Unpopular Opinions: Leafs Edition

[Boutette]

Generally you're not supposed to judge players by the worst you've ever seen them play, which was the case for Komarov last season. You take some sort of average, which says Komarov is at least a solid fourth liner.

Actually that should be the case in determining if a player should be resigned to any amount of at or above the Marincin line. If a player has shown he is capable of sustaining the kind of play that plays him off an NHL team reasonably healthy (which Komarov did) then you shouldn't suggest he's worthy of being on the team more than Marty Marincin.

 

[ULF_55]

When people talk about replacing Gardiner, they aren't assuming we will play fewer bodies. I mean, come on man, you know people aren't that stupid. That's straw men all around.

When people talk about "not replacing Gardiner" , they're talking about replacing a 50 point defenseman who reliably drives the puck up the ice. You can't just go out and find a replacement for that. The trade value of such a thing is like, multiple first round picks and prospects, and you aren't getting a Doughty or top guy, so the player is going to have their own limitations just like Gardiner does. That's why addition by subtraction is a ridiculous notion here. You can't get rid of Gardiner and then just see what you can find. You're going to find ****. Really expensive ****.

So the Leafs could get multiple 1st. round picks for Gardiner?

Everyone knows Gardiner is about offense.

I would think management already knows what their plans are, perhaps it is extending Gardiner.

Hopefully, they make the team stronger defensively to cover up for his moments.

Gardiner is a really fun player to watch, especially in the 82 game season, just not the one you want to rely on to defend in the post-season.

 

[uncleben]

Carrick is going to be a solid top-4 defenseman on a team that won't be the Leafs, and we're going to lose him for basically nothing.

Martin Marincin is a solid defensive top-6 defenseman who didn't get a fair shake on the Leafs. Gigantic improvement over Polak, and can play the right side.

William Nylander is going to be a PPG player next season.

Connor Brown is not very good, and we should trade him while teams believe the guy is "the type of guy you need to win".

Tyler Bozak on a reduced contract would be a good pick-up to play on our 3rd line.

Replacing JVR's production will be nearly impossible.

I like Hyman on Matthews/Nylanders wing.

Everything I wanted to say! Especially Bozak
Except for Brown. WhileI don't agree I can see where it is coming from and respect it

 

[Joey Hoser]

So the Leafs could get multiple 1st. round picks for Gardiner?

"Multiple first round picks and prospects" as in some combination, of course. And anything that can effectively replace what he brings, offensively or defensively, is going to cost similar, or more if you want an upgrade that makes your team better.

Everyone knows Gardiner is about offense.

I would think management already knows what their plans are, perhaps it is extending Gardiner.

Hopefully, they make the team stronger defensively to cover up for his moments.

Yeah, that's a way better plan, and kind of the obvious one. We need to get better defensively. If we get rid of Gardiner, then we'll need to get better defensively just the same, AND we have to replace what Gardiner brings.

And that's just going along with the notion that Gardiner is terrible defensively, and even though I know this is going to put me on a bit of an island, I don't actually think he's even bad defensively. Yes, he makes mistakes that make you throw your beer at the TV, more often than anyone else, but those are just "loud" moments. On average, he's perfectly capable defensively, gets the puck back and moves it out. Guy is a +33 over the last two years. I know people don't like +/-, but the team is overwhelmingly successful when he's on the ice. That couldn't be the case if he was as bad as so many people think.

 

[Joey Hoser]

Actually that should be the case in determining if a player should be resigned to any amount of at or above the Marincin line. If a player has shown he is capable of sustaining the kind of play that plays him off an NHL team reasonably healthy (which Komarov did) then you shouldn't suggest he's worthy of being on the team more than Marty Marincin.

Uhhh... I never mentioned Marincin. Are you OK?

 

[luvdahattymatty]

The real issue has been stated a thousand times on here but Gards brings what Dermott and Rielly already give you. What they need is 3 guys like McNabb. Big strong fast physical and mean. Preferably on the right side. When Lilegren is ready then he comes up and we need 2 on right side and 1 on the left. Gards should be able to bring you 1 guy like McNabb and maybe a decent pick or prospect.

 

[BlueBaron]

With Dubas taking over as the GM the Leafs will take a step back in the standings this upcoming season as Leafs will not adequately replace their pending UFA departures.

Less that 105 points will be the outcome with the 36 goals of JVR missed the most, particularly on the PP.

Once the 3 amigos all have their new contracts Leafs depth will be tested.

