Uhhhhhh guys......

[My Special Purpose]

http://www.forbes.com/teams/carolina-hurricanes/

Value of Carolina Hurricanes in 2005, according to Forbes: $100m.

Value of Carolina Hurricanes in 2013, after *four consecutive playoff misses*: $187m.

May all of your stock portfolios do nearly as well.

--hank

And also keep in mind that this franchise continues to be among the worst marketed teams in all of professional sports -- if not *the* worst. From Day 1 back in May 1997, Karmanos and Rutherford have done virtually everything wrong from a marketing standpoint. From the early "if you build it, they will come," mindset right up to to the current patronizing "you just don't understand how hockey works" implications, they have misjudged the market so many times, it's comical.

If we're going to pin all our failures the past few seasons on coaching, then let's pin our failures the past several seasons to correctly bring this team to market where it belongs as well: on the leadership. There should be a palpable Hurricanes vibe in this town, especially now that preseason games have started, but there's nothing. They are barely relevant in Raleigh right now, which is just flat-out amazing.

I assure everyone who really thinks it's possible that the Hurricanes relocate, that outsiders see value in this franchise exactly where it is. They know there's a lot of room for growth here and that Karmanos has barely scratched the surface.

The Canes aren't going anywhere. Karmanos is.

 

[RodTheBawd]

I don't really agree with you. I think they've done a decent job at marketing the team, but no amount of marketing makes up for a ****** product. Combine that with the fact college sports are always going to dominate this area, the only way to make a significant jump is to be a perennial playoff team.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

While I agree the product has been poor the last few years, I agree with Kev that the marketing really has been lacking and I assume that's one of the things Waddell has been brought in for. Even in areas where you would think there would be a lot of effort (youth hockey, local rinks, dreamsports, etc...) it's marginal at best. There are maybe a handful of sports bars that a) have any Hurricanes memorabilia on the walls and b) even play the game on TV without a devoted fan asking about it. Very few stores even attempt to sell Canes gear. The corporate marketing aspect has been limited as well, which is a shame, because a lot of the employees for these companies are northern transplants.

And maybe it's because the arena is way outside any downtown (Raleigh, Durham, etc..), there is no vibe in any downtown area either. If you are downtown Raleigh, you wouldn't even know the Canes exist. Contrast that to the Durham Bulls.

I'm not saying I know how to fix it by any means, and the job is MUCH harder when the team struggles like it has, but even that (the team's struggles and it's impact on marketing) ultimately falls on the leadership of the organization.

 

[RodTheBawd]

I'm by no means a marketing expert, but I still don't see it. Stores don't sell Canes merchandise because it doesn't sell. Bars don't push the Canes games because they don't draw crowds. Attempts to force the team down people's throats while advertising a ****** product doesn't sound like a viable strategy. You've gotta convert all of these northern transplants to Hurricanes fans, and the only way you do that is by winning consistently. Missing the playoffs for 5 years and bumping prices across the board has been more of a detriment than their marketing.

I could very well not have any idea what I'm talking about, unfortunately I focused on a real discipline

 

[DaleCooper]

If you are downtown Raleigh, you wouldn't even know the Canes exist.

Do they still have those flags up everywhere?

That's all I got.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I'm by no means a marketing expert, but I still don't see it. Stores don't sell Canes merchandise because it doesn't sell. Bars don't push the Canes games because they don't draw crowds. Attempts to force the team down people's throats while advertising a ****** product doesn't sound like a viable strategy. You've gotta convert all of these northern transplants to Hurricanes fans, and the only way you do that is by winning consistently. Missing the playoffs for 5 years and bumping prices across the board has been more of a detriment than their marketing.

I could very well not have any idea what I'm talking about, unfortunately I focused on a real discipline

Fair enough..I'm in a technical field so marketing isn't my forte either but it seems like there could (and should) be more going on and more creative ways to get the brand out there. I think it's telling that the team also realizes this which is why they brought in Waddell. He was brought in to grow revenue and marketing will have to be a piece of that.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

re: flags and stuff downtown. I was down there this past weekend, but didn't take a look, but obviously, nothing stood out. I'll be back down this weekend so will see if I can see any.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Even in areas where you would think there would be a lot of effort (youth hockey, local rinks, dreamsports, etc...) it's marginal at best. There are maybe a handful of sports bars that a) have any Hurricanes memorabilia on the walls and b) even play the game on TV without a devoted fan asking about it. Very few stores even attempt to sell Canes gear. The corporate marketing aspect has been limited as well, which is a shame, because a lot of the employees for these companies are northern transplants.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I feel like I see a decent amount of marketing out there.

- Local rinks -- there are huge Canes banners at Dreamsports, and Canes stuff all over the walls at the ice rinks. Could they have more of a physical presence at those places... probably... but I can't say I really know what they already do. This all probably reflects as much about typical crummy rink management as it does about the Canes themselves.

- I don't go to bars much anymore, but I can pretty easily think of more than a handful of places with Canes stuff on the walls and the game on TV. I'd actually find it kind of weird to see a significant sports bar that DIDN'T have at least a little hockey-related corner or something. But again, I'm not an expert in this category.

