Player Discussion Victor Olofsson (2014, 181st) – '18-19: Rochester #12 (AHL)

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DolanPlsGoSabres

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*Not having a wave of injuries up front probably played the biggest role in the lack of forward call ups.

I think this is a really big point that's also really sad. There were so many years when Buffalo was among the league leaders in man games lost, and it obviously led to guys like Falk and Griffith playing, but we got to also see glimpses of young guys like Guhle, Baptiste, Bailey (though they didn't work out) as the injury bug essentially forced management to call up guys from the AHL. The top team not running into depth problems this year due to the lack of injuries is definitely a factor in the success of Rochester.

Unfortunately the results on the NHL ice is a different topic on its own, as the top team doesn't have the injury excuse for their struggles, and this doesn't include Phil's lineup decisions.
 

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They didn't actually need injury to take a look at players as they've carried two players all season with waiver eligibility to be assigned easily to the AHL in Thompson and Mittelstadt. And both have had times when that would have been completely appropriate to do.

As for comparables -- and I hate direct player comparables -- Marchessault-lite: Small, not strong, quick but not fast over distance, crafty, creative, great shot.
 

sabrebuild

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Its pretty disingenuous to frame my stance on Olofsson as an extreme. I have not, nor have I ever, said “omg don’t question the GM and trust the process”.

What I have done is evaluated how each prospect has been handled on a case by case basis as well as evaluating the overall approach. I love the overall approach but have disagreed with how certain players have been handled. Thompson’s handling being the chief problem I’ve had.

When it comes to Olofsson they hit a homerun developmentally. Look at the growth in several aspects of his game. That is the main reason he was sent down and he responded Ed and is still responding spectacularly to that mandate. Also Just watch today’s Amerks’ game. The Olofsson/Asplund/O’Regan line led the charge for the Amerks from being down 4-1 in the 3rd. Taylor has so much confidence of those guys he put them out to end regulation after the game was tied up and he started all 3 in OT (yes 3 forwards). Where they went on to win the game. That they are trusted that much is a product of their growth, particularly Olofsson’s. Its stuff like that I care way more about. As opposed to a random 3-5 game look with us so Housley can not put him into position to succeed.

I’d also point that if he actually got those 3-5 games. We both know you and many others would still be complaining. It would just move on to the fact that he didn’t stay up. Basically this is complaining to complain or maybe just letting overall frustration for this season seep in to development evaluation s, at least when it comes to Olofsson. He’s a development bright spot. Does it have to be maligned in some way so the GM can’t get credit for something good? Is that what this is about?

I wasn't saying you were being extreme, it was meant as a general comment on the back and forth.

I think it's perfectly fine to think the development of players in Rochester has gone well since the team is succeeding. I don't think anyone has been mad at Taylor.

But to be so defensive and emotional about people disagreeing with your analysis or being hard on the GM is bizarre.

One, the obvious is that this gm has been failing at the nhl level in all regards. So to give him the benefit of the doubt is a little bit naive.

Two, we can all pretend that Botts is being very specific with his development choices on an individual basis. But apparently there is no consistency for how that development is rewarded. Which can be frustrating for teammates. But lets be real. Do we really want to say the long time pro Olofsson needed a whole year in Rochester, but Tage Thompson didn't need any? And don't these types of mismanagement make you question other choices made by management that can't really be proved either way.

Like I get it you think that Olofsson couldn't have become this tremendous two way player that he allegedly is in Rochester, if he had played in the nhl. Who knows, he might have developed great, formed a nice second line with Reinhart and Mitts.

Same with Nylander. Same with Pilut. Maybe it helps for him to go ppg in the ahl for a while, but just as likely he could be still holding down top 4 minutes getting plenty of minutes in the process.

But who knows. And maybe thats why we shouldn't worry too much about Botts getting credit, until you know he starts getting good results. Hate to be a buzz kill, but when I see you hate on housley, totally rightfully, I find the idea that you would simultaneously support Botts development strategy as unimpeachable, stretches reason.

