What if the Pens had 1st pick in both 2004 and 2005?

[ViD]

Hypothetically...if the Pens somehow managed to draft both Ovechkin and Crosby, what would the team and league look like now?

Would they still be on the same team, would they win more than 2 cups?

Click to read more...

 

[BayStreetBully]

Hypothetically...if the Pens somehow managed to draft both Ovechkin and Crosby, what would the team and league look like now?

Would they still be on the same team, would they win more than 2 cups?

It's possible, but Malkin is a beast in his own right. His 2009 playoffs was one of the best performances in modern times. Maybe the Penguins don't win in 2009 without Malkin either.

 

[Jumptheshark]

It's possible, but Malkin is a beast in his own right. His 2009 playoffs was one of the best performances in modern times. Maybe the Penguins don't win in 2009 without Malkin either.

and people complain about the oilers high picks with Pens getting Sid and Geno back to back!

 

[Empoleon8771]

and people complain about the oilers high picks with Pens getting Sid and Geno back to back!

That's comparing apples and oranges. The Pens had those high picks because they were bankrupt and couldn't afford to throw out a good team. The management for the Oilers is just hilariously incompetent.

To the OP, they probably would be about the same. I doubt Sid and Ovi would have played on the same line, the Pens probably would have preferred to spread out the offense on 2 lines. I don't think it would have made a significant difference to be honest, but that's ignoring that getting Ovi would have changed everything from Crosby's rookie year on. Do they get Staal in 2006 with Crosby and Ovi on the same team? I don't think so personally.

 

[hockeykicker]

id be more interested in the pens fans views of ovechkin if this happened. would the ones (not all pens fans do this) who claim he is nothing but a floater who gets lucky goals be the same ones saying he is amazing?

 

[DoobeeDoobeeDoo]

Glad we didn't. Geno was a better fit with how we were trying to rebuild. Not saying the Caps drafted the wrong player, but we wouldn't have won any Cups with Ovechkin on the team.

 

[DoobeeDoobeeDoo]

and people complain about the oilers high picks with Pens getting Sid and Geno back to back!

People were complaining about the Pens' draft picks when they were happening. It's just old news now.

 

[Kyleftlx]

Glad we didn't. Geno was a better fit with how we were trying to rebuild. Not saying the Caps drafted the wrong player, but we wouldn't have won any Cups with Ovechkin on the team.

I don't know what makes you think the Penguins wouldn't have won cups with Ovechkin on the team. He's an elite talent in his own right, and he is almost PPG in the playoffs throughout his career. I think it's silly to make statements like that.

The team would definitely be different with a core of Crosby/Ovie rather than Crosby/Malkin. Maybe it wouldn't have the cups, but maybe that core could have produced a dynasty level of success. Look at how Chicago has fared with an elite Center + an elite winger as their top two forwards in recent years. You never know.

 

[Canucks1096]

I don't know what makes you think the Penguins wouldn't have won cups with Ovechkin on the team. He's an elite talent in his own right, and he is almost PPG in the playoffs throughout his career. I think it's silly to make statements like that.

The team would definitely be different with a core of Crosby/Ovie rather than Crosby/Malkin. Maybe it wouldn't have the cups, but maybe that core could have produced a dynasty level of success. Look at how Chicago has fared with an elite Center + an elite winger as their top two forwards in recent years. You never know.

I don't think triple D comments are silly at all. Most of the Pits team lack depth. It's better to have 2 elite centers than an elite center and an elite winger. The 2 elite centers can make the four top 6 wingers produce more. Malkin 2009 playoffs his wingers was Fentenko and Talbot. They had 15 goals in totals.

If ovechkin plays with Crosby. They have no second line. Playoffs is all about depth. If ovechkin plays on the 2nd line who will be the center. If you have Sutter centering Ovechkin no way Oveckin anywhere close to 50 goals.

2016 Pits Cup they won because they had 3 scoring lines. You are not able to have 3 scoring lines If you don't have 3 offensive centers.

It is a lot easier for an elite center to carry the were own line and make it successful than an elite goal scorer.

Please don't compare ovechkin Crosby to Chi Kane and Toews. The similarities stops right there.

 

[Daximus]

The crazier thing is that they took Jordan Staal over Jonathen Toews the next year (2006). Could you imagine Geno, Crosby and Toews?
Or like the OP says a Ovi, Crosby and Toews team?
****in dynasty.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Can you even imagine the arguments over who was inflating whose stats?

The crazier thing is that they took Jordan Staal over Jonathen Toews the next year (2006). Could you imagine Geno, Crosby and Toews?
Or like the OP says a Ovi, Crosby and Toews team?
****in dynasty.

My guess is Toews' career would look a lot like Staal's if that had happened.

 

[Finnish your Czech]

the reason why pittsburgh had 3 lottery balls in the lottery for the 2005 draft was because they had not had a 1st overall pick in the past 4 drafts (and had not made the playoffs in the past 3 seasons). Maybe we have a different team drafting 1st overall in 2005 if Pittsburgh had fewer lottery balls!

Though it would be interesting to think about an OV + Crosby Penguins franchise. As good as Malkin was, he wasn't the face of the league like those two were.

 

[Canucks1096]

The crazier thing is that they took Jordan Staal over Jonathen Toews the next year (2006). Could you imagine Geno, Crosby and Toews?
Or like the OP says a Ovi, Crosby and Toews team?
****in dynasty.

Toews wouldn't be anywhere close to the player he is right now. Either Toews played on the 3rd line with Cooke and Kennedy. No way he gets 65 to 70 points playing on the 3rd line or maybe he gets switch to wing and play with Malkin or a crosby. I think Toews played some wing in College.

