Wennberg and Torts have a...thing....

[PatrikBerglund]

Wennberg lost lost everything he had going for him after last season, not sure how how can become that bad in such a short time period - as a, what, 23-year old?

 

[spintheblackcircle]

Wennberg lost lost everything he had going for him after last season, not sure how how can become that bad in such a short time period - as a, what, 23-year old?

He's definitely had a down year, but to be fair, he is a plus 25. He's not making enough happening offensively, but usually he's a really good defensive player. (except last night, and Torts was right to light into him if he reacted that way)

 

[Dr Quincy]

I sure will question if someone has ever played a team sports if they find a coach yelling at a player (especially in professional sports) as something unusual. Nothing cliched or illogical about coming to this conclusion.

Unusual? No. Pointless? Yes.

The cliche is the idea that yelling will somehow get better performance.
The illogic is that somehow your 4th grade gym class bombardment heroics = professional sports and imparts on you some great wisdom that everyone who disagrees with your lacks.

 

[anteater90]

Strangely, those of us that watch every CBJ game were thinking how strange it was to see Torts loose it like that on the bench. That has been a rare sight in Columbus since he has been here. On the second hand my wife was yelling at Wennberg for the same horrible done low coverage that a Peewee or Bantam should know better on to take care of it.

 

[Dr Quincy]

Wennberg lost lost everything he had going for him after last season, not sure how how can become that bad in such a short time period - as a, what, 23-year old?

Because player's careers aren't linear. There are peaks and valleys that don't follow the mythical "Get better every year for the first 6 years, hold steady for the next 4 years, then decline every year for the last 7."

 

[IamNotADancer]

Unusual? No. Pointless? Yes.

The cliche is the idea that yelling will somehow get better performance.
The illogic is that somehow your 4th grade gym class bombardment heroics = professional sports and imparts on you some great wisdom that everyone who disagrees with your lacks.

Never made any comments on the effectiveness of yelling at players. That's you reading things that aren't there. Of course you fall back into ad hominem attacks, but apparently you were triggered by my differing opinion, ironically enough.

Funny that you agree with me that it isn't unusual for a coach to yell at his player. Which is exactly what I said and anyone who has played team sports or even watches a lot of sports will notice right away. But you go ahead and act all offended.

Go ahead, try and convince Columbus fans of your opinion about whether Wennberg deserved to be yelled at by Torts or not. I'll step back and let others decide what you come off as.

Enjoy your stay.

 

[IamNotADancer]

Strangely, those of us that watch every CBJ game were thinking how strange it was to see Torts loose it like that on the bench. That has been a rare sight in Columbus since he has been here. On the second hand my wife was yelling at Wennberg for the same horrible done low coverage that a Peewee or Bantam should know better on to take care of it.

Careful now, I know you are a Columbus fan but you are supposed to hate Torts' antics and believe that he was completely out of line for yelling at the poor Wennberg who simply had enough of that poopoo clown Torts!

 

[sr edler]

They're like father and son.

 

[Dr Quincy]

I read this...

Coaches, regardless of who it is, will need to yell at their players once in a while to simply wake them up.

Then I read this...

Never made any comments on the effectiveness of yelling at players. That's you reading things that aren't there

So it's "needed" but "not effective"?

And nothing about my post was an ad hominem. I attacked your argument, which was an appeal to authority based on your stated long athletic history (which was unspecificed and unsubstantiated, but that's ok).

 

[IamNotADancer]

I read this...

Then I read this...


So it's "needed" but "not effective"?

Glad you ignored the "once in a while" part.

 

[paragon]

And just to address something real quick, as a professional you get paid to put up with crap until your superiors decide you will have to deal with a different sort of "crap".

In almost every other profession that kind of yelling would get you fired for breaking work safety regulations. I was in the army at the time when they banned yelling at recruits (also punitive actions like making recruits do pushups and group punishments) because the generals deemed they displayed lack of leadership skills, created an unhealthy working environment and was unnecessary to training. It was a hard to change the old habits, because the army has the same kind of macho culture that sports have. It was over 15 years ago and you can still read frequently in the newspapers how some officers have been fined for yelling or insulting recruits in training.

