Pre-Game Talk: Week of postponement and the blues.... and the B-Lose×2... maybe?

[flyfysher]

12th forward. Good Pk guy, better wing than C. Overpaid.

I read this post of yours first and thought this guy could be a scout. Succinct and right to the point. Then I read your post below re Graves. A lot more detailed. Liked your analysis. Give credit to the coaches for developing Graves especially after his tough start to his season.

 

[McJedi]

I'll take Nemeth over Graves. Consistency is incredibly important especially when youre being paired with young puck movers.

I'm a diehard Nemeth fan though, second only to @21.

Nemeth has managed zero takeaways this year. That’s nearly impossible to be that ineffective in the takeaway category in 39 games as an nhl defender this season. He hasn’t been much of a shot blocker either for such a bad team. To call him a defensive upgrade on Graves is nonsensical. I do hope he’s better at dzone passing than Graves.

 

[Foppa2118]

Dude c'mon, his point was pretty fair and obvious. Why the f*** should vaccinated players be required to follow league rules, if the society around them is moving on with life? That was the whole point. Now, if there's differences between team vaccinations inside divisions, I think that's a reason to keep those rules up.

The better question is why does Robin Lehner get to NOT follow the rules?

NHL teams just started getting vaccinated in March. The Avs just got vaccinated a week ago. It's only around 80% effective after the first dose, and it takes around 14 days for it to take effect.

Since Lehner and Vegas are in the Avs division, what he wants is special treatment that allows him to do whatever he wants, while everyone else follows the rules, so they don't keep postponing games or risking the season.

The NHL and NHLPA also haven't been tracking who's taken the vaccine, so they don't have any idea what the level of protection is. Another common sense factor that Lehner is completely ignoring for his own benefit.

He was also factually wrong in saying that the NHL is forcing them to take vaccines, and that they lied about easing the restrictions once they reached a certain threshold. He just jumped to conclusions based on a print out of the benefits found from NBA teams reaching a certain vaccine threshold.

Which my guess is they gave to him because he's probably a paranoid wacko who was thinking about refusing the vaccine.

 

[McJedi]

I read this post of yours first and thought this guy could be a scout. Succinct and right to the point. Then I read your post below re Graves. A lot more detailed. Liked your analysis. Give credit to the coaches for developing Graves especially after his tough start to his season.

JTC isn’t my favorite, but he’s been more effective in the second half of the season. He’s looked competent as a fourth line RW. He is doing his job at least. He’s cut down on the turnovers too.

I hate him on the PP, but his PK work is an area for some accolades. It’s still my long shot hope Seattle takes him. But they’ll take Graves or Donny.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

Graves played some great hockey the past several weeks. He does lay a stinker every five games or so. His defense Is a big big upgrade over nemeth. Ryan has great stick work and has done wonderfully defecting passes and cutting off passing lanes. Much more physical in front of his net. He’s made huge strides over the lousy performance we saw from him (and Cole) in the bubble. His passing leaves a lot to be desired. Cole was so damn dreadful in the bubble, I’m still not over that, but graves didn’t cover himself in glory either last playoffs.

Graves is a good skater and very willing shot blocker. Using his large body and stick length to his advantage. Teams don’t attack him at all. Unless he has the puck.

He’s having a solid second season as he’s emerged as a significantly better defender than he was last year. The offense isn’t there though. He’s a very good bottom pair guy.

Nemeth is better off as a healthy scratch once Byram, and hopefully EJ are back. He kinda sucks. There is a reason Dallas waived him. He’s gotten moderately better since then. Calling him an important deadline acquisition is like calling Soda a good 3C. It’s hyperbole. These guys are best used as healthy scratch depth when the Avs are more healthy.

Graves has definitely regressed from last season. He’s playing with more panic in his game and gets caught pinching on a regular basis in games. He has a real hard time moving the puck and sometimes takes away the goaltenders eyes when he tries to block shots.

I admire your loyalty to the guy, but he’s struggled a fair amount this year.

I honestly think Nemeth might bring more consistency. I’m not saying he’s great, or anything, but neither is Graves.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

You smoke crack like I do?

I'm sure there's stylistic differences.

I prefer freebase

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

 

[The Abusement Park]

Makes sense. Probably don’t want to mess with JTC as he’s been working well on the 4th line and this is a good chance to give Kaut some meaningful minutes.

 

[Foppa2118]

I guess you could give him some PP time in the 2nd unit?

They could but they basically haven't done that all year. Byram has really only gone out at the end of power plays after the first two units had their shot.