There are so many holes in this statement.

Dubas is a crap GM just because?

Bozak, Polak, Moore and Komorov are crippling departures that cannot be replaced. No, only JVR will be which does suggest a slight dip in goal production if no one improves. Will it also be matched with an improvement in goals against?

Our team full of young guys cannot possibly improve enough to compensate for the loss of JVR's goals? Come on.

The depth will be tested is not too profound, it is inevitable after a team assembles it's core. However we can already internally replace most of our UFA losses so that is a good while off yet unless we get a Taveres or top D.

As much fun as doom and gloom is, there is a lot of room for optimism.

 

[luvdahattymatty]

The team needs to start team building. We have a solid base from the picks. But we have too many wingers. We lack quality defensive dmen. We have too many offensive minded dmen. Next area is centre.

 

[ULF_55]

"Multiple first round picks and prospects" as in some combination, of course. And anything that can effectively replace what he brings, offensively or defensively, is going to cost similar, or more if you want an upgrade that makes your team better.



Yeah, that's a way better plan, and kind of the obvious one. We need to get better defensively. If we get rid of Gardiner, then we'll need to get better defensively just the same, AND we have to replace what Gardiner brings.

And that's just going along with the notion that Gardiner is terrible defensively, and even though I know this is going to put me on a bit of an island, I don't actually think he's even bad defensively. Yes, he makes mistakes that make you throw your beer at the TV, more often than anyone else, but those are just "loud" moments. On average, he's perfectly capable defensively, gets the puck back and moves it out. Guy is a +33 over the last two years. I know people don't like +/-, but the team is overwhelmingly successful when he's on the ice. That couldn't be the case if he was as bad as so many people think.

Yes, Gardiner can be okay defensively but he has loud times that sink the ship. He can be as bad as he is good. In the playoffs those blunders can end the season.

 

[X66]

Gardiner is a very good dman, in fact, Leaf fans that are so easy to dismiss him are fans I really don't take all that seriously.

Look at this guys main partners in the last 5 seasons

2018 zaitsev
2017 Carrick & Zaitsev
2016 Phaneuf & Corrado
2015 Rielly & Holzer (Rielly was a sophomore)
2014 Franson & Ranger

Rielly and Gardiner never had a stabilizing force to help the pairings that they were on in their time here.

The Leafs d-pairings have had some of the worst chemistry ever the last few years, can't stand it.

I know it'll change eventually though.

 

[Havoc]

There are so many holes in this statement.

Dubas is a crap GM just because?

Bozak, Polak, Moore and Komorov are crippling departures that cannot be replaced. No, only JVR will be which does suggest a slight dip in goal production if no one improves. Will it also be matched with an improvement in goals against?

Our team full of young guys cannot possibly improve enough to compensate for the loss of JVR's goals? Come on.

The depth will be tested is not too profound, it is inevitable after a team assembles it's core. However we can already internally replace most of our UFA losses so that is a good while off yet unless we get a Taveres or top D.

As much fun as doom and gloom is, there is a lot of room for optimism.

True. I look at Vegas and they're so dominant because all their hard working players are in their prime.

We're looking at multiple years of dominance when matthews, nylander, marner, kap and johnsson all hit their prime at the same exact time. They're more skilled than Vegas' current top 6 as well. Just let these guys keep developing.

The thing with the Leafs, dropping in the standings next season will only be an illusion of regression. Making the playoffs without two veterans who probably accounted for at least 10 of our wins (those bozak shootouts were clutch + jvr had a lot of key goals when Marner and Nylander were imitating Komarov) is progress. Even if it's a wild card position. I don't see us dropping to the point we're out of the playoffs entirely. Kadri is still in his prime and Marleau is a solid veteran. Add in workhorse Hyman and we're already at 8 efficient players.

Adding someone like James Neal to be winger for transitioning Nylander to center already makes us better. Not saying this particular move needs to happen but the state of the Leafs after july 1st can easily be handled by management. Lots of options to cook up.

Plus we have "the best goaltender in the world"- Cherry.

 

[Muston Atthews]

Andersen choked big time in game 7

 

[Boutette]

Uhhh... I never mentioned Marincin. Are you OK?

Maybe when you've reached the grade where they teach you what an analogy is you'll understand.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Andersen choked big time in game 7

While he could have played a better game and I agree he looked bad on the 5th goal against which was the game winning goal, I still think Gardiner did a horrible job defensively against DeBrusk before he scored.