If women were more involved with hockey yelling would have already been banned in hockey. For example it happend with the Finnish womens ice hockey team. In the last 4 years they removed 4 players for "bullying". All of them were older old school players. Three of them later returned to the team. One of the removed players was the goalie Räty who was used to playing with men and acted like Lundqvist, constantly berating her defensemen for their mistakes. She was back with the team in the Olympics and said in an interview (I'm paraphrasing): "You can't talk to women like you talk to men, you have to be more subtle, if you attack women the same way you attack men they will just build a wall and become unresponsive to feedback." While men are more tolerant of getting yelled at, there's a limit to how much abuse even men are willing to take. At that point players tune the coach out and veterans like Brett Hull teach rookies to tell the coach to "F** off" like happened with Hitchcock.

It's safe to say players know when they screw up. They are already feeling bad about it when they skate to the bench so what is the point of yelling? It accomplishes absolutely nothing positive.

This all might just be a cultural difference, it's legal to beat your kids with your fists in the States when all corporeal punishment to kids has been illegal here for over 30 years and 50 years in Sweden. The p***yfication has run it's course and now you just have to deal with soft Euros like Wennberg who laugh at coaches screaming at them.

 

[stl76]

Dudes a basket case. Act like a grown man when youre speaking to anyone, let alone someone whos young enough to be your son.

Pretty sure Torts’ actual son is a special forces operator. Torts is also a very successful NHL coach. It’s almost as if he knows how to push young men to get the very best out of them...

 

[Ryuji Yamazaki]

Torts is a moron.

Him and Patrick Roy should make a baby so he can win the Worst Human Being on the Planet award.

 

[stl76]

Torts is a moron.

Him and Patrick Roy should make a baby so he can win the Worst Human Being on the Planet award.

Yeah man, any kid of Tortorella’s would be such a terrible human being!

"We hope, and we pray": Tortorella's son following his passion | NHL.com

 

[Crede777]

Wennberg deserved it. He messed up on a simple defensive assignment. Also despite being hounded to shoot all season he still refuses.

 

[Ryuji Yamazaki]

Yeah man, any kid of Tortorella’s would be such a terrible human being!

"We hope, and we pray": Tortorella's son following his passion | NHL.com

Is there any relevance to this?

 

[PensandCaps]

Found my new favourite player. Maybe he'll wanna join the pens, so he can beat Torts every year.

 

[Dr Quincy]

Glad you ignored the "once in a while" part.

What difference does that make? Why is yelling needed once in awhile? If you are saying now that it is needed "once in awhile" then you have indeed commented on the effectiveness. Make up your mind. Is it needed and or effective, at least once in awhile, or isn't it? And what proof do you have that it is needed or effective, once in awhile?

 

[IamNotADancer]

In almost every other profession that kind of yelling would get you fired for breaking work safety regulations. I was in the army at the time when they banned yelling at recruits (also punitive actions like making recruits do pushups and group punishments) because the generals deemed they displayed lack of leadership skills, created an unhealthy working environment and was unnecessary to training. It was a hard to change the old habits, because the army has the same kind of macho culture that sports have. It was over 15 years ago and you can still read frequently in the newspapers how some officers have been fined for yelling or insulting recruits in training.

If women were more involved with hockey yelling would have already been banned in hockey. For example it happend with the Finnish womens ice hockey team. In the last 4 years they removed 4 players for "bullying". All of them were older old school players. Three of them later returned to the team. One of the removed players was the goalie Räty who was used to playing with men and acted like Lundqvist, constantly berating her defensemen for their mistakes. She was back with the team in the Olympics and said in an interview (I'm paraphrasing): "You can't talk to women like you talk to men, you have to be more subtle, if you attack women the same way you attack men they will just build a wall and become unresponsive to feedback." While men are more tolerant of getting yelled at, there's a limit to how much abuse even men are willing to take. At

that point players tune the coach out and veterans like Brett Hull teach rookies to tell the coach to "F** off" like happened with Hitchcock.

