Confirmed with Link: [VAN/TB] Canucks acquire G Spencer Martin for Future Considerations

[MS]

Martin is a UFA at the end of the season. I think the Canucks should quickly decide whether they want him as the backup next year. I say give him a 2 year 1-way contract at $800K AAV RIGHT NOW! Martin gets some security and the Canucks risk very little.

100% agree.

These are the situations where you strike quickly when you have a chance to leverage a cheap asset long-term.

Scott Mayfield's insanely good contract with NYI is probably the best example of this. When you have a guy who has just cracked the NHL and looks to actually have something, you very often also have a player who really, really wants to lock down a one-way deal to keep himself in the NHL and undervalues himself.

__________

Given where we are as a team, it is absolutely crazy to keep playing Halak over Martin.

I can't believe people are actually endorsing continuing to play a 36-year old who probably has 3 months left in his NHL career over a guy 10 years younger who might be a long-term backup here and absolutely screwing ourselves over next year in the process ... because it would be unfair to Halak somehow.

It's a business. A younger guy on a better deal outplayed him. Tough luck.

Hopefully the team is just using Halak as a backup right now as they try to leverage a way to get him out of here, and aren't planning to get him to 10 games.

 

[m9]

100% agree.

These are the situations where you strike quickly when you have a chance to leverage a cheap asset long-term.

Scott Mayfield's insanely good contract with NYI is probably the best example of this. When you have a guy who has just cracked the NHL and looks to actually have something, you very often also have a player who really, really wants to lock down a one-way deal to keep himself in the NHL and undervalues himself.

__________

Given where we are as a team, it is absolutely crazy to keep playing Halak over Martin.

I can't believe people are actually endorsing continuing to play a 36-year old who probably has 3 months left in his NHL career over a guy 10 years younger who might be a long-term backup here and absolutely screwing ourselves over next year in the process ... because it would be unfair to Halak somehow.

It's a business. A younger guy on a better deal outplayed him. Tough luck.

Hopefully the team is just using Halak as a backup right now as they try to leverage a way to get him out of here, and aren't planning to get him to 10 games.

It's fine to play Halak 10 games if it means they can trade him for a better return. Doubt any contenders want a backup goalie with that bonus.

 

[MS]

It's fine to play Halak 10 games if it means they can trade him for a better return. Doubt any contenders want a backup goalie with that bonus.

I think he's basically untradeable unless we pay someone to take him.

I'm totally fine with just parking him. He's been outplayed by a younger player who makes more sense going forward for the team.

 

[Jyrki21]

I think he's basically untradeable unless we pay someone to take him.

I'm totally fine with just parking him. He's been outplayed by a younger player who makes more sense going forward for the team.

I don't think I've seen more than like 30 seconds of Halak playing for the Canucks, but he's been fine, no? If you're going by Martin's numbers in this little stint he's outplaying the whole league, Demko included, so it's hard to make too much of a comparison.

I originally thought the idea of trying to trade Halak before what was supposed to be a performance-in-name-only bonus was kind of funny, but if they can do it, I guess why not... he still seems to be reliable. But I don't know there are that many possible destinations and benching him to avoid a relatively small bonus seems pretty dickish.

 

[M2Beezy]

Martin is a UFA at the end of the season. I think the Canucks should quickly decide whether they want him as the backup next year. I say give him a 2 year 1-way contract at $800K AAV RIGHT NOW! Martin gets some security and the Canucks risk very little.

Agreed. Fan and I agreeing twice in one day. What a world

 

[MS]

I don't think I've seen more than like 30 seconds of Halak playing for the Canucks, but he's been fine, no? If you're going by Martin's numbers in this little stint he's outplaying the whole league, Demko included, so it's hard to make too much of a comparison.

I originally thought the idea of trying to trade Halak before what was supposed to be a performance-in-name-only bonus was kind of funny, but if they can do it, I guess why not... he still seems to be reliable. But I don't know there are that many possible destinations and benching him to avoid a relatively small bonus seems pretty dickish.

Halak was meh until his last game was very good.

The bonus is just idiotic.

He's an old goalie who was 'ok' and won't be here next year, and a younger guy they called up has been outstanding.

It's a business. Guys like Garrison and Bieksa negotiated NTCs in good faith and were then asked to waive by a new administration ... and that's how the world works. Halak negotiated his bonus in good faith ... but it's not on the new administration to just hand him that bonus if they have a younger guy who it makes more sense to play.

If they could trade him, that would be best ... but I don't see how it could be possible. No other team is going to want anything to do with that stupid bonus, either.