Even when both Makar and Girard were out of the lineup earlier in the year, they went with Toews on the first unit, and Timmins for some reason on the second unit.

Hopefully if they rest guys like G and Toews down the stretch, they'll give Bo a bigger role on the PP. Even if he doesn't get any points, giving him that time with the puck to make plays can really boost a player's confidence.

 

[AvsMakar08]

Pretty sure Lehner is mad about the "lying" part and not so much the "vaccine" one. So its understandable that he's a little upset.
I agree with the rest of your post. Play Fortnite and stfu!

Lehner has a very short temper.

 

[the_fan]

Screw Vegas and that urine soaked overrated city

 

[EscapedGoat]

Yes, they make a shit ton of money. I still think they have a right to complain about their work

Yep.

Anytime you have humans working for other humans, you're going to have anger, in my opinion.

Whether you're making 25 grande a year or 2.5 million a year, people simply don't like being told what to do.

I've gone from working tons of minimum wage jobs, worked up to a mid range salary and now make a pretty decent living. The one thing that has been consistent the entire time? "My boss is an idiot".

 

[Ararana]

My god outside of the two Vegas games the Avs remaining schedule is paper soft.

 

[dahrougem2]

My god outside of the two Vegas games the Avs remaining schedule is paper soft.

Coyotes 3-7-0 their last 10
Blues 3-6-1
Sharks 2-7-1
Kings 4-6-0

This "race" for 4th is ****ing hilarious

 

[Richard88]

“Trapped in a prison.”

Seriously?

Does Lehner not realize that it’s not just hockey players that are dealing with this shit?

The guy is a millionaire probably living in a mansion and is whining about having to take a vaccine and work under COVID restrictions. Everybody has had to adjust their lives. Do your part, Robin. A lot of people are worse off.

Making more money doesn't mean that a person is suddenly immune from feeling emotions. If your employer lied straight to your face you'd be pretty upset about it too I'd imagine.

 

[Richard88]

I know gov't agencies, politicians, and large companies just don't want to be wrong on the whole vaccine front and that is why they don't want to let up restrictions because of the fear of the unknown on variants... but people quickly see through things and it causes unnecessary backlash and legitimate criticism against the vaccine if things don't open back up. All it creates is more people against the vaccine because they won't open things up anyway so why be a first adopter so to speak. Lehner is speaking the truth. I don't know when they got vaccinated, but once the proper time has passed, the restrictions should at very least be eased, if not lifted entirely. The best marketing for the vaccine is simply get the shot, and in 2-6 weeks, you can go back to normal life with concerts, gatherings, bars, restaurants, seeing grandparents and loved ones... that should be the goal. Not a get the shot and we will stay like this for 6-12 more months to make sure everything is golden.

If you have to take an experimental vaccine to get back to normal, you're not going back to normal.

 

[Richard88]

 

[Richard88]

This is a beautiful post, two very positive tweets in one.

Great that O'Connor is back. Not just for hockey reasons, but with regards to the expansion draft it'll also be useful to have him hit the exposure requirements (he needs another 5 games played to reach the 27 game threshold) as that would open up the possibility of trading a forward pre-expansion.

Kaut getting called up makes sense given that Rantanen and Donskoi are both out.

 

[Richard88]

Last time I checked, vaccines weren't forced on anyone, unless you live in an communist country. If Robin doesn't want to take it, he doesn't have to.

Technically not true.... the US Supreme Court has upheld mandatory vaccinations. Unlikely that this would ever be made mandatory, but states and localities are free to pass mandatory vaccination laws.

In this case, the NHLPA and NHL can collectively bargain to make it mandatory if they want. They didn't and they won't... so Lehner doesn't have to have it, but the NHL is strongly encouraging players to do so.

^ US is a communist country confirmed

 

[Richard88]

If Rantanen, Donskoi, Byram, and Grubauer are out (along with Johnson + Francouz), I'd guess the lineup will look something like this:


Landeskog --- Mackinnon --- Burakovsky
Soderberg ------- Kadri -------- Saad
Nichuskin -------- Jost --------- Kaut
Compher ------ Bellemare ---- O'Connor

Toews ---- Girard
Graves --- Makar
Nemeth - MacDonald/Timmins

Dubnyk
Johansson

Could possibly see Saad and Kaut swap places too, given that Saad looked good with Jost last game.

 

[McJedi]

Graves has definitely regressed from last season. He’s playing with more panic in his game and gets caught pinching on a regular basis in games. He has a real hard time moving the puck and sometimes takes away the goaltenders eyes when he tries to block shots.