It's safe to say players know when they screw up. They are already feeling bad about it when they skate to the bench so what is the point of yelling? It accomplishes absolutely nothing positive.
This all might just be a cultural difference, it's legal to beat your kids with your fists in the States when all corporeal punishment to kids has been illegal here for over 30 years and 50 years in Sweden. The p***yfication has run it's course and now you just have to deal with soft Euros like Wennberg who laugh at coaches screaming at them.

Mole meet mountain.

Jeez.. you have a problem with screaming and fear for the well-being of a professional who might suffer "mental abuse" over the coach telling him he screwed up. Just stop watching sports all together.

What difference does that make? Why is yelling needed once in awhile? If you are saying now that it is needed "once in awhile" then you have indeed commented on the effectiveness. Make up your mind. Is it needed and or effective, at least once in awhile, or isn't it? And what proof do you have that it is needed or effective, once in awhile?

Sometimes it's needed, sometimes it isn't, sometimes it's effective, sometimes it isn't.
So no, I didn't comment on how effective it is, I commented that once in a while it is needed. Not that hard to understand.

There is no black and white, it all depends on the parties involved.

Weren't you the one that said "player's careers aren't linear"?
So if player careers aren't linear i.e. black and white, human behavior IS?

Can't have it both ways. Don't take it the wrong way but I'm not getting much from trying to debate you. Have fun here.

 

[paragon]

Jeez.. you have a problem with screaming and fear for the well-being of a professional who might suffer "mental abuse" over the coach telling him he screwed up. Just stop watching sports all together.

Going by your analogy, if you have a problem with people disagreeing with you on forums maybe you should stop posting on forums.

 

[IamNotADancer]

Going by your analogy, if you have a problem with people disagreeing with you on forums maybe you should stop posting on forums.

What gave you the impression I have a problem with people disagreeing with me?

Disagree all you want, I still find the notion that "screaming doesn't belong into (professional) sports" silly.

Why don't you ask the many Blue Jackets fans in here if Wennbergs talking to was warranted or not. Perhaps they are better targets for your asinine revelations about your views on the "p***yfication of America" and the effects it has on Wennberg.

 

[avsfan09]

I sure will question if someone has ever played a team sports if they find a coach yelling at a player (especially in professional sports) as something unusual. Nothing cliched or illogical about coming to this conclusion.

It's not that it's unusual but it has to be done sparingly or else players will lose respect and check out. If you almost never lose your cool players will respect the moments when you do so much more. The best coaches I've have spoken to me outside the heat of the moment and explained to me what I had to do to become better rather than the things I did wrong or lambasting mistakes in front of teammates.

 

[IamNotADancer]

It's not that it's unusual but it has to be done sparingly or else players will lose respect and check out. If you almost never lose your cool players will respect the moments when you do so much more. The best coaches I've have spoken to me outside the heat of the moment and explained to me what I had to do to become better rather than the things I did wrong or lambasting mistakes in front of teammates.

Fair enough. But apparently, according to Jackets fans, Torts really piped down which is why, at least to me (and Jackets fans in this thread), Wennberg's reaction looks really bad.

 

[The Jones Zone]

He's definitely had a down year, but to be fair, he is a plus 25. He's not making enough happening offensively, but usually he's a really good defensive player. (except last night, and Torts was right to light into him if he reacted that way)

Yes He has had a rough year, and still 11th in the league in + -

He has more to give, but will we ever see it

 

[Hello Johnny]

This thread is f***ing hilarious. People act like they know Torts personally. He has been cool as a cucumber here in Columbus, almost as if he's gone vegan, converted to Buddhism, and started smoking weed. This is the first time I've seen him lose his cool on one of his players and it's because Wennberg 100% deserved it.