We complain about the NHL a lot but compared to the NBA .......

[SecretOilersFan]

Seriously.

Yeah the NBA is boring because there's two good teams, as if having no good teams is any better.

I don't know I thought our team was very entertaining and fun to watch this year

I don't think this is honestly is a great Thread as we are a hockey forum and bashing another sports league isn't really great material for a thread.

One thing I never got about so many people here on hf is if you hate the game and find it boring why bother. I felt the same way about the NFL and NBA used to huge into those leagues now the NHL and a little EPL is all I watch sportswise.

Some people think utter domination is fun to watch others like myself find close games more fun. Entertainment is not quantifiable.

And before you say NBA ratings we know why the NHL doesn't compete and that is the fact it's a winter sport it's expensive it's hard to find a place to play the stars even if on the level of Durant or Lebron level dominance aren't very charismatic etc. Go and name one other winter sport that has a draw outside the olympics besides figure skating I will wait.

The NHL will never compete with any of the major sports leagues in NA and what is wrong with that?! I mean as long as the league is increasing in fans it's fine if we don't draw big.

When was popularity the benchmark for quality?

I am just tired of threads that whine about the sport or have an excessive focus on tv ratings especiallly for a sport driven by gate revenue.

 

[MorrisSmit89]

You know what drives ratings? Star power, skill and dominance. The NBA could try for parity and have a Raptors vs. Utah finals and no one would give a damn.. the Cavs & Warriors could meet in the finals another 4 years straight and they'd dwarf any parity driven finals in ratings.

so the very thing you hate is the very thing that makes the NBA a much more dominant brand than the NHL.. imagine a Ottawa vs. Nashville final (with Weber instead of Subban) and think about how many casual fans are tuning into that?

 

[SecretOilersFan]

You know what drives ratings? Star power, skill and dominance. The NBA could try for parity and have a Raptors vs. Utah finals and no one would give a damn.. the Cavs & Warriors could meet in the finals another 4 years straight and they'd dwarf any parity driven finals in ratings.

so the very thing you hate is the very thing that makes the NBA a much more dominant brand than the NHL.. imagine a Ottawa vs. Nashville final (with Weber instead of Subban) and think about how many casual fans are tuning into that?

I would turn in as a rockets fan. The lack of parity is what drove me out. It's no fun when your team has no chance unless you assemble a super team which only two teams in the league can do.

NBA stars are just more charismatic and appeal to a larger demographic always has been this way no matter what era.

Plus after reading the NBA Reddit I don't think a lot of people are happy. If GSW kills the league for 2 more years what do you think reg season ratings will be?

Also not an insecure hockey fan either used to be a huge NBA fan 2nd favorite sport. The NBA will never have true parity but at least back then you had 4 or 5 teams who could win not 2 (more like one at this point) some of the best NBA series this year were the non GSW CLE games but you know what it didn't matter because I knew they had no chance against GSW CLE.

 

[eternalbedhead]

Here's the problem with the NBA compared to the NHL:

1) No "team-first" mentality or loyalty. Star players move like journeymen to whatever team is closest to winning. The moment their team stops serving them, they're off. The "Decision", and the "Return" and this recent thing with KD. It's about building super teams rather than staying with your ship, and the soft cap the NBA has allows this to happen.
2) Depth is not nearly as important. You really only need a superstar or two to be competitive. Compared to the NHL where having a team 4 lines deep is vital, having a good 5-man starting group is not as important and having bench performers is merely a luxury.
3) Parity. There's a bigger difference between the top and bottom teams of the NBA than there is the NHL, and the same could be said of the players.

 

[Machinehead]

I don't know I thought our team was very entertaining and fun to watch this year

I like the Oilers, but they have flaws. Every team in the league is massively flawed.

The Pens defense corps is a joke without Letang and the Predators have a below average forward group. The two teams going for the Cup shouldn't have gaping holes.

I feel like Major League Baseball has it right at this point. It isn't the same two teams every year, but the contenders in baseball have fantastic rosters with very few holes, if any.

 

[SecretOilersFan]

I like the Oilers, but they have flaws. Every team in the league is massively flawed.

The Pens defense corps is a joke without Letang and the Predators have a below average forward group. The two teams going for the Cup shouldn't have gaping holes.