I admire your loyalty to the guy, but he’s struggled a fair amount this year.

I honestly think Nemeth might bring more consistency. I’m not saying he’s great, or anything, but neither is Graves.

Graves was never great with the puck. His best attributes are defensive. His long stick, his size, his skating ability, his shot blocking willingness. He blocks the goalie because he’s big and his body deflects or affects a ton of shots. I like Graves for his defense. He is a defender after all. Bednar plays him around 20 minutes a game so coach sees the same things I notice and the haters are too busy hissy fitting over puck moving, which isn’t the core need of a defender.

The Avs have two elite puck movers on the back end. Two more very good ones in Byram and Toews. We’re a fan base that has a skewed idea of what a defender can do. We’re covered twice over with puck moving Dmen. We’re way short on big bodies that can actually skate (Graves).

try watching a non Avs game. Watch the next Kings vs Yotes game and you’ll see most defenders are more like Cole, EJ and Graves than Makar and Girard.

EJ must have made 250 hospital passes to Sam last year. But he’s good in his own end. Graves is similar. But a hell of a lot more durable than China doll EJ.

EJ really left the Avs in a tough spot with his inability to stay healthy. He’s very likely washed up and done at this point. What a massive waste of cap space for an elite team. Avs are lucky Graves has been able to fill that void because as much as I love Makar and Girard, they don’t do the physical part of a defenders job. And you can’t skate your way out of every defensive responsibility. Sometimes you gotta just cross check the bastard in front of the net until his kidneys hurt too much to stand there. Graves doing that a lot more this year.

 

[MarkT]

Making more money doesn't mean that a person is suddenly immune from feeling emotions. If your employer lied straight to your face you'd be pretty upset about it too I'd imagine.

I for one have no problem with Lehner feeling the way he does. The issue lies in how he chose to express those feelings. If you're in a position of massive privilege, don't complain about things in public when so many people have it worse off than you do - including specifically the kind of thing you're complaining about. I'd have no problem with him complaining to his friends and family, but a millionaire should think long and hard before they complain about anything in public. I assume he's okay with getting lots of backlash for what he said though, so more power to him I guess.

If Rantanen, Donskoi, Byram, and Grubauer are out (along with Johnson + Francouz), I'd guess the lineup will look something like this:


Landeskog --- Mackinnon --- Burakovsky
Soderberg ------- Kadri -------- Saad
Nichuskin -------- Jost --------- Kaut
Compher ------ Bellemare ---- O'Connor

Toews ---- Girard
Graves --- Makar
Nemeth - MacDonald/Timmins

Dubnyk
Johansson

Could possibly see Saad and Kaut swap places too, given that Saad looked good with Jost last game.

I am so very much looking forward to Bura with Landy and MacK. I think that line can work. They keep trying to use him on the left wing with MacKinnon and Rantanen, and that just doesn't work.

 

[Gatorbait19]

I for one have no problem with Lehner feeling the way he does. The issue lies in how he chose to express those feelings. If you're in a position of massive privilege, don't complain about things in public when so many people have it worse off than you do - including specifically the kind of thing you're complaining about. I'd have no problem with him complaining to his friends and family, but a millionaire should think long and hard before they complain about anything in public. I assume he's okay with getting lots of backlash for what he said though, so more power to him I guess.

I get and appreciate Lehner’s personal/mental health issues. But his message came across as selfish, petulant and tone deaf. This is a virus that has killed millions including 500k+ in the US alone. Millions of people have fought through these extraordinary times and continued doing their jobs - the vast majority of which are more difficult and which pay much much less money.

It certainly sucks but he’s very fortunate to be in the position he’s in - hes a millionaire with enough money that hes got the option to not play if he doesn’t want to or it affects his mental health too much.

Then throw in the fact that the league is just trying to keep everyone as safe as possible and play as many games as possible (you know, the whole point to the sport), and keep everything as fair as possible competitive balance wise.

Essentially what lehner is saying is that his health and well being is more important than everyone else’s, and that his employer should cater to his needs as they pay him $5m a year.

 

[henchman21]

If you have to take an experimental vaccine to get back to normal, you're not going back to normal.

Not the first or last time the US has strongly encouraged experimental vaccines for public health. We've been spoiled for the last 30 years where people have gotten pretty lax on how vaccines have to intertwine with daily lives for public health.

 

[Richard88]

Not the first or last time the US has strongly encouraged experimental vaccines for public health. We've been spoiled for the last 30 years where people have gotten pretty lax on how vaccines have to intertwine with daily lives for public health.

Yes, you're right about that. The Tuskegee experiments come to mind...