What can AA get in a trade?

[njx9]

The more I think about AA< the more I hope we trade him soon. I think he's soured on the organization (rightly or wrongly) and I don't think anyone connected to the team is ever going to get him to fully buy into just about anything. He is exactly what he'll always be, here.

But I'd guess if he goes someplace else, and they don't play quite as much contractual hardball, and they don't jerk around his minutes as much, he'll end up putting in more effort and look like a better player (though the lazy, me-first crap will always be right under the surface).

I dunno. I don't think his value will ever go up, and I don't think he'll ever contribute the way this team wants him to. Send him out for whatever we can get and move on. I'll be sad if he's a better player at his next stop, but I just don't think he'll ever be that player here.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Honestly if i were an NHL gm I'd be all over a player with that description. A player most gms seem to have zero faith in. He has the kind of talents you can't teach, and the place he's most lacking tends to come with age. I know he's not a teenager anymore, but maturity still keeps coming to some people, even until 30. He has time to flip the switch. He just needs the right atmosphere, the right coach. The right mindset. And that's a bet with very high potential payoff.

Yeah, as a waiver wire pickup. OR a conditional 6th/7th. No GM in his right mind would give up any asset of remote value for an AA who's head is so firmly up his ass.

For all his production in little time... he's REALLY unproductive when you look at his talent vs. the players that he's up against. 33 total points with a very large chunk of his time coming against third line players (not checking line guys who are defensively responsible, nor all situation top 6ers). And AA's quality of linemates doesn't even really matter that much because how many times is he just scoring on the rush no passes? He's not using them at all, so it doesn't really matter that he'd be playing with Luke Glendening and Martin Frk.

 

[Frk It]

Not quite sure why that's such a problem. We're not asking for a top10 pick here. A late first for a guy who outproduces most people taken in the 2nd round.

I'd imagine there is probably some whispers among coaches he is not the easiest guy to deal with.

 

[Flowah]

I'd imagine there is probably some whispers among coaches he is not the easiest guy to deal with.

That sounds like something else. Not inconsistency. Plenty of inconsistent players who aren't uncoachable.

 

[Frk It]

That sounds like something else. Not inconsistency. Plenty of inconsistent players who aren't uncoachable.

I like AA... but how many years has it been where he has the same issues now?

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Even with his consistency issues he's damn productive. And with limited minutes too.

Not quite sure why that's such a problem. We're not asking for a top10 pick here. A late first for a guy who outproduces most people taken in the 2nd round.

Even with his consistency issues? That's why he's not worth a damn. NHL teams value game-in, game-out consistency. It's why a guy like Alexei Kovalev, who while being one of the most skilled players in the league his entire career, got booted around the league from team to team.

Teams want guys who will fit in a system and become more than the sum of the parts. Like the Russian 5 were 5 fabulously talented hockey players individually... and then they played together and it was like ice dancing with sticks.

If you can't trust a guy to give an honest effort, then it doesn't matter how talented he is. And I mean, let's slow down on the "limited minutes" thing. He had 15 a night this year. While it's not 20 and he's not a top line guy... that's a sizable chunk of minutes for a guy down the lineup. He scored at about a 0.5 ppg rate in 9 minutes. And then he scored at a 0.5 ppg rate in 15 minutes.

Andreas Athanasiou is a player who should be a hell of a lot more than he is. Physical tools wise, he should be a star. But he's not. Teams see that.

 

[DRW204]

32OA

 

[Flowah]

I like AA... but how many years has it been where he has the same issues now?

Right.

I'm not saying he's not uncoachable.

I'm just saying that's different from saying teams are turned off by his inconsistency.

 

[TatarTangle]

A 2nd

He's a headache, it's just how badly you want to deal with it

 

[masta8]

Yeah, cause nothing fixes laziness and a lack of hockey IQ like training camp and exhibition games. I wouldn't hold out much hope for the Creedence.

What about working on defensive awareness, getting in game shape and chemistry with linemates?

 

[masta8]

Well, considering how lengthy the last arbitration was, I don't hold out hope.

Last year he didn't have arbitration rights..

 

[MikeyDee]

Last year he didn't have arbitration rights..

That's right, I should have said contract talks.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

What about working on defensive awareness, getting in game shape and chemistry with linemates?

Seeing as he didn't make much improvement in those areas (apart from maybe conditioning) over the 71 games he did play last year, I doubt that three extra weeks would have made a difference.

 

[masta8]

Seeing as he didn't make much improvement in those areas (apart from maybe conditioning) over the 71 games he did play last year, I doubt that three extra weeks would have made a difference.