 

[overboard]

Has anyone seen the "future considerations" posted anywhere?

I assume it's something like a 4th or a 5th, but with Benning, you never know.

It could be a 3rd, going up to a 2nd if we re-sign the guy.

Seriously. I'm not even sure I'd be surprised...

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

100% agree.

These are the situations where you strike quickly when you have a chance to leverage a cheap asset long-term.

Scott Mayfield's insanely good contract with NYI is probably the best example of this. When you have a guy who has just cracked the NHL and looks to actually have something, you very often also have a player who really, really wants to lock down a one-way deal to keep himself in the NHL and undervalues himself.

__________

Given where we are as a team, it is absolutely crazy to keep playing Halak over Martin.

I can't believe people are actually endorsing continuing to play a 36-year old who probably has 3 months left in his NHL career over a guy 10 years younger who might be a long-term backup here and absolutely screwing ourselves over next year in the process ... because it would be unfair to Halak somehow.

It's a business. A younger guy on a better deal outplayed him. Tough luck.

Hopefully the team is just using Halak as a backup right now as they try to leverage a way to get him out of here, and aren't planning to get him to 10 games.

The only reason I would play Halak another games is if we can get a good asset, but only if we can't trade him without eating his bonus. Even then it may not be worth it.

 

[Egghead1999]

Has anyone seen the "future considerations" posted anywhere?

I assume it's something like a 4th or a 5th, but with Benning, you never know.

It could be a 3rd, going up to a 2nd if we re-sign the guy.

Seriously. I'm not even sure I'd be surprised...

No way, I remember I read somewhere that the "future considerations" are only for the paperwork now, teams may not even swap a 5th round or 6th round pick.

 

[HelloCookie]

These future considerations trades for players close to 30 are also moves to offer an opportunity for the player to have a better chance at NHL ice time. Biega, Leivo, Martin in my opinion follow that line of thinking.

 

[tyhee]

...

I can't believe people are actually endorsing continuing to play a 36-year old who probably has 3 months left in his NHL career over a guy 10 years younger who might be a long-term backup here and absolutely screwing ourselves over next year in the process ... because it would be unfair to Halak somehow. ...

I was one of those against parking Halak when it was suggested as a way to avoid paying him the games played bonus, but with the way Martin has played the bonus avoidance would no longer be the reason, just a side benefit. There's nothing wrong with playing the better goalie.

 

[MarkMM]

I'm just saying you don't have to just hand him the job next year based on a small sample size. Even if he's just competing with DiPietro, Silovs, or another minimum guy.



I would be very surprised if he didn't opt for two years of guaranteed money if it was offered.

Yeah, it's not like the only alternative is to spend millions on a back-up, sign Martin to a deal that gives him one-way security for under $1M which I'd imagine he'd take but given that this is a small sample size we should be aware that we can't know for sure how he'll hold up so explore signing other cheap options so we have depth and optionality. Worst case scenario Martin gets outplayed but even one a one-way, if under $1M he won't hurt the cap.

 

[alternate]

Halak was meh until his last game was very good.

The bonus is just idiotic.

He's an old goalie who was 'ok' and won't be here next year, and a younger guy they called up has been outstanding.

It's a business. Guys like Garrison and Bieksa negotiated NTCs in good faith and were then asked to waive by a new administration ... and that's how the world works. Halak negotiated his bonus in good faith ... but it's not on the new administration to just hand him that bonus if they have a younger guy who it makes more sense to play.

If they could trade him, that would be best ... but I don't see how it could be possible. No other team is going to want anything to do with that stupid bonus, either.

I agree with all of this except your last line. As long as the team has the cap space, the bonus doesn't really matter. It just sucks for us because LTIR can't cover it. We can also retain on his base salary to make it a bit more absorbable. We can also take back salary on a one year deal. Capfriendly says we have $3.6m available in LTIR, so really we could take back an expiring contract and the team acquiring Halak wouldn't take on any "new" cap dollars even with the bonuses (assuming they aren't in LTIR as well). So likely a back-up goalie (the acquiring team isn't going to keep 3 goalies) + a bottom of the roster player to balance things out.

Biggest obstacle is Halak's NMC. As long as he's open to waiving that, should be able to make a deal work without too much difficulty.

 

[overboard]

No way, I remember I read somewhere that the "future considerations" are only for the paperwork now, teams may not even swap a 5th round or 6th round pick.

Ah, copy that. Thanks for the info.

I can sit back now and not worry that there's some awful time-delayed Benning grenade just waiting to go off.

