't know about other people, but my expectations are based solely on where this team *should* be going into Botts third season as a GM. Obviously the roster looks like it'll be an 85 pt team at best. Suspect goaltending, zero scoring depth, crappy bottom 6, a GM who constantly hinders the team by playing kids who dont deserve to be in the NHL etc...we're going to need a big jump from Mitts, Dahlin, Oloffson and Thompson to have dramatic improvement over last season.

 

[Dubi Doo]

I think the bar for what is a successful season will change depending on where the team is entering said season.

For instance, Tampa Bay isn't setting the bar as to whether there season is a success at making the playoffs.

The same thing for Toronto and other teams.

But, the Sabres weren't on their either of their levels last year and they haven't made enough moves over the off season to get on their levels entering this season.

If the Sabres are 15-20 pts better than last year and miss the playoffs, I would be hard pressed to say that the season wasn't a success overall. Especially if they looks way better in the second half of the season.

Agreed, the GM has failed multiple years in a row, and it's showing again. This team could be so much better with competent management.

 

[Jim Bob]

On the other hand, setting expectations so low that they don't bring any joy when they're met is despair.

That's why I would set the bar at a realistic level.

For this team it is stuff like RK being an upgrade on Phlamingo and the gap to the last playoff spot being in the single digits versus over 20 pts last season.

At least those seem like realistic targets for this season...

 

[Jim Bob]

Agreed, the GM has failed multiple years in a row, and it's showing again. This team could be so much better with competent management.

But, they have the GM that they have. You can't go back in time and change the fact that Murray was fired and Botts was hired to replace him.

I set the bar based on the team that they have entering the season and not some theoretical idea of what they could have been had Botts made different decisions since being named the GM.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

I don't know about other people, but my expectations are based solely on where this team *should* be going into Botts third season as a GM. Obviously the roster looks like it'll be an 85 pt team at best. Suspect goaltending, zero scoring depth, crappy bottom 6, a GM who constantly hinders the team by playing kids who dont deserve to be in the NHL etc...we're going to need a big jump from Mitts, Dahlin, Oloffson and Thompson to have dramatic improvement over last season.

Aren't those the kids that you think Botterill is gifting playing time to, or are you referring to other kids that supposedly don't deserve to be in the NHL?

Regardless, to significantly improve the roster now is to give away futures, which the franchise desperately needs due to wasting them through poor scouting, drafting, and trading over the last 15 years.

You do see the conundrum, I hope?

 

[itwasaforwardpass]

More than wins and losses I'm interested to see if the new coaching staff can properly evaluate its players and learn how to deploy them in a way that will allow them to succeed.

That and the development of our young players like Mitts, Olofsson, Tage, Jokiharju and others.

 

[Dubi Doo]

Aren't those the kids that you think Botterill is gifting playing time to, or are you referring to other kids that supposedly don't deserve to be in the NHL?

Regardless, to significantly improve the roster now is to give away futures, which the franchise desperately needs due to wasting them through poor scouting, drafting, and trading over the last 15 years.

You do see the conundrum, I hope?

Thompson and Mitts are who I was referring to. Last season their leash was way too long, and it's because they were Botts boys. If they show they dont belong this year, then send them down. Same for any of the other youngsters. Botts hasn't shown the ability to separate his love affair with who he hand picked and acknowledging what's best for the team now and the prospects long term.

But...if this team is going to make the playoffs the young players will have to make big strides. I have my doubts, but that's what needs to happen. I hope they do. I'm a fan first and foremost, and want to win.

 

[sabremike]

Seeing people already making excuses for this team bombing out this season is making me want to slam my fist through a wall. Eight years of seasons over by early February and people are OK with nine (in a league all but rigged so that just about every team has a postseason chance and has seen 2 bottom 3 teams in the past few years qualify the next season)?

 

[Dubi Doo]

But, they have the GM that they have. You can't go back in time and change the fact that Murray was fired and Botts was hired to replace him.

I set the bar based on the team that they have entering the season and not some theoretical idea of what they could have been had Botts made different decisions since being named the GM.

I'm going based off where the team should be when a GM is in his 3rd year and was given the pieces he had to work with. Playoffs or Botts should be fired ASAP. The roster doesn't look like a playoff roster.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Thompson and Mitts are who I was referring to. Last season their leash was way too long, and it's because they were Botts boys. If they show they dont belong this year, then send them down. Same for any of the other youngsters. Botts hasn't shown the ability to separate his love affair with who he hand picked and acknowledging what's best for the team now and the prospects long term.

But...if this team is going to make the playoffs the young players will have to make big strides. I have my doubts, but that's what needs to happen. I hope they do. I'm a fan first and foremost, and want to win.

It's debatable to say Botterill showed favoritism to Mittelstadt and Thompson, when one of them played 4th most mins of the regular Cs, and the other played even less time before being sent down...all while there was shoddy depth across the FW group. There's an argument to have put them in Rochester, but hardly enough to call it a clear case of GM bias. Look at how Botterill added to the FW group with Johansson and Vesey. Is that a GM looking to gift Mittelstadt and Thompson more time?

Even if you're totally right, playing anyone who was available in front of them doesn't move the needle for team success, because the depth was THAT bad last season, and not much better for now until draftees progress. Wanting to win is great, and robbing the future for now looks like a great effort, but it's a failed plan that has already proven itself for the worse. Filling the two biggest holes on the roster (2C and scoring RW), with the proper targets of quality young players entering their prime, would cost a massive haul that few teams could afford in trade...let alone Buffalo.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Seeing people already making excuses for this team bombing out this season is making me want to slam my fist through a wall. Eight years of seasons over by early February and people are OK with nine (in a league all but rigged so that just about every team has a postseason chance and has seen 2 bottom 3 teams in the past few years qualify the next season)?

Seeing people throw fits and clamor with stomping feet about what basically amounts to wanting more Murray type moves, which would be swinging for the fences and hitting a pop-out and further gutting the organization's future, doesn't make me want to put a fist through a wall. It makes me question why I spend time on this board.

 

[Jim Bob]

I'm going based off where the team should be when a GM is in his 3rd year and was given the pieces he had to work with. Playoffs or Botts should be fired ASAP. The roster doesn't look like a playoff roster.

You and I are looking at the question in two very different ways.

 

[Buf fan in Nash]

Success for this team right now is making the playoffs. I would be ok if we are in contention most of the year and barely miss though.