Unpopular Sports Opinions

[Neutrinos]

Technology should determine balls and strikes, not umpires

The goal should be to get every call right, and that includes every pitch

 

[Cassano]

yeah any team would do that 10/10 times

sure giving up torres for half a season of chapman was too much but they got a title out of it and that's really all that matters

This is too simplistic to look at it, in my view.

Sure, if you traded him for a player who carried you on your backs throughout the playoffs, I'd think it's fine. But Chapman was probably 10th in terms of importance/contribution to that WS run.

 

[Terry Yake]

carlos delgado should be in the HOF

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

This is too simplistic to look at it, in my view.

Sure, if you traded him for a player who carried you on your backs throughout the playoffs, I'd think it's fine. But Chapman was probably 10th in terms of importance/contribution to that WS run.

I doubt the Cubs win the WS without Chapman. They won in extra innings in game 7 to a depleted Indians team. They needed every ounce of help to get the job done

 

[Cassano]

I doubt the Cubs win the WS without Chapman. They won in extra innings in game 7 to a depleted Indians team. They needed every ounce of help to get the job done

He blew it in game 7. They won in spite of him that game.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

carlos delgado should be in the HOF

An excellent power hitter and an all-time great Blue Jay but he’s not HOF worthy at all.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

He blew it in game 7. They won in spite of him that game.

Right. I forgot that was the only game played that postseason.

 

[ViktorBaeArvidsson]

I thought this thread was called “unpopular sports onions” so that’s a pretty unpopular opinion. I probably have dyslexia...

 

[Baksfamous112]

Laine is a good hockey player

 

[Cassano]

Right. I forgot that was the only game played that postseason.

He had multiple bad games those playoffs. It's not like he was lights out uninhabitable. There were better relievers in the playoffs - like Andrew Miller.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

He had multiple bad games those playoffs. It's not like he was lights out uninhabitable. There were better relievers in the playoffs - like Andrew Miller.

And Miller gave up 2 crucial runs in game 7 against the Cubs. Yes he was lights out earlier in the postseason.

I’m not saying Chapman was amazing in the playoffs or something but he was a contributor to a championship team. We don’t know how the pen would have performed without him all we know is that the Cubs won in the end. It was well worth it to their franchise.

 

[darko]

An excellent power hitter and an all-time great Blue Jay but he’s not HOF worthy at all.

Agree

 

[darko]

Certainly softens the blow but it doesn't make it a good trade either.

This.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Certainly softens the blow but it doesn't make it a good trade either.

They got the best possible result out of it, though.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

They got the best possible result out of it, though.

Let's put it this way. If you're the Cubs and you're presented with these two options which do you go for?

Option A
Trade Torres for Chapman. Chapman is just average for you and Torres becomes a possible HOFer but you 100% win the 2016 championship and break your 108 year old drought.

Option B
You don't trade for Chapman and hold on to Torres for the future. Torres becomes a possible HOFer down the road but won't contribute in your 2016 world series bid. You have a 60/40 chance of winning it all in 2016.

I give up the potential HOFer everytime for a 100% world series outcome.

 

[Terry Yake]

Let's put it this way. If you're the Cubs and you're presented with these two options which do you go for?

Option A
Trade Torres for Chapman. Chapman is just average for you and Torres becomes a possible HOFer but you 100% win the 2016 championship and break your 108 year old drought.

Option B
You don't trade for Chapman and hold on to Torres for the future. Torres becomes a possible HOFer down the road but won't contribute in your 2016 world series bid. You have a 60/40 chance of winning it all in 2016.

I give up the potential HOFer everytime for a 100% world series outcome.

exactly

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Let's put it this way. If you're the Cubs and you're presented with these two options which do you go for?

Option A
Trade Torres for Chapman. Chapman is just average for you and Torres becomes a possible HOFer but you 100% win the 2016 championship and break your 108 year old drought.

Option B
You don't trade for Chapman and hold on to Torres for the future. Torres becomes a possible HOFer down the road but won't contribute in your 2016 world series bid. You have a 60/40 chance of winning it all in 2016.