I feel like Major League Baseball has it right at this point. It isn't the same two teams every year, but the contenders in baseball have fantastic rosters with very few holes, if any.

Well i guess this my is point we like sports in different ways I don't like flawless teams I like to see offense take on defense or this team goalie is carrying them can he stop 60 shots. It's fun to see who's weakness is exploited. It creates tension and that's the important aspect of sport or really any entertainment medium. I am not going to hate on the NBA I used to love it but if perfection is watching one team kill everyone else it would be much better to have a slugfest to the end.

You are right we are flawed so much so that it allowed ANA to come back from the jaws of defeat it might frustrate me as a fan but if you are neutral fan the 4-3 game 5 win for Ana is great entertainment. While I will agree the finals haven't been as good I hoped (there haven't been many close games) the Sens/pens game 7 didn't even interest you? Neither team was perfect but it was a good watch. Cause if that's the case you may have just lost love for the game nothing wrong with that (it's entertainment preferences not going to judge)

 

[Machinehead]

Well i guess this my is point we like sports in different ways I don't like flawless teams I like to see offense take on defense or this team goalie is carrying them can he stop 60 shots. It's fun to see who's weakness is exploited. It creates tension and that's the important aspect of sport or really any entertainment medium. I am not going to hate on the NBA I used to love it but if perfection is watching one team kill everyone else it would be much better to have a slugfest to the end.

You are right we are flawed so much so that it allowed ANA to come back from the jaws of defeat it might frustrate me as a fan but if you are neutral fan the 4-3 game 5 win for Ana is great entertainment.

I agree with you that it's good that even great teams have strengths and weaknesses, but it shouldn't be to the point where they're legitimately bad.

Like the Champions League Final (which has it's own problems but let's just use it as an example). Real Madrid is an offensive team and Juventus is a defensive team. Everyone knew it going in and we had that contrast. But at the same time, Juventus can still score better than most teams in the world. You can't say that the Predators can score better than most of the teams in NHL. Real Madrid can still defend better than most teams in the world. You can't say the Penguins can defend better than most of the teams in the NHL.

I think it's very compelling if a great team maybe has a chink in the armor, but they shouldn't be legitimately bad at major aspects of the game. This isn't like "oh the Pens are a little weak at LW," this is "the Pens are ****ing terrible at defense." It's kind of embarrassing.

The Penguins and Senators played a fun game in game 7, but it was ruined by the thought I kept having: "I can't believe one of these teams is going to be in the Finals"

 

[MorrisSmit89]

I would turn in as a rockets fan. The lack of parity is what drove me out. It's no fun when your team has no chance unless you assemble a super team which only two teams in the league can do.

NBA stars are just more charismatic and appeal to a larger demographic always has been this way no matter what era.

Plus after reading the NBA Reddit I don't think a lot of people are happy. If GSW kills the league for 2 more years what do you think reg season ratings will be?

Also not an insecure hockey fan either used to be a huge NBA fan 2nd favorite sport. The NBA will never have true parity but at least back then you had 4 or 5 teams who could win not 2 (more like one at this point) some of the best NBA series this year were the non GSW CLE games but you know what it didn't matter because I knew they had no chance against GSW CLE.

the NBA has always had superteams.. the celtics/lakers in the 80s, bulls in the 90s, lakers/spurs in the 00s. people love it and they romanticize about it. they love how dominant jordan was, or how dominant the kobe/shaq lakers were, or how awe-inspiring the bird/magic rivalry was

r/NBA complains about everything and anything. the ratings will continue to be there because NBA storylines are 2nd to none

edit: the ratings these finals are even better than the last.. even after the garbage 1st 3 rounds

 

[Machinehead]

Think about it this way.

A basketball fan telling a hockey fan that's never seen basketball before about the Finals: "We have the Cavs and the Warriors. Arguably the greatest player of all time against arguably the greatest team of all time." Hey that's cool.

Now reverse it: "We have the Pens and the Predators. They've above average."

 

[Rich Nixon]

Yeah, it is an inferiority complex of hockey fans (with elements of...should we say...demographic differences). I have no idea why we're constantly insulting basketball (and baseball too) here.