The mental gymnastics needed to defend this guy with the results we have seen so far is extensive. Must be tough to keep looking for positives for botts and his plan.
 

sabrebuild

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They didn't actually need injury to take a look at players as they've carried two players all season with waiver eligibility to be assigned easily to the AHL in Thompson and Mittelstadt. And both have had times when that would have been completely appropriate to do.

As for comparables -- and I hate direct player comparables -- Marchessault-lite: Small, not strong, quick but not fast over distance, crafty, creative, great shot.

I like the Marchessault comparison. And your first paragraph is spot on. There is no negative to flipping Tage and Mitts with any number of Amerks as they were terrible for most of the year.
 
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dortt

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Sure, the nhl is faster, but the way you said it made me think Lindros esque head down play.

if you hit someone with their head down these days under Parros, you get a suspension. Playing with the head down is an advantage today as you can draw a 5 min PP
 

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Or That the organization said we want you to work on x,y and z and barring a wave of injuries* you’re not coming up. So just focus on those things. Something that organizations do at times with prospects.

The results speak for themselves. He’s had the best professional season of his career due his his overall growth as a player. He’s grown elements of his game that you wouldn’t call strengths (playmaking/defense, etc) and added even to his skill set (Pking)

He’s now a all situations top player for the Amerks the coach trusts in a lot of key situations. That’s awesome

*Not having a wave of injuries up front probably played the biggest role in the lack of forward call ups.

Totally agree, I just don't feel like posting much more than necessary as one of the "let's be patient" poster boys on the board.
 

cramdizzl

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Couple points in response to your post

1) How does any of what you said equate with basing development decisions on the NHL roster? The following is how.....

You stated that the Pens can take their time with development because they have Crosby/Malkin. That’s a pretty straightforward argument that the Pen’s NHL roster allows them to take their time with development and our NHL roster does not. You followed that up in this post with our ‘bottom 9 sucking” as a reason to call him up. You quite clearly feel development decisions should be heavily influenced by the NHL roster make up. I strongly disagree with that.

2) When I said we would have to “rearrange the roster to get him NHL ice time”. I was talking about his hot streak to start the season. We were 10gms into the season and had a full 23 man NHL roster. In order for him to come up it would require a corresponding roster move to create space for him. Thats what I meant. That’s not a very realistic to expectation at that point of the season.

3) Not sure why you think I feel a call up would hurt him. My feelings on him (or anyone else) getting an arbitrary take a look/reward call up is.... I don’t care either way. But for the last month or so he has been playing great with Asplund. Something that has helped Asplund’s offensive growth/development. Their line, with O’Regan on the other wing, has been a great line for the Amerks. So why not leave Olofsson there and keep that going right now. Seems reasonable to me and not worth getting bent out of shape over as some are if not you in particular. I also have little faith in Housley using him properly if he came up.

1. If I felt that way I'd be advocating for a lot more than a handful of games, and I would've been posting on this thread a lot more than I have been. As I've said, the reasons for calling him up are for his benefit and that he deserves it, first and foremost. But there's context. The fact that he could've slid into the lineup without disrupting anything for the majority of the season makes it easier. I brought up the Pens because they were a good established team that didn't have a list of needs like the Sabres, and that's always going to be a factor in the number of call ups.

What makes me frustrated is when all the facts are combined: that VO has been one of the most deserving of a call up, he's 23, the Sabres needed scoring, and they still never gave him a look. If he starts hot and cools off, send him back down, no harm done and hopefully he's learned a thing or two. If he's good and stays good, then its found money. But this black and white, zero-nuance view on development you're attributing to me does not match up. Obviously its got a lot of factors just like anything else worth debating.

2. Ten-four

3. I felt that you disagreed with a call up because the main point of my post was advocating for one, and you responded by telling me how I and others don't understand proper development because I mentioned the Pens. So I figured you just disagreed with the whole thing, until you finally addressed the point to say that you don't care about a call up either way. Should've just said that from the start.


Edit: I will add that at this point, with VO's huge role in Rochester, I don't need a call up either.
This is just me looking back at the season and thinking of what could've been.
 
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