Vitale vs Sutter

[wej20]

Has any team won the cup with a guy like Vitale as their 3rd line centre?

 

[billybudd]

I don't think so, no. I wouldn't trust Vitale with Sutter's minutes at center and I like Vitale and do not like Sutter at all.

 

[billybudd]

Ott seems to wear out his welcome pretty fast too. Dallas fans were ripping him to shreds at the end of his time down there and Buffalo fans seemed to be very down on the guy this year a lot of the time too.

I'd be unconcerned with Ott as a 3C in a playoff run. For 4 to 6 weeks, he'll do the job the same way he always has. The bigger concern with him is the regular season after that. He's at right about the wear and tear mark where guys that play like him start wearing down to a nub. Happens fast, too. One year Tucker was contributing, the next year he was just abominable.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Has any team won the cup with a guy like Vitale as their 3rd line centre?

The 1993 Habs had Paul DiPietro as their No. 3 center if I recall correctly. Not like Vitale at all, but a true AHL journeyman who wound up a Swiss National team player.

 

[PensBandwagonerNo272*]

I think this is what is going to end up happening, but if Sutter is a make or break point in a trade for someone like Kane... you have to let him go. Especially Kane, who is carrying only a $5.25 cap hit until 17/18.

For sure. But Sutter wouldn't be the main/biggest piece in a trade for someone like E Kane.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

If we dealt Sutter to get Kane or someone like that, JJ would be our 3rd line C for at least the end of this year.

That said, we're just filling one hole to create another. I really think Shero is going to do a Niskanen for Kulemin type deal to plug the leak until the cap goes up next year and he has some flexibility with $ coming off the books.

 

[Winger for Hire]

For sure. But Sutter wouldn't be the main/biggest piece in a trade for someone like E Kane.

I wouldn't think so either, Maatta probably would/will be.

 

[PensBandwagonerNo272*]

I wouldn't think so either, Maatta probably would/will be.

Yeah and **** that

Pardon me but

 

[madinsomniac]

If you are bringing Bennett in as a top 6 guy and trading for another that frees JJ as a center. You have to address it long term after this season, but for this year it works

 

[IcedCapp]

If we dealt Sutter to get Kane or someone like that, JJ would be our 3rd line C for at least the end of this year.

That said, we're just filling one hole to create another. I really think Shero is going to do a Niskanen for Kulemin type deal to plug the leak until the cap goes up next year and he has some flexibility with $ coming off the books.

You are filling one hole to create another, but here's the question:

which hole is harder to fill, top-line winger or 3rd-line center?

 

[End of Line]

No. Simply put.

 

[AjaxTelamon]

You are filling one hole to create another, but here's the question:

which hole is harder to fill, top-line winger or 3rd-line center?

Oh sure, but you still need to fill both. And if takes a vast overpayment to fill the 1st line winger position, the cupboards will be bare to try and fill the 3C (and bottom 6 in general). If our only need was 1st line winger, then I can see creating another hole and trying to fill it.

The real value of our previous 3C model was not just 3C's, but 3 effective lines. It caused matchup issues.

 

[McDrailers]

I dunno OP, can Sill replace Crosby?

 

[ColePens]

Why can't we appreciate the amazing job as a 4th line center Vitale does?? He's not a L1 winger. Even his biggest fan (myself) cannot understand why DB tried him there. He's a SPOT fill-in in 3rd line duties at best. He's not a shut-down guy. He's a damn good energy/faceoff/PK 4th liner. He is what DB thinks Adams is and should get Adams-like minutes.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Sutter should play as a shadow like Zetterberg did to Sid in the playoffs. Disco never uses him like that, but its what he always used to do in Carolina against us with usually Geno I think. He is better when he's just focused on shutting down one guy.

As for Sutter, I don't actively want to trade him certainly. I like Sutter. But if he's the missing piece in getting a big trade done, I'd do it.

 

[Ogrezilla]

For the rest of the year, Vitale could fill in as the 3rd-line C if Sutter was the necessary piece to complete a trade.

