Was Muller a better coach than Peters?

[bluedevil58*]

We had a better record under Muller. Why is everyone so high on Peters? Look at our record. Look at your star players production. We have officially been eliminated from playoff contention. What say you?


Discuss!

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[TheOllieC]

stop

 

[DougieSmash]

Wtf.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

BD58 is becoming my favorite poster, never change BD58, never change.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

My Issues with Muller

1. He was said to be a PowerPlay specialist. This was later demonstrated to be false, both in media revision and on the ice. His PowerPlay was either the backdoor play to the cheating defenseman, or a weird combination with the guy on the halfwall going to the front of the net, with no aim beyond that. It was awful.

2. His breakout approach involving the defeseman breakout pass being tipped in the neutral zone to avoid icing failed, due to lack of personnel able to do such a thing consistently.

3. His attitude whereby he tried to be buddy-buddy with everyone also failed, as everyone tired of it very quickly. E. Staal in particular was sick of it. I don't know what specifically happened at all, it's just clear that there was some failure on Muller's part that screwed up the locker-room.

That's off the top of my head.

Vs. Peters; he commands the respect of his players; he practices accoutability, or at least did until the season became unsalvagable; he runs a system that works well for the players we have rather than trying to ram the proverbial square pegs down our throats; and E. Staal/the locker room clearly like him. This team is awful; but this is the first time in years that effort is not seriously in question.

EDIT: For Peters', I don't like how he insists on changing the lineup after every loss; and I don't like how he is riding the hot goalie unceasingly until the starter fails in some big way. It's wearing them out.

 

[Sens1Canes2]

Everybody liked Maurice and Muller and Maurice at the beginning too. And Laviolette. Give it time...

 

[nobuddy]

smh should of kept steve "kirkmullo" muller

 

[Chan790]

Everybody liked Maurice and Muller and Maurice at the beginning too. And Laviolette. Give it time...

1.) Things feel palpably better with Peters (and Francis) than under Maurice or Lavy or Maurice (part 2) or Muller and Rutherford. Different...like there's an organizational philosophy and a plan at work. A roadmap rather than short-sightedness.

2.) That said...I expect that if Peters can't make it work by mid-season of next year with guys like Semin and Skinner that haven't yet clicked here under him...he's going to be fired. You can't stick with a coach that can't make it work with the best players you have (and can't move except at a loss of value) and won't adapt to do so. Organizational accountability and roadmaps are nice...but the plans have to fit the tools in the toolbox.

 

[FlyingSquirrels]

1.) Things feel palpably better with Peters (and Francis) than under Maurice or Lavy or Maurice (part 2) or Muller and Rutherford. Different...like there's an organizational philosophy and a plan at work. A roadmap rather than short-sightedness.

2.) That said...I expect that if Peters can't make it work by mid-season of next year with guys like Semin and Skinner that haven't yet clicked here under him...he's going to be fired. You can't stick with a coach that can't make it work with the best players you have (and can't move except at a loss of value) and won't adapt to do so. Organizational accountability and roadmaps are nice...but the plans have to fit the tools in the toolbox.

Totally disagree. I truly think this is a situation where the coach will stay and guys like Skinner and Semin will be jettisoned. I just get the feeling RF respects BP a great deal and will give him much more time than a season and a half..

 

[Blueline Bomber]

I hope to God they don't fire Peters. This organization goes through coaches so quickly, it's no wonder they haven't had any sustained success.

At some point, they've got to stick with a coach and tell the players to nut up and deal with it. Peters has to be that coach.

 

[Sens1Canes2]

Oh I totally agree that Peters stays, regardless of outcome next year. And the underperforming stars, if any, will be traded or waived or bought out or whatever.

I wasn't trying to imply that Peters was on his way anywhere. Just saying that, typically, a first year coach gets a long leash from players.

 

[Carolinas Identity*]

They should hire Kevin Dineen.

 

[bluedevil58*]

While i realize that we now have a better overall system and team game. I cannot look past the numbers of Skinner, Semin, Staal, Staal. I blame the coach for the lack of production. I know it's a tough world but not getting these players to produce is something I put on the coach. If it were 1 or 2 players then yeah ok.

