Speculation: We aren’t good enough

[ToneDog]

It was on LL and I posted about it shortly after.
I would love to hear a mic’d up game to hear what the other teams say to them on the ice.

Leafs lead the league is ignoring chirps.

 

[Bomber0104]

why can’t Matthews play more like Getzlaf?

Temperament.

 

[Nineteen67]

Temperament.

Yep. Likely Matthews will go down in history as just a really good player because of that.Which is a shame because he has potential to be one of the best players in the world

 

[sparxx87]

Yep. Likely Matthews will go down in history as just a really good player because of that.Which is a shame because he has potential to be one of the best players in the world

It’s weird because I didn’t see this as a rookie or as an early sophomore.

I couldn’t find anything bad to say about Matthews until mid way through last year. I’ve been quiet this year but he’s been very disappointing to me. He can be a lot better than what he’s shown.

Apparently his defensive’metrics’ are good but IMO this season has been some of his worst defensive hockey. He used to be a puck hound. He was solid both ways - stripping pucks, picking passes, turning the puck over down low. He used to be like a 3rd d man. Where did that guy go? I miss him.

 

[rumman]

We were warned !!!!

You will have difficulty being Cup competitive if you invest tooooo much cap $$$ in tooooo few players.

Leafs have 3 of the top 5 highest cap forwards in the game and we're seeing & feeling that impact of that on a nightly basis where our defense and depth and surrounding cast are being exposed.

This is certainly something I feared going into this season, and this seems to be unfolding under the conclusions "we're not good enough"

We appear to have spent $$$ ourselves out of contention. In a cap world were every dollar counts we seem to have overspent by millions where cap management has the biggest impact on the on-ice product.

 

[Teeder Keon]

 

[ottomaddox]

This season feels like a long/ bitter offseason where we spend most of the time telling each other "I told you so". I don't even think we need to wait for these next 8-9 games to play out. We already know what they are. Perhaps we're all waiting for a firing or a trade for key players before the "I told you so" rants come out.

 

[The Apologist]

And now Footie is out too. This feels like a cursed season.

And Moore....

 

[ULF_55]

No defense
No structure
No urgency
No heart
No coaching

 

[ULF_55]

No defense
No structure
No urgency
No heart
No coaching

Sometimes you should post when emotional.

Defense and special teams.

Leafs are 10th. for goals for, with 69, 3.29 goals per game.
Leafs are 23rd. for goals against, with 69, 3.29 goals per game.

Leafs PP is 20th. in the league.
Leafs PK is 23rd. in the league.

2018-2019
Leafs 4th. in league 3.49 goals for per game 4th. in league.
Leafs 20th. in league 3.04 goals against per game .

Leafs PP 8th. in the league.
Leafs PK 18th. in the league.

Who implements the special teams system?

 

[rumman]

View attachment 277701

man I miss Pryor.

 

[The Apologist]

Sometimes you should post when emotional.

Defense and special teams.

Leafs are 10th. for goals for, with 69, 3.29 goals per game.
Leafs are 23rd. for goals against, with 69, 3.29 goals per game.

Leafs PP is 20th. in the league.
Leafs PK is 23rd. in the league.

2018-2019
Leafs 4th. in league 3.49 goals for per game 4th. in league.
Leafs 20th. in league 3.04 goals against per game .

Leafs PP 8th. in the league.
Leafs PK 18th. in the league.

Who implements the special teams system?

So basically we are close to the same defensively league average wise but nowhere near the same offensively? Totals wise, we are about -.2 off offensivelyy while +.2 defensively.

 

[Zybalto]

Sometimes you should post when emotional.

Defense and special teams.

Leafs are 10th. for goals for, with 69, 3.29 goals per game.
Leafs are 23rd. for goals against, with 69, 3.29 goals per game.

Leafs PP is 20th. in the league.
Leafs PK is 23rd. in the league.

2018-2019
Leafs 4th. in league 3.49 goals for per game 4th. in league.
Leafs 20th. in league 3.04 goals against per game .

Leafs PP 8th. in the league.
Leafs PK 18th. in the league.

Who implements the special teams system?

Dont underestimate the fact team save % from the start of 2017- 2018 season to January 1st this year was 3rd in the league , 4th 5v5.

Since then its 20th in the league, 19th 5v5.

 

[ULF_55]

So basically we are close to the same defensively but nowhere near the same offensively?

Yep, not as good offensively, and worse defensively.

Allowing .25 more goals per game.
And that .25 goals against per game is on top of poor defensive system.

The Leafs:
have got worse on the PK constantly over the past 4 seasons, each year worse than the previous.
have regressed on the PP, although not a straight decline, 23.8%, 25%, 21.8%, 17.1% so close to 8% worse than 2 years ago.