 

[Menzinger]

Andersen Should start less games next season, especially in the second half
of the season if the playoffs look like a lock.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Andersen Should start less games next season, especially in the second half
of the season if the playoffs look like a lock.

This past season the Leafs had 3rd in the Atlantic basically locked up for the longest time until their playoff spot was clinched and Babcock still played Andersen a lot.

 

[LeafFever]

This past season the Leafs had 3rd in the Atlantic basically locked up for the longest time until their playoff spot was clinched and Babcock still played Andersen a lot.

I never understood taht because he was so sure to make all the forwards play less minutes than their counterparts. Marner played only 16:28 last season. Litterally Laine is the only player as a comparable who had similar TOI with similar stats.

 

[Gallagbi]

I never understood taht because he was so sure to make all the forwards play less minutes than their counterparts. Marner played only 16:28 last season. Litterally Laine is the only player as a comparable who had similar TOI with similar stats.

Makes me wonder if their sports science group doesn't see an issue with a goalie starting often.

 

[Gallagbi]

While he could have played a better game and I agree he looked bad on the 5th goal against which was the game winning goal, I still think Gardiner did a horrible job defensively against DeBrusk before he scored.

Its not played perfectly, but he limits DeBrusk to a low percentage shot and it's literally the only play DeBrusk has. Sometimes you just need a save, especially routine one, which Andersen wasn't able to make.

 

[luvdahattymatty]

Inside tip here. Gards can't pivot when skating backwards to his left at playoff speed he always pivots to his right when under pressure and when he thinks he is beat. Watch video clips and see for yourself. Barb has been working with him on this issue for a few years. So he knows what he has to do but he cant execute under pressure. Folks this is a very difficult skill to master at 18/19 years old. Every defence has a strong side and a weak side for pivoting. But his gap is huge. Reps and playing defence longer helps but again it is very very hard to switch positions in college. The sad part is he knows it and i think he is working extra hard to fix. It is a tough fix though. This was not just a one off goof up mental error here.

 

[ottomaddox]

Our 12th forward and 6th defenceman will be widely embraced by our fanbase next season.

 

[Duke16]

Gauthier won't be in contention for 4C, infact he may not even be qualified. Even as a defensive C, failing to hit 20PTS once in 3 consecutive AHL seasons is brutal. He only got a look because he was a first rounder imo.

Marlies C's next year include:
One of Lindholm/Aaltonen
Chris Mueller
Adam Brooks
Colin Greening
Brady Ferguson?

It won't be hard to add another vet C to the stable either.

 

[Gallagbi]

Gauthier won't be in contention for 4C, infact he may not even be qualified. Even as a defensive C, failing to hit 20PTS once in 3 consecutive AHL seasons is brutal. He only got a look because he was a first rounder imo.

Marlies C's next year include:
One of Lindholm/Aaltonen
Chris Mueller
Adam Brooks
Colin Greening
Brady Ferguson?

It won't be hard to add another vet C to the stable either.

He's honestly the weirdest prospect I can ever remember. His numbers are awful, but he's been given more than a few chances to earn a spot.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Gauthier won't be in contention for 4C, infact he may not even be qualified. Even as a defensive C, failing to hit 20PTS once in 3 consecutive AHL seasons is brutal. He only got a look because he was a first rounder imo.

Marlies C's next year include:
One of Lindholm/Aaltonen
Chris Mueller
Adam Brooks
Colin Greening
Brady Ferguson?

It won't be hard to add another vet C to the stable either.

Would the Leafs even consider re-signing Greening? I know this time Dubas is the GM and I'm not sure how much of a say Babcock had, but prior to the 2016-2017 season it was Lamoriello who placed Greening on waivers.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

The Leafs don't HAVE to make a big splash this offseason via trade or free agency. One of the key parts about patience that people seem to forget is knowing when to hold 'em and knowing when to fold 'em. Sure everyone seems fine to let the prospects simmer in the lower leagues, but God forbid we enter into training camp with the only additions being a few Marlies graduates and Ozhiganov.

I'd personally love to get Tavares and acquire a good defenseman, it'd be my ideal off season. But if the Leafs look at the market and come to the conclusion that it doesn't make sense to make any major additions right now, it's not the end of the world. We're still better than half the Atlantic Division teams and we've still got a good shot of making the playoffs. Not to mention our best players are still in their early 20s and we'll likely see improvement based on just them maturing.

I don't believe the Leafs WILL stand pat however. Just that if they do, it won't be an end of the world scenario.