However, this is a across the board lack of production. What stance does this franchise take? Waive, buyout, or trade anyone that doesn't adapt as previously stated? Or does this franchise go through yet another coach. This team has not made the playoffs since Brindy was wearing a jersey....

#ismo3.0uponus?

 

[Blueline Bomber]

I'm not sure how you can blame the coach for the lack of production. He can't go out there and score goals for them.

 

[TheOllieC]

greedy american pig jfaulko stealing everyones production

#jfaulkomustgo

 

[bluedevil58*]

Blue, it's across the board lack of production from our core players aside from Faulk. How do our stars simply turn it off? Did the team have some sort of gentlemen's agreement to waive this season good bye? This is a lack of production system wide.

 

[GoldiFox]

I like Peters and his system but I do not believe he has a long leash. He was given a year to implement his system, if the Canes are a bottom-5 team again next year he is gone.

Canes need to make money and the only way they can do it is in the Playoffs. This isn't a 5-year rebuild, this is crunch time before the Canes become the next Coyotes.

Personally I think the Canes will be a bubble team next year after a half-decent Free Agency where some depth is brought in. That and a well-deserved Karma Draft lottery win.

 

[HisIceness]

GMRF blew it, Phil Jackson and Bill Cowher were available and he chooses some random guy with a boring name who looks like a baptist minister from Alabama. This is an outrage, we must not stand for this.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Blue, it's across the board lack of production from our core players aside from Faulk. How do our stars simply turn it off? Did the team have some sort of gentlemen's agreement to waive this season good bye? This is a lack of production system wide.

Scoring isn't something that players (or coaches) can turn off and on like a light switch. The coach can put in place a system that will generate chances for their team and limit chances for the opposing one, but ultimately, it's up to the players to finish their chances.

Take the last game for example. They outplayed Chicago for the vast majority of that game. They put up 44 shots, only scored 1 goal. Take the entire month of December. They were playing well, but couldn't finish chances.

Blaming Peters for the lack of finish of the players is ridiculous.

 

[Novacane]

Promote Jeff Daniels

 

[bleedgreen]

I must be weird, I think peters is one of the better coaches we've had. I actually can't think of any canes coach I like more.

 

[HisIceness]

I hope to God they don't fire Peters. This organization goes through coaches so quickly, it's no wonder they haven't had any sustained success.

At some point, they've got to stick with a coach and tell the players to nut up and deal with it. Peters has to be that coach.

In all seriousness, Blueline has it right. We cannot continue to go through coach after coach. Now if the coach is simply not competent, or has been around several years w/ no success, then yeah we can call him into question.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

I don''t want to look at it in a "We've hired X amount of coaches, now we should get different players instead!".

When I saw Muller, I saw a guy who gradual lost control of his lockerroom, and who employed a system that, in spite of the lack of talent on the ice, was clearly not working.

I see the complete opposite in both cases with Peters'. His system passes the eyetest; he seems to have firm control of the lockerroom and the support of the leadership. His problem is the lack of talent on the roster.

However many coaches came before seems irrelevant. It depends simply on how good the coach is, and I think Peters' is a good coach.

(So I agree with Blueline in that the Hurricanes should focus on upgrading their roster should Peters' not right the ship, I disagree with how he reached that conclusion)

 

[Blueline Bomber]

All I know is that Skinner has been in the league for only 5 years, and he's had 3 coaches already.

That's insane. There's no reason a player should listen to ANY coach the organization hires if the coach is not going to last longer than a couple years.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Because if he doesn't listen, he gets his ice time cut; healthy scratched from games; labeled a locker room cancer and coach killer; earns the revilement of the players who DO listen to the coach and who think that listening to the coach is the best way to win, ergo not doing so hurts teams chances of winning; because their entire life has been centered around winning hockey games via listening to a coach and exacting some sort of gameplay as a team unit until this exact moment.

And because Skinner and Semin finally DID get the message after numerous healthy scratches to stop cheating in the offensive zone (as much lol) and to dump the ****ing puck in anyway.

Lots of reasons.