But after this season, Shero's new #1 priority would be finding a long-term #3C

pretty much this. If we trade Sutter, Shero's next call should be to Buffalo to see what they want for Ott.

 

[Ogrezilla]

You are filling one hole to create another, but here's the question:

which hole is harder to fill, top-line winger or 3rd-line center?

top line winger for sure. Jokinen and Vitale could at least plug the hole long enough to stay afloat.

 

[madinsomniac]

You are filling one hole to create another, but here's the question:

which hole is harder to fill, top-line winger or 3rd-line center?

There is a bigger thing too... what exactly has the third line done this year that is actually worth having a sutter on it? He scores against teams that overload on Crosby and malkin, but really we don't have enough third line quality guys so keeping a token 3rd line center seems dumb

 

[Ogrezilla]

There is a bigger thing too... what exactly has the third line done this year that is actually worth having a sutter on it? He scores against teams that overload on Crosby and malkin, but really we don't have enough third line quality guys so keeping a token 3rd line center seems dumb

if we can get Jussi and Megna on the third line it would be pretty effective. Or someone who isn't yet on the team.

 

[Penguinzilla*]

Assuming this question is serious, Sutter is much better than Vitale

 

[wgknestrick]

Vitale has been having by far his career season. He is still no where close to Sutter's consistency or talent level.

I'd love to see Vitale as the next Talbot and have him start playing 3rd/2nd line wing as a puck getter. His speed and talent at forechecking is incredible when paired with other higher skilled players.

He is completely wasted IMO on the Pens "6th line" with Gladams. I really like him with Malkin/Neal to be honest. It is more than the sum of it's parts.

Sutter is a guy who can start every shift in his own zone and end with a faceoff in the O zone. He also flashes incredible skill from time to time. It makes you wonder what he is capable of if he could just put on some additional mass and find some consistency. I am sure he'd love to have more talent (ie >0) on his wings as well.

 

[Shady Machine]

Obviously Sutter over Vitale, but I'm not sure why anyone actually thinks trading Sutter is a possibility. There is nothing in Shero's tenure to suggest he would make a risky trade (trading his 3rd line center without a replacement already or in that deal). Flipping Sutter++ for Kane sounds nice, but the deal for Ott would already have to be done before that to make it happen.

Shero likes 'strength down the middle' so he would never weaken the center position to strengthen the top line winger spot.

 

[cheesedanish87]

I don't think i would trade Sutter, even with Sutter pens bottom 6 is terrible.

I'd much rather trade for a 3rd line winger and have 3 solid lines rather then having 2 great lines and 2 4th lines, depth wins in the playoffs.

Look at the teams who have won in the playoffs recently Chicago LA Boston Pittsburgh they all had great depth.

 

[sauce66871]

Sutter should play as a shadow like Zetterberg did to Sid in the playoffs. Disco never uses him like that, but its what he always used to do in Carolina against us with usually Geno I think. He is better when he's just focused on shutting down one guy.

As for Sutter, I don't actively want to trade him certainly. I like Sutter. But if he's the missing piece in getting a big trade done, I'd do it.

I agree with this completely. If he is the piece to a long term solution, I'd do it.

Besides that, I'm a huge supporter of Vitale, I think he is a great 4th liner. He gives it all everytime he's out there and seems like a likeable guy. I have been pretty hard on Sutter since he's been a Penguin. Seeing that Jordan Staal has 20 points playing on the 2nd line, Sutter has 16 on the 3rd, and in my opinion is just effective killing penalties and fufilling his role as a 3rd line center, I wouldn't look to trade him unless it was for a major upgrade. Plus I feel bad for him, because he would really benefit from real linemates. Pyatt, Glass, Adams and Co. can't help the guys case.

So I think Vitale would be okay at 3rd Center, there's no way he has the ceiling of Sutter in that position though. At the same time, Sutter does not have the ceiling as Kane on Crosby's wing.

 

[ozpensfan]

Vitale i love on 4th, Sutter is a perfect 3rd line player, its shame we surround him with 4th line players, Why couldnt we just give Morrow the 1 million?