True, exhibitions aren't about improving areas of their game and getting prepared for the season as soon as possible. No point in even having training camp and exhibition games they should just skip them! And he probably didn't improve much on his chemistry with teammates because he had different line mates every few games, not many players had great chemistry as line mates either.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

True, exhibitions aren't about improving areas of their game and getting prepared for the season as soon as possible. No point in even having training camp and exhibition games they should just skip them! And he probably didn't improve much on his chemistry with teammates because he had different line mates every few games, not many players had great chemistry as line mates either.

Website was having issues for me.

But... it's not the Red Wings fault that AA missed training camp. That's not a positive for him that he missed last year. The Wings offered him a fair deal as shown by the other RFAs in his same boat all signing pretty much the same 2/3 year 1.9-2.1M contract. That whole holdout last year? That's on AA, not Detroit.

And he kept getting kicked around because he never put in the requisite effort to stay in the lineup or stay out of the doghouse.

Larkin stayed on a top line. Mantha stayed on a top line. I wonder how those guys were able to do so.

Seriously, stop making excuses for AA. If he would get his head out of his ass and put in that level of effort every night that he did in his 20 min+ outings, we're not having this discussion and he's getting a contract on the level of Leon Draisaitl. I think he's physically that good. His mentality and hockey IQ are woefully lacking and so he's a spare part with flashes of greatness as opposed to a star.

 

[rhef3]

If he isn't moved friday, he won't be moved for some time.
my 2 cents

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

A 2nd rounder is probably the most We can hope for. For AA.

 

[odin1981]

I would live with a 2nd rounder if some team in the first half of the second round was offering it. Though by pick 50 I would have to decline. By the time this team turns it around he won't be needed.

 

[masta8]

Website was having issues for me.

But... it's not the Red Wings fault that AA missed training camp. That's not a positive for him that he missed last year. The Wings offered him a fair deal as shown by the other RFAs in his same boat all signing pretty much the same 2/3 year 1.9-2.1M contract. That whole holdout last year? That's on AA, not Detroit.

And he kept getting kicked around because he never put in the requisite effort to stay in the lineup or stay out of the doghouse.

Larkin stayed on a top line. Mantha stayed on a top line. I wonder how those guys were able to do so.

Seriously, stop making excuses for AA. If he would get his head out of his ass and put in that level of effort every night that he did in his 20 min+ outings, we're not having this discussion and he's getting a contract on the level of Leon Draisaitl. I think he's physically that good. His mentality and hockey IQ are woefully lacking and so he's a spare part with flashes of greatness as opposed to a star.

Sorry last time I checked this was an opinionated forum? You make it seem like what I'm saying is always false or wrong but that is not the case. I'm sorry I am the fan of a player on the Red Wings who I enjoy watching? You can talk s*** about him all you want that is your opinion on him but don't say I make excuses for him. He is still one of our better offensive players and if you don't agree, you don't watch hockey. Larkin did not play on the top line, he was always 2nd line behind Z. Mantha also played games where he was not top 6, so nice try there too. And about the doghouse, it is obvious that Blashill wants effort from his players, but playing some guys more minutes then AA is hilarious when don't bring much to the table.

 

[ShelbyZ]

playing some guys more minutes then AA is hilarious when don't bring much to the table.

I mean.... that's kind of a two way street... Depending on the table. If the table requires fore/backchecking and defensive play, AA is definitely bringing less to the table than some of those guys that got more minutes.

 

[masta8]

I mean.... that's kind of a two way street... Depending on the table. If the table requires fore/backchecking and defensive play, AA is definitely bringing less to the table than some of those guys that got more minutes.

Except AA is the only one I notice that consistently gets negative feedback about his game. Every player has flaws and I agree his effort is certainly below average, but he also brings a lot to the table that other Red Wings who play more don't provide.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Except AA is the only one I notice that consistently gets negative feedback about his game. Every player has flaws and I agree his effort is certainly below average, but he also brings a lot to the table that other Red Wings who play more don't provide.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/s...s-anthony-mantha-andreas-athanasiou/32785007/

Jeff Blashill: Red Wings' Andreas Athanasiou needs higher compete level

At every turn, Blashill says "when he's engaged, he's fantastic. The problem is, he's not engaged enough."

You are making excuses because if he was out of sorts because he missed training camp? That's his ****ing problem. If you want to be on a top line and be leaned on for twenty minutes a night and be a star in this league? You need to play your ass off every night.

There isn't a "oh, well I'm better than Abdelkader so I should be playing." With AA's skillset, it is a travesty that he lets himself not be a top 6 forward by not putting in the effort.