But the NBA playoffs this year were awful though. The league is just consolidating to nothingness. Someone brought up a great point about development-the fan thirst for talent means you get a ton of undeveloped 19, 20 year old players who come in with flaws they never fix, guys who could become legends but instead become 5 years of t shirt sales. It's a different game and a different business model, short benches and high scores create an appetite for flash. You're not going to fix James Harden now, and he isn't the defensive punchline he once was, but he could be much more than he is already-he never will be, and his team never will be, and if a spot opens up on one of these superteams he will jet off to take it.

The NBA's philosophy is to emphasize dominance and record-setting and mythbuilding, parity be damned. That has actually made them a ton of money of late, but there is no doubt it has led to eroding support in markets not prepares for that. And it's not like the Warriors and Cavaliers come from huge markets. Imagine what it's like to have a league where the teams in Philly, New York, LA, Atlanta, and DC can't honestly say they have a shot in the next decade.

 

[SecretOilersFan]

the NBA has always had superteams.. the celtics/lakers in the 80s, bulls in the 90s, lakers/spurs in the 00s. people love it and they romanticize about it. they love how dominant jordan was, or how dominant the kobe/shaq lakers were, or how awe-inspiring the bird/magic rivalry was

r/NBA complains about everything and anything. the ratings will continue to be there because NBA storylines are 2nd to none

Didn't LA lose to Detroit? Also when did one team sweep every team to a championship? GSW is looking to do that and probably will. There is a problem with durrant being able to sign with a top team like that there needs to be more talent distribution throughout the league otherwise it's pointless to have a reg season.

 

[MorrisSmit89]

Didn't LA lose to Detroit? Also when did one team sweep every team to a championship? GSW is looking to do that and probably will.

lakers went 16-1.. and who's to say GS won't lose next season? the lakers did 3 peat before tailing off

 

[Romang67]

Think about it this way.

A basketball fan telling a hockey fan that's never seen basketball before about the Finals: "We have the Cavs and the Warriors. Arguably the greatest player of all time against arguably the greatest team of all time." Hey that's cool.

Now reverse it: "We have the Pens and the Predators. They've above average."

Cool. Now make the pitch for cheering for literally any other team in the NBA except for the Warriors or the Cavaliers.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

As a fan of both the NHL playoffs have blown the NBA out of the water

 

[Machinehead]

Cool. Now make the pitch for cheering for literally any other team in the NBA except for the Warriors or the Cavaliers.

I can't.

The NBA has it's fair share of problems.

But as a casual fan, no team involved, liking both sports equally, it's really no contest which Finals you're going to watch.

 

[The Panther]

I'll take superstars and dominant teams rising to the top of the league over forced artificial parity any day of the week.

I really agree with this. I'm not saying today's NBA is a better spectator-sport than the NHL (I don't think it is), but one of the big problems with today's NHL is the lack of style, individuality, and flair -- which the NBA has in spades. The Bettman-era has mainstreamed and regulated everything into total uniformity. Every building is the same (used to be different sizes, with different characters). Every coach plays the same system (used to be wildly different). Every goalie plays the same style (used to be exciting to watch with wildly different styles). Hell, even almost every score is the same -- 2-1, or 3-2 if you're lucky (used to be 1-0 one game, then 10-6 the next game).

The heyday of the NHL was the early 90s when stars like Lemieux, Gretzky, Bure, Selanne, Jagr, Lafontaine, etc. would make your jaw drop on a nightly basis. Sadly, the web did not exist then, so the world couldn't marvel at the highlights within minutes.

These days, there's not even much point in watching. You spend all that time watching a game and a star like Crosby might get a point or two if you're lucky, but mostly it's just a bunch of guys hooking and holding each other for three hours.

I agree. Well, actually there's less hooking and holding now than in the early-90s, as the game is much cleaner. But the 'system' now is collapse and block = dull.

 

[weastern bias]

Think about it this way.

A basketball fan telling a hockey fan that's never seen basketball before about the Finals: "We have the Cavs and the Warriors. Arguably the greatest player of all time against arguably the greatest team of all time." Hey that's cool.

Now reverse it: "We have the Pens and the Predators. They've above average."