Toews is better than staal. Pits might had to trade Toews or Malkin because they might not been able to keep both. Or maybe pits can keep both since Toews wouldn't of been the same player.

All I know is if Toews went to Pits. He probably wouldn't of been the most overrated player in nhl history.

 

[BayStreetBully]

The crazier thing is that they took Jordan Staal over Jonathen Toews the next year (2006). Could you imagine Geno, Crosby and Toews?
Or like the OP says a Ovi, Crosby and Toews team?
****in dynasty.

Toews would probably be traded for a younger and cheaper player before they could become a dynasty. He would've priced himself out with success.

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

Perfectly happy with how things worked out. Maybe the pens win 0 cups with Crosby+Ovechkin. Pens certainly don't win in 2009 without Malkin's historical performance. Strength down the middle has been Pittsburgh's identity for the past decade and has been their biggest competitive advantage.

 

[JaegerDice]

My guess is Toews' career would look a lot like Staal's if that had happened.

Career in Pittsburgh would be similar. He'd eventually be traded for cap reasons like Staal was, but he'd likely a) not request Carolina and b) deliver bigger impact on arrival as he's clearly a far better player than Staal and a legit top 10 1C.

 

[Dylonus]

If this happens, The Penguins only have one Cup during Crosby's era; from 2016.

Malkin's 09 performance was spectacular, and Staal played a role that no one is appreciating enough; which he had to after everything the Wings did to stop Crosby.

 

[Daximus]

Can you even imagine the arguments over who was inflating whose stats?



My guess is Toews' career would look a lot like Staal's if that had happened.

Toews wouldn't be anywhere close to the player he is right now. Either Toews played on the 3rd line with Cooke and Kennedy. No way he gets 65 to 70 points playing on the 3rd line or maybe he gets switch to wing and play with Malkin or a crosby. I think Toews played some wing in College.

Toews is better than staal. Pits might had to trade Toews or Malkin because they might not been able to keep both. Or maybe pits can keep both since Toews wouldn't of been the same player.

All I know is if Toews went to Pits. He probably wouldn't of been the most overrated player in nhl history.

Was Staal ever really that good or was he getting by on his name?
The kid barely cracked a PPG in the OHL. Toews was a very good NCAA player and was putting up huge numbers at Shattuck. Staal was really good midget player. I just feel like Toews was always the better player. People just got on the Staal hype train because of his name, size and OHL.

 

[Daximus]

Toews would probably be traded for a younger and cheaper player before they could become a dynasty. He would've priced himself out with success.

If it's Geno, Sid and Toews than ya probably. If its Ovi, Sid and Toews they become a dynasty no doubt. Ovi and Sid on top line with Toews in the shutdown C role. No way anyone stops that.

 

[moropanov]

Malkin is another tier player than Ovechkin Pens would have been much worse team if Ovechkin would have been in theyr team instead of Malkin...

 

[Canucks1096]

Career in Pittsburgh would be similar. He'd eventually be traded for cap reasons like Staal was, but he'd likely a) not request Carolina and b) deliver bigger impact on arrival as he's clearly a far better player than Staal and a legit top 10 1C.

Pits didn't trade Staal for cap reasons. They traded him because he wouldn't resign. He wanted to play with Eric. Pits offered him 10ys 60 million and Staal rejected that offer.

Toews offer would of been a little more than that but lot less than 10.5 M. I think Pits could found a way to keep all 3 Crosby Toews Malkin.

 

[OilTastic]

and people complain about the oilers high picks with Pens getting Sid and Geno back to back!

That's comparing apples and oranges. The Pens had those high picks because they were bankrupt and couldn't afford to throw out a good team. The management for the Oilers is just hilariously incompetent.

The management for the Oilers was just hilariously incompetent. isn't anymore, and before people go pointing to the Oilers record this past season and say...."bad record = incompetent", remember the huge mess the new management had to clean up last year and is still cleaning up now ! Rome wasn't built in a day as far as turning the Oilers into a winner goes. and to the OP i think when teams win multiple cups, the "how good would they be if they drafted so and so" is kind of irrelevant because the cups have been won and that was the goal. mission accomplished.

 

[DearDiary]

The crazier thing is that they took Jordan Staal over Jonathen Toews the next year (2006). Could you imagine Geno, Crosby and Toews?
Or like the OP says a Ovi, Crosby and Toews team?
****in dynasty.

Playing 3rd line center hurt Staal's development. There's no way Toews becomes the player he is today spending all of his early years in the bottom 6

 

[Canucks1096]

Playing 3rd line center hurt Staal's development. There's no way Toews becomes the player he is today spending all of his early years in the bottom 6

Agree. As of today Staal never developed into an high end offensive center. Stall been in the nhl for 10 years. Chances are he never will.

Toews would of played with Cooke and Kennedy. Staal reg linemates. Big downgrade from Sharp and Kane

 

[DoobeeDoobeeDoo]

I don't know what makes you think the Penguins wouldn't have won cups with Ovechkin on the team. He's an elite talent in his own right, and he is almost PPG in the playoffs throughout his career. I think it's silly to make statements like that.

The team would definitely be different with a core of Crosby/Ovie rather than Crosby/Malkin. Maybe it wouldn't have the cups, but maybe that core could have produced a dynasty level of success. Look at how Chicago has fared with an elite Center + an elite winger as their top two forwards in recent years. You never know.

He would've hurt our line depth & hindered Sid's development as a playmaker.