You have me wrong. I don't think that AA is a horse-crap hockey player. At least not AA when he's engaged. He rightfully deserves a top 6 spot when he plays with fire. The issue is he doesn't play with fire. And when you don't play with fire and consistency, you don't get the breaks that a player who does those things gets. I'm pissed about AA because I think he's pissing away his hockey career by not giving a damn. And I think the best way that you get him to give a damn isn't to coddle him and say "Oh, you're better than Abby, take a top 6 spot." It's "you skate your ****ing ass off and make plays or you'll be stapled to the damn bench."

I point it like you are "wrong" or whatever when you're using horsecrap logic to defend it. AA's trouble is effort and not showing up. The conversation shouldn't be "oh, if he had training camp to develop chemistry and such", it should be about how he missed training camp of his own volition for something he was entirely in the wrong for. He had a very indefensible holdout and he clearly "lost" the negotiation when he played for 1.35M when he was asking for 2.5

And it is opinion and I'm of the opinion that a team is better off without a "one of the best offensive players on the roster" if he's not going to play defense, if he's not going to show up and give an effort, and if he's not going to operate within the offensive system. For my opinion, even though I want him to be, even if AA is one of the best offensive players the Wings had... he's not good enough to be worth the nonsense he brings. He reminds me of the C level player who plays down at an E league game. Yeah, he's better than the rest of the slapnuts he's on lines with, but he knows it and he plays hero hockey. While that can work at beer league, AA's just not a good enough hockey player to have it work consistently at the NHL. I would be more willing to accept "well, that's my opinion" and not respond like I do if the tenor of the argument wasn't "oh, he's better than Abby and Abby gets more time and that's not fair."

The Wings would be a far more interesting team to watch if they had a bunch of pieces that meshed together and played the same system. A guy like AA doesn't. He's a Cadillac on a team of Tauruses.

 

[masta8]

Strong criticism hits home for Red Wings’ Anthony Mantha, Andreas Athanasiou

Jeff Blashill: Red Wings' Andreas Athanasiou needs higher compete level

At every turn, Blashill says "when he's engaged, he's fantastic. The problem is, he's not engaged enough."

You are making excuses because if he was out of sorts because he missed training camp? That's his ****ing problem. If you want to be on a top line and be leaned on for twenty minutes a night and be a star in this league? You need to play your ass off every night.

There isn't a "oh, well I'm better than Abdelkader so I should be playing." With AA's skillset, it is a travesty that he lets himself not be a top 6 forward by not putting in the effort.

You have me wrong. I don't think that AA is a horse-crap hockey player. At least not AA when he's engaged. He rightfully deserves a top 6 spot when he plays with fire. The issue is he doesn't play with fire. And when you don't play with fire and consistency, you don't get the breaks that a player who does those things gets. I'm pissed about AA because I think he's pissing away his hockey career by not giving a damn. And I think the best way that you get him to give a damn isn't to coddle him and say "Oh, you're better than Abby, take a top 6 spot." It's "you skate your ****ing ass off and make plays or you'll be stapled to the damn bench."

I point it like you are "wrong" or whatever when you're using horsecrap logic to defend it. AA's trouble is effort and not showing up. The conversation shouldn't be "oh, if he had training camp to develop chemistry and such", it should be about how he missed training camp of his own volition for something he was entirely in the wrong for. He had a very indefensible holdout and he clearly "lost" the negotiation when he played for 1.35M when he was asking for 2.5

And it is opinion and I'm of the opinion that a team is better off without a "one of the best offensive players on the roster" if he's not going to play defense, if he's not going to show up and give an effort, and if he's not going to operate within the offensive system. For my opinion, even though I want him to be, even if AA is one of the best offensive players the Wings had... he's not good enough to be worth the nonsense he brings. He reminds me of the C level player who plays down at an E league game. Yeah, he's better than the rest of the slapnuts he's on lines with, but he knows it and he plays hero hockey. While that can work at beer league, AA's just not a good enough hockey player to have it work consistently at the NHL. I would be more willing to accept "well, that's my opinion" and not respond like I do if the tenor of the argument wasn't "oh, he's better than Abby and Abby gets more time and that's not fair."

The Wings would be a far more interesting team to watch if they had a bunch of pieces that meshed together and played the same system. A guy like AA doesn't. He's a Cadillac on a team of Tauruses.

Well as two Red Wings fans lets hope everything works out to benefit the Red Wings either by trading him for an asset that will help us or he produces like he is capable which I believe will happen this season.

 

[SCD]

Strong criticism hits home for Red Wings’ Anthony Mantha, Andreas Athanasiou

He's a Cadillac on a team of Tauruses.

He is not a Cadillac. Maybe a pimped out Nova with a 350. Flashy and quick, but no Cadillac.

Maybe the Sharks would be interested. They made it work for the time being with E Kane.

 

[Ezekial]

I really would like to see one of AA or Nyquist moved on Friday. Nyquist moreso, but I'd love to add another pick in that range.