Confirmed with Link: [VAN/FLA] R. Luongo (15% retained) + S. Anthony for J. Markstrom + S. Matthias

[Addison Rae]

I mean is he done finishing with trades.......he won't be fire this season and we all know it. The owners will protect him

Ah, my bad.

 

[MS]

It doesn't even matter. We treat goalies like crap around here and it will happen to any goalie that plays in Vancouver.

Vancouver is goalie paradise. We've basically had 4 starting goalies in the last 34 years, save for a two year stretch when Brian Burke didn't know what the hell he was doing.

The notion that we're a goalie graveyard is the most utterly Pejorative Slured myth imaginable. Almost every guy who comes through here gets lauded as a god, and even the horrible ones (Cloutier) are given a ludicrous amount of rope with which to hang themselves.

Luongo has taken heat post-2011 after numerous playoff implosions coupled with being outplayed by his backup for 3 straight years while wanting a trade. 1 guy with a very specific set of circumstances doesn't mean we 'treat our goalies like crap'.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

Why would they fire him after he makes a good trade?

Where?

 

[MikeK]

I'm honestly not sure if it's because fans are now spoiled or because they have blacked out what the Canucks used to be like... but as mentioned Vancouver was a 'goalie graveyard' because they'd either:

a) Pick up goalies at the end of mediocre careers

or

b) Guys who were never good

Nucks goal-tending scouting and development has been top notch for some time... but they trade two guys (granted they forced themselves into terrible situations to have to make the calls) and now the goal-tending situation is suddenly awful... Yet no one points out our current starter has let in 1 or 0 goals in almost half his NHL starts....

I think a lot of our members here now were just too young to be apart of the true goalie graveyard era. We have been spoiled for almost 10 years.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

Vancouver is goalie paradise.

Oh man, thats rich.

 

[Addison Rae]

Where?

Confirmed with Link: [VAN/FLA] R. Luongo (15% retained) + S. Anthony for J. Markstrom + S. Matthias

 

[Jyrki21]

Plus good goalies can be had for a song these days. This is the main reason Schneider could only return a draft pick (albeit a good one). There are plenty of competent if unspectacular goalkeepers floating around these days, hell, half of them apparently got traded today. Look how many nobodies have played great against the Canucks this year (and no, it's not purely because "they're shooting at the crest" – every team's fans say that).

 

[MS]

I'm honestly not sure if it's because fans are now spoiled or because they have blacked out what the Canucks used to be like... but as mentioned Vancouver was a 'goalie graveyard' because they'd either:

a) Pick up goalies at the end of mediocre careers

or

b) Guys who were never good

Nucks goal-tending scouting and development has been top notch for some time... but they trade two guys (granted they forced themselves into terrible situations to have to make the calls) and now the goal-tending situation is suddenly awful... Yet no one points out our current starter has let in 1 or 0 goals in almost half his NHL starts....

We were a 'goalie graveyard' for 2 years between 1998 and 2000.

Other than that, we've been the single most stable franchise in terms of goaltending for the past 35 years, with the possible exception of NJD.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

Confirmed with Link: [VAN/FLA] R. Luongo (15% retained) + S. Anthony for J. Markstrom + S. Matthias

I'm sorry, that is an example of a trade, not a good one.

 

[MS]

Oh man, thats rich.

Explain why not?

Again, 4 starters in the last 34 years excluding the 1998-2000 mess.

Guys like McLean and Brodeur were turned into gods by the fans here and remained as starters for years after their skills eroded.

Cloutier somehow lasted 6 years despite being a total liability.

Luongo has been here for 8 years now.

Every other goalie to come through here in the last decade (from Auld through Schneider and Lack and all the other backups in between) have done well and been popular.

Every franchise has a few backup goalie duds and bad moves. We have far fewer than most.

________

Brian Burke made a mess of the goaltending in the late 1990s and developed a catchy 'goalie graveyard' phrase that our fanbase has clung to even though it's COMPLETELY incorrect and not based on any sort of reality, and whenever any sort of goaltending issue comes up, clueless fans drag that phrase out ad nauseum. It's a joke.

 

[jftam]

Mirtle posted these numbers for the recapture penalties depending on when Luongo retires. Pretty ugly:

IMO Mirtle is wrong with his numbers.

My interpretation and calcs show:

Year Retired
Annual cap hit - VAN
Annual cap hit - FLA

2017-18
$2,202,667
$1,380,667

2018-19
$2,611,667
$1,515,667

2019-20
$2,988,667
$1,344,667

2020-21
$3,810,667
$522,667

The numbers a slightly off as I originally did the calcs based on Lu being traded in the 2014 offseason. It only means that amounts shift slighty more to FLA. [edit: My calcs also don't account for retained salary, but I just wanted to point out that I doubt we'll see the $8 mil cap hit]

Also, I doubt Lu will retire until after the 2019-2020 season as he is still being paid $3.4 million that season. His salary breakdown is:

Age, SEASON, NHL SALARY
38-39, 2017-18, $6,714,000
39-40, 2018-19, $3,382,000
40-41, 2019-20, $1,618,000
41-42 , 2020-21, $1,000,000
42-43 , 2021-22, $1,000,000

 

[Chubros]

Brian Burke made a mess of the goaltending in the late 1990s and developed a catchy 'goalie graveyard' phrase that our fanbase has clung to even though it's COMPLETELY incorrect and not based on any sort of reality, and whenever any sort of goaltending issue comes up, clueless fans drag that phrase out ad nauseum. It's a joke.

This is worth quoting because it is the truth.

 

[Addison Rae]

I'm sorry, that is an example of a trade, not a good one.