I give up the potential HOFer everytime for a 100% world series outcome.

Those banners stay forever.

 

[MurrayBannerman]

Let's put it this way. If you're the Cubs and you're presented with these two options which do you go for?

Option A
Trade Torres for Chapman. Chapman is just average for you and Torres becomes a possible HOFer but you 100% win the 2016 championship and break your 108 year old drought.

Option B
You don't trade for Chapman and hold on to Torres for the future. Torres becomes a possible HOFer down the road but won't contribute in your 2016 world series bid. You have a 60/40 chance of winning it all in 2016.

I give up the potential HOFer everytime for a 100% world series outcome.

But that's not the reality. The Cubs entered the postseason with a like 10-15% chance of winning the World Series. How much of a bump did Chapman buy them? Maybe like 1 or 2 percent?

 

[Terry Yake]

But that's not the reality. The Cubs entered the postseason with a like 10-15% chance of winning the World Series. How much of a bump did Chapman buy them? Maybe like 1 or 2 percent?

who would've been their closer had they not acquired chapman?

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

who would've been their closer had they not acquired chapman?

Hector Rodon

 

[MurrayBannerman]

who would've been their closer had they not acquired chapman?

Melancon? Will Smith?

Melancon got the Pirates Velasquez, but I bet the Cubs could have beaten that offer at the time without including Torres.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

But that's not the reality. The Cubs entered the postseason with a like 10-15% chance of winning the World Series. How much of a bump did Chapman buy them? Maybe like 1 or 2 percent?

Well I would argue that their odds were realistically better than that. They were the front runners all season and even if everything was equal among the teams that advanced past the wild card game (top 8) their odds were 15% at worst.

How much Chapman increased those odds is immeasurable, but obviously the Cubs front office thought he was enough of a difference maker to give up a bluechipper in Torres.

Like others have mentioned, the trade can be both a bad one value wise for the long term but still advantageous because of the result.

Maybe the Cubs still win the World Series without Chapman... or maybe they lose in the ALDS against SF where he ended up getting 3 saves (yes, I know he blew game 3). Sometimes all you can do is base things on overall results because you can't breakdown the nuts and bolts enough to see which player was the most important at exactly which time in exactly which game that led to the overall win. There are a million factors that go into it. Maybe it's a lazy answer but it's the best one out there.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

Melancon? Will Smith?

Melancon got the Pirates Velasquez, but I bet the Cubs could have beaten that offer at the time without including Torres.

Or Neither PIT and MIL trade with the Cubs because they don't want to trade within the division. Or if they do, they ask for more for a division tax.

 

[MurrayBannerman]

Or Neither PIT and MIL trade with the Cubs because they don't want to trade within the division. Or if they they they ask for more for a division tax.

I think that would have been fine since the Cubs were flush with prospects at the time.

 

[MurrayBannerman]

Well I would argue that their odds were realistically better than that. They were the front runners all season and even if everything was equal among the teams that advanced past the wild card game (top 8) their odds were 15% at worst.

How much Chapman increased those odds is immeasurable, but obviously the Cubs front office thought he was enough of a difference maker to give up a bluechipper in Torres.

Like others have mentioned, the trade can be both a bad one value wise for the long term but still advantageous because of the result.

Maybe the Cubs still win the World Series without Chapman... or maybe they lose in the ALDS against SF where he ended up getting 3 saves (yes, I know he blew game 3). Sometimes all you can do is base things on overall results because you can't breakdown the nuts and bolts enough to see which player was the most important at exactly which time in exactly which game that led to the overall win. There are a million factors that go into it. Maybe it's a lazy answer but it's the best one out there.

2016 MLB Predictions

They went from 13% to 17%. So, you're right. The change was larger than I expected.

I get the angle of trying to fit things within your timeline, but I don't think that's the case. The Cubs elected to pay a top end price in a red hot market. It worked out, sure. But, as you said, how does this change if one or two things just don't go their way in the playoffs? A good comparison is their deal for Quintana. Without him, they're not a playoff team and not an NLCS team, but because they didn't win the World Series. He's pitched well, despite a rough 2018, and has filled just a critical of a need.