Spot on assessment of this sad state of affairs

 

[SecretOilersFan]

lakers went 16-1.. and who's to say GS won't lose next season? the lakers did 3 peat before tailing off

If they keep Durant so you really think they will? Look I wasn't a fan of the NBA's lack of parity before the trade. If you enjoy it more power to you. I don't and maybe that's why I had a better glowing image in the early 2000's because I actually thought the rockets had a chance to win it all with Tracy and Yao.

Still more teams could win back then and 16-0 is still unprecedented and shows that the league is becoming even less competitive talent wise among the different teams.

If you follow sports on stars I can see the attraction I don't though I follow them more for unpredictability and regional bias and with my interest in sports declining more as I become an adult hockey pretty much is the only sport holding my attention.

 

[canuckslover10]

Healthy Pens + No Cap = 16-0

If their were no cap teams like the leafs rangers philly canucks montreal idk probably a few other teams would be controlling the league

 

[SecretOilersFan]

Spot on assessment of this sad state of affairs

For you maybe I could reverse this

GSW has amazing talent and will win no matter what

Pens vs Preds we have the former cup winners against the 8th seed who beat the WCF favorite who will win.

Look if you like the former great for you I don't. I am enjoying hockey more than ever before if you hate the sport so much why post here. Remind of yourself consistently of what you don't love anymore why? I am not going to go post on Reddit NBA on how much I hate the league(though they seem to be doing that already). Not everything here has to be positive but if you genuinely hate the sport why bother. This is the way the NHL has evolved the NBA isn't going to change either so I just stopped watching and caring.

 

[MorrisSmit89]

If they keep Durant so you really think they will? Look I wasn't a fan of the NBA's lack of parity before the trade. If you enjoy it more power to you. I don't and maybe that's why I had a better glowing image in the early 2000's because I actually thought the rockets had a chance to win it all with Tracy and Yao.

Still more teams could win back then and 16-0 is still unprecedented and shows that the league is becoming even less competitive talent wise among the different teams.

If you follow sports on stars I can see the attraction I don't though I follow them more for unpredictability and regional bias and with my interest in sports declining more as I become an adult hockey pretty much is the only sport holding my attention.

I personally would like to have some hope that the Raps one day can pull of a championship but I enjoy the sport so I'm going to watch regardless.

All i'm saying is that a lack of parity has been a constant in the NBA and it works tremendously for them. As incredible as the Warriors top end talent is, they still are very deep, young and athletic and some of that is bound to give soon.. and another superteam will rise up and challenge them. Just the way of the NBA.

 

[The Panther]

Know what is probably the saddest stat of the modern NHL, in terms of marketing the sport (if we need to care about such things)?

Who is the marquee player of the past dozen years? Crosby.

What is the one annual NHL event that garners maximum international media attention? The Stanley Cup finals.

How has this era's superstar player shown his stuff in that biggest media event?

22 games, 3 goals!

I mean, it's hard to see why a casual sports fan wouldn't be thrilled by tuning in to watch the Finals for the first time.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

If their were no cap teams like the leafs rangers philly canucks montreal idk probably a few other teams would be controlling the league

Just like the 90s and early 2000s right

Canucks 5peat. Habs 4 out of 2.

 

[SecretOilersFan]

Know what is probably the saddest stat of the modern NHL, in terms of marketing the sport (if we need to care about such things)?

Who is the marquee player of the past dozen years? Crosby.

What is the one annual NHL event that garners maximum international media attention? The Stanley Cup finals.

How has this era's superstar player shown his stuff in that biggest media event?

22 games, 3 goals!

I mean, it's hard to see why a casual sports fan wouldn't be thrilled by tuning in to watch the Finals for the first time.

Welll again if you watch sports based off stars i guess I like unpredictablilty more so. Though there are ton of factors that are in the NBA's favor from the get go. The NHL is more popular in the states than in the 80's the most star driven era and they still couldn't compete. People might say well mass media and the internet but EPL and La Liga have a harder time appealing to Americans to and they have stars.

 

[weastern bias]

if you hate the sport so much why post here.

Finding the NHL product boring =/= "hating the sport"

And while I don't need to validate my posts on an anonymous message board to a stranger, the NHL simply happens to host the only sports team that I am emotionally attached to, so I will at least watch their games every year

I used to watch neutral contests all the time just for fun, but the league, the officials, the overbearing systems, and the seemingly random outcomes on a game to game basis have squeezed all of the joy out of NHL hockey for me