Trading the second best goalie on a non playoff team on an albatross contract, for 2 assets is very much a good deal. As I stated in a Luongo thread today before the deal went down, I'd trade Luongo for a 7th. http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=80968419&postcount=604

What exactly did you expect in return for Luongo?

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

Explain why not?

Again, 4 starters in the last 34 years excluding the 1998-2000 mess.

Guys like McLean and Brodeur were turned into gods by the fans here and remained as starters for years after their skills eroded.

Cloutier somehow lasted 6 years despite being a total liability.

Luongo has been here for 8 years now.

Every other goalie to come through here in the last decade (from Auld through Schneider and Lack and all the other backups in between) have done well and been popular.

Every franchise has a few backup goalie duds and bad moves. We have far fewer than most.

________

Brian Burke made a mess of the goaltending in the late 1990s and developed a catchy 'goalie graveyard' phrase that our fanbase has clung to even though it's COMPLETELY incorrect and not based on any sort of reality, and whenever any sort of goaltending issue comes up, clueless fans drag that phrase out ad nauseum. It's a joke.

Alex Auld started 67 games in one season for the Canucks
Irbe started 41
Hirsch started 41
Garth snow started 65

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

Trading the second best goalie on a non playoff team on an albatross contract, for 2 assets is very much a good deal. As I stated in a Luongo thread today before the deal went down, I'd trade Luongo for a 7th. http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=80968419&postcount=604

What exactly did you expect in return for Luongo?

OK, I see where your mistake was.

My expected return was exactly what we saw because the process was ****ing pathetic and a debacle.

 

[y2kcanucks]

Trading the second best goalie on a non playoff team on an albatross contract, for 2 assets is very much a good deal. As I stated in a Luongo thread today before the deal went down, I'd trade Luongo for a 7th. http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=80968419&postcount=604

What exactly did you expect in return for Luongo?

Second best goalie? What? We traded Lack?

 

[CherryToke]

http://iphone.tsn.ca/tsnpodcasts//tsnradio/PMMar4.mp3

Pierre McGuire says this is larceny for the Canucks.

 

[MS]

Alex Auld started 67 games in one season for the Canucks
Irbe started 41
Hirsch started 41
Garth snow started 65

Auld started 67 games because our starter (Cloutier) was injured.

Irbe and Snow were in that 1998-2000 period.

Hirsch started fewer games than McLean in 1995-96. McLean was still the starter.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

Auld started 67 games because our starter (Cloutier) was injured.

Irbe and Snow were in that 1998-2000 period.

Hirsch started fewer games than McLean in 1995-96. McLean was still the starter.

All were starters for the team, regardless of your caveats.

 

[John Bender*]

IMO Mirtle is wrong with his numbers.

My interpretation and calcs show:

Year Retired
Annual cap hit - VAN
Annual cap hit - FLA

2017-18
$2,202,667
$1,380,667

2018-19
$2,611,667
$1,515,667

2019-20
$2,988,667
$1,344,667

2020-21
$3,810,667
$522,667

The numbers a slightly off as I originally did the calcs based on Lu being traded in the 2014 offseason. It only means that amounts shift slighty more to FLA. [edit: My calcs also don't account for retained salary, but I just wanted to point out that I doubt we'll see the $8 mil cap hit]

Also, I doubt Lu will retire until after the 2019-2020 season as he is still being paid $3.4 million that season. His salary breakdown is:

Age, SEASON, NHL SALARY
38-39, 2017-18, $6,714,000
39-40, 2018-19, $3,382,000
40-41, 2019-20, $1,618,000
41-42 , 2020-21, $1,000,000
42-43 , 2021-22, $1,000,000

Question: if Luongo is about to retire, could the Canucks just not re-acquire him from whatever team he is on and buy him out? Is there anything stopping that from happening?

 

[John Bender*]

http://iphone.tsn.ca/tsnpodcasts//tsnradio/PMMar4.mp3

Pierre McGuire says this is larceny for the Canucks.

Finally someone who gets it. Luongo had no trade value with his contract. Ward, Fer-canuckhater-raro, and Dreger all ranted about how the Canucks did not get enough for Luongo. The thing is........he had the worst contract in hockey, and no longer had the abilities to justify it. Add to that, he was 35 years old. Very little about Lu is desireable.

I am shocked, to be honest, that FLA took him back.

 

[DennisReynolds]

I don't understand this deal for Panthers at all.

 

[MS]

All were starters for the team, regardless of your caveats.

Good grief. You're just arguing semantics to be difficult.

Richard Brodeur was our starter from 1980-1987.

Kirk McLean from 1987-1998.

Then it was a disaster for two years under Burke/Keenan.

Then Dan Cloutier from 2000-2006.

Then Roberto Luongo from 2006 onward.

Excluding those two years in the late 1990s, our goaltending situation has been *ridiculously* consistent for the last 35 years. Of course there have been injuries and hot backups given runs here and there - that happens for any team. But by and large goaltending has been consistent as you can possibly imagine.

 

[MS]

Finally someone who gets it. Luongo had no trade value with his contract. Ward, Fer-canuckhater-raro, and Dreger all ranted about how the Canucks did not get enough for Luongo. The thing is........he had the worst contract in hockey, and no longer had the abilities to justify it. Add to that, he was 35 years old. Very little about Lu is desireable.

I am shocked, to be honest, that FLA took him back.

Yeah, the narrative here is mindboggling.

Luongo was a guy we couldn't get rid of last summer. Negative trade value, would have cleared waivers. Nobody would take him.

Now, after another mediocre half-season of hockey, when we somehow do manage to find a taker for that albatross of a contract ... he's a superstar goalie who should have brought back a massive return? Are you serious?

It's a freaking miracle we got more than a bag of pucks back for a 35 y/o declining goalie with one of the worst 3 contracts in the NHL.