 

[Jyrki21]

No way, I remember I read somewhere that the "future considerations" are only for the paperwork now, teams may not even swap a 5th round or 6th round pick.

Wait, seriously?

The only deal I really ever remember the teams "coming back to" is the Murray Craven trade in late 1992-93, when the Canucks traded Jim Sandlak to Hartford after the season to complete the deal and join Robert Kron (who I was totally right had untapped offensive potential and the Canucks should have used him more).

That deal ended up being pretty consequential, as in addition to Craven, Kron and Sandlak, the two picks swapped ended up being Marek Malik (to the Whalers) and Scott Walker (to the Canucks). And both would end up playing for the other team involved later in their careers.

 

[Egghead1999]

Wait, seriously?

The only deal I really ever remember the teams "coming back to" is the Murray Craven trade in late 1992-93, when the Canucks traded Jim Sandlak to Hartford after the season to complete the deal and join Robert Kron (who I was totally right had untapped offensive potential and the Canucks should have used him more).

That deal ended up being pretty consequential, as in addition to Craven, Kron and Sandlak, the two picks swapped ended up being Marek Malik (to the Whalers) and Scott Walker (to the Canucks). And both would end up playing for the other team involved later in their careers.

Some NHL teams did some crazy shit (trading a player back and forth for the playoff run ???), so NHL or NHLPA changed the rule a while ago. In the end. that is a Benning's deal, and the current GM can give TB a finger if TB wants a 4th round pick .

 

[Egghead1999]

Yeah, it's not like the only alternative is to spend millions on a back-up, sign Martin to a deal that gives him one-way security for under $1M which I'd imagine he'd take but given that this is a small sample size we should be aware that we can't know for sure how he'll hold up so explore signing other cheap options so we have depth and optionality. Worst case scenario Martin gets outplayed but even one a one-way, if under $1M he won't hurt the cap.

Exactly, all cap space that Canucks wasted on the backup in the last few years, Canucks should sign him a 1-way or 2-ways deal right now. Look at the leafs, that is not fun to have a 4M backup sitting at the bench.

 

[MS]

Martin is a UFA at the end of the season. I think the Canucks should quickly decide whether they want him as the backup next year. I say give him a 2 year 1-way contract at $800K AAV RIGHT NOW! Martin gets some security and the Canucks risk very little.

100% agree.

These are the situations where you strike quickly when you have a chance to leverage a cheap asset long-term.

Scott Mayfield's insanely good contract with NYI is probably the best example of this. When you have a guy who has just cracked the NHL and looks to actually have something, you very often also have a player who really, really wants to lock down a one-way deal to keep himself in the NHL and undervalues himself.

Interestingly, Toronto has just done literally the exact thing we were talking about here and locked up Joseph Woll to a 3-year deal at barely over the league minimum after Woll played 4 solid NHL games to start his career.

 

[F A N]

Interestingly, Toronto has just done literally the exact thing we were talking about here and locked up Joseph Woll to a 3-year deal at barely over the league minimum after Woll played 4 solid NHL games to start his career.

I guess it's a different situation. I'm not sure whether Woll becomes a UFA if he doesn't play enough NHL games, but he is a former 3rd round pick. That would be akin (but not exactly) to locking up Dipietro for the same deal.

 

[MS]

I guess it's a different situation. I'm not sure whether Woll becomes a UFA if he doesn't play enough NHL games, but he is a former 3rd round pick. That would be akin (but not exactly) to locking up Dipietro for the same deal.

Yeah, slightly different specifics on the player but in the bigger picture the same thing - locking up a cheap backup long-term. Player takes less to guarantee themselves a one-way deal (and probable NHL job) and the team gets a cheap backup option that they can dunk back to the AHL with no cap ramifications if the player regresses.

If Dipietro had come up and played 3 great games like Martin did (and was playing at a high level in the AHL), I would have been suggesting we try to capitalize in exactly the same way.

 

[Vector]

Quick note on the Woll contract, year 1 is a two-way and years 2 & 3 are one-way.

 

[VanJack]

Is Ian Clark the best goaltending coach in all of hockey?....you could make the case that he is....in his recent interviews, Martin has stated that working with the Canucks goaltending tandem of Clark and Curtis Sanford has completely transformed him as a goalie. And you can see the results after barely half season.

 

[deckercky]

At this point, I'm not sure why there's a fuss about Halak's bonus. It's obvious that he's a asset to be traded after the bonus is paid.

If the team is considering trading a big piece this year, then the team probably isn't planning to contend next year.

We know the team is planning to open some cap space, which means that the team can probably deal with the bonus next year with relatively minimal consequences.