PK
2014-2015 - 22nd.
2015-2016 - 13th.
2016-2017 - 1oth.
2017-2018 - 11th.
2018-2019 - 18th.
2019-2020 - 23rd.

PP
2015-2016 - 29th.
2016-2017 - 2nd.
2017-2018 - 2nd.
2018-2019 - 8th.
2019-2020 - 20th.

 

[The Apologist]

Yep, not as good offensively, and worse defensively.

Allowing .25 more goals per game.
And that .25 goals against per game is on top of poor defensive system.

The Leafs:
have got worse on the PK constantly over the past 4 seasons, each year worse than the previous.
have regressed on the PP, although not a straight decline, 23.8%, 25%, 21.8%, 17.1% so close to 8% worse than 2 years ago.

PK
2014-2015 - 22nd.
2015-2016 - 13th.
2016-2017 - 1oth.
2017-2018 - 11th.
2018-2019 - 18th.
2019-2020 - 23rd.

PP
2015-2016 - 29th.
2016-2017 - 2nd.
2017-2018 - 2nd.
2018-2019 - 8th.
2019-2020 - 20th.

All while completely replacing the special teams Coaching.

Hard to accept that a PP that at times has featured JT, Mitch, Willie, AM34, MoRiles, Barrie, Muzz, can't find the twine.

 

[Cobra777]

One could ask why Barry Trotz has the New York Islanders playing better hockey than our Toronto Maple Leafs?

Agree but also make no mistake that Islanders team is also Lou Lamoriello work ethic all over it, when he was here our team had way better work ethic and our young team was the most exciting in the league to watch, only took to Jan after he left for the team to show this no compete hockey.

 

[Funk21]

And I dint think it could get much worse

 

[mikeyz]

To the TS:

After tonight's "effort" I think that you can eliminate the "Speculation" in the bold thread title. Because it's becoming a fact.

 

[Faltorvo]

Or teams are just defending us differently and taking away time and space in the high danger areas.

I also don't buy this idea that "Babcock is slowing the teams offense down" Too often I don't see enough from the players in the way of urgency or intent. Perhaps if there was more it the way of those two things we would be creating more in higher areas and thus the xG would see an improvement.

you know

i have yet to see anyone post what exactly babcock is doing wrong systematically

 

[Faltorvo]

the talent is there but the mental capacity isn't.

this is a very immature group of players we have.

they're going to have to mature a lot more before we can ever call them contenders

no

you are greatly over valuing the talent level here

 

[Faltorvo]

It’s weird because I didn’t see this as a rookie or as an early sophomore.

I couldn’t find anything bad to say about Matthews until mid way through last year. I’ve been quiet this year but he’s been very disappointing to me. He can be a lot better than what he’s shown.

Apparently his defensive’metrics’ are good but IMO this season has been some of his worst defensive hockey. He used to be a puck hound. He was solid both ways - stripping pucks, picking passes, turning the puck over down low. He used to be like a 3rd d man. Where did that guy go? I miss him.

he got paid

 

[Tmart335]

you know

i have yet to see anyone post what exactly babcock is doing wrong systematically

What was the blues coach , mike yeo doing wrong last year before a coaching change

Obviously the team is not responding to Babcock. Not saying he is a bad coach, but obviously a shakeup is needed.

There is no push back, pp looks horrible, PK looks horrible.

The other night the Blackhawks score....babs throws out 4th line. Hawks put on patty kane line...goal I next 20 seconds. Now 4 to 0. Why?

Ceci the second team leader in Icetime tonight , 4th against Bruins, 2nd against islander. Do you agree with this?

Tavares, Matthew's, nylander, all under 20 mins the last 3 games. Not a new trend.

The players need a change. It's getting obvious

 

[Puckstuff]

Dubas has created a mess. Either ride it out or fire Babs now.

I think that’s likely because it’s the only two options

 

[Goose]

Just curious if anyone else out there feels that things are all-around fine and will get better?

We’ve had lots of bad injury luck, Barrie is underperforming and I’m not sure what reason there is to think it’s permanent, Nylander looks good (but soft, okay whatever), Matthews is taking over games at times, Andersen has looked good, our backups haven’t but it’s mostly team play IMO.

I dunno, I’m just not really worried at all, feels like the “fire Babcock” and “we just aren’t good enough” hysteria is in full swing. I mean sure, we probably don’t have the perfect roster, but it’s not all doom and gloom is it?

Look at how the Nats started the season before they won the WS this year; there are lots of swings in a season. I dunno, maybe I’m missing the clear signs of flames and smoke but it seems like everyone’s stampeding for the fire exits because Babcock burnt some toast.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

I mean I can understand not freaking out....but things are objectively not all around fine lol the team sucks. Will they get better? Maybe. They aren't exactly giving anyone much reason to think so.