- NHL gear in general is kind of scarce outside of big markets in this country.

- They just ran a big TV campaign aimed at corporate partners, and renovated a suite into a loge-style area to attract more grassroots corporate ticketholders. Is there something specific that they're missing on this front?


edit: One thing they're trying this year is giving fans yard signs advertising opening night. I've seen a couple of them in random places around town, which is kind of neat because that's true grassroots fan promotion.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Out of the 4 sports bars around State that I have been to, only one will actually have the game on without my asking. But this is likely because they have 200 teams in the place.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Maybe I'm crazy, but I feel like I see a decent amount of marketing out there.

- Local rinks -- there are huge Canes banners at Dreamsports, and Canes stuff all over the walls at the ice rinks. Could they have more of a physical presence at those places... probably... but I can't say I really know what they already do. This all probably reflects as much about typical crummy rink management as it does about the Canes themselves.

I admittedly havent' been in the rinks for a couple of years, but was in both ice and roller rinks multiple times / week in years past. Some of those banners are pretty dated (I think the one in Dreamsports was a Cullen Olympics Banner). It was minimalist. I know for a fact that Dreamsports tried to do some work with the Canes and it was met with a luke warm reception at best (ie...come spend a bunch of money advertising at Canes games and then we'll talk to you).

- NHL gear in general is kind of scarce outside of big markets in this country.

Fair enough, and maybe the NHL doesn't allow them to do things (ie..offer discounts) to enable broader distribution.

- They just ran a big TV campaign aimed at corporate partners, and renovated a suite into a loge-style area to attract more grassroots corporate ticketholders. Is there something specific that they're missing on this front?

That's what I was referring to why I "think" Waddell was brought on, specifically for this type of stuff. Hopefully we see more of that.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I admittedly havent' been in the rinks for a couple of years, but was in both ice and roller rinks multiple times / week in years past. Some of those banners are pretty dated (I think the one in Dreamsports was a Cullen Olympics Banner).

That one's still there, but there's a newer one at the other end that's just a big Canes logo on a rectangle.

I know for a fact that Dreamsports tried to do some work with the Canes and it was met with a luke warm reception at best (ie...come spend a bunch of money advertising at Canes games and then we'll talk to you).

That's just dumb on the Canes' part. They should know that a place like Dreamsports doesn't have a bunch of ad money and even if they did, they could never make it back on skate sales or whatever.

They should view a partner like that as growing their ticket base, by getting people (especially kids) more interested in the sport.

That's what I was referring to why I "think" Waddell was brought on, specifically for this type of stuff. Hopefully we see more of that.

You're probably right on that.

 

[GoCanes2013]

Analogy: I never heard (or noticed) squat about Soccer. Then the World Cup happened. When I was in places that were carrying games, my interest (slowly) grew. I have a completely different opinion now than before the World Cup games. I attribute it to the simple fact that places played the games, I had not much other choice but to watch, and I started taking notice.

The Hurricanes/NHL could do the same. Just get more places to play the games. Interest will grow. When they play games, play the Canes games, not the Pens or Rangers.

Marketing the Canes has been 'okay' but then I've had a background connection to the organization at the same time so I've had an affinity for them that might have skewed my perspective.

But I agree they could do more on the Marketing side. Maybe Waddell will help that.

I don't think hiring non-fan new grads as 'Account Managers' for Season Ticket Holder is necessarily the right approach. I know they need to control costs, but there needs to be some Hockey Passion embedded in the Organization's Outbound efforts as well.

 

[JClaus33]

The Ale House in Winston-Salem by Hanes mall has some Canes stuff, that might be the only place in the area that actively promotes the Canes though. I know every time I've been there during games, they've been on tv there

 

[A Star is Burns]

It's a bit of a different market, but I've seen the transformation winning can make in the D.C. area with the Capitals. It used to be more difficult to find Capitals gear even in sports related stores, and there is definitely more of a presence for that kind of thing even in non sports stores. Local sports radio up here rarely touched on the Caps back when they were awful, but now they have some hockey segments here and there. Not a huge presence, but more than they had before. I definitely run into more people that have a passing interest in it after all these years of playoffs. And while I don't frequent bars and the like too much, I see the game on at restaurants and such plenty now compared to before. Throw in some marketing like Rock the Red, and it's night and day from what it was years ago. So I think it's a combination of both. From an outsiders perspective, I don't get the idea that we market enough, but it's hard to market but so much when your team blows like we have for years now. And we've never seen what a string of playoffs could do for the market.

 

[FlyingSquirrels]

I'm hearing Waddell was interviewed today and said the team will stay hear "for now". Anybody listen or read the context? Not liking the fact they are leaving themselves an out. Where there's smoke......

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

hes just talking about how there's no owner yet. when it does happen, it seems like it will most likely be a group of local investors, similar to a couple years ago but on a bigger scale...


mods, do you think it would be good to turn this into an "ownership situation" thread?

 

[What the Faulk]

I'm hearing Waddell was interviewed today and said the team will stay hear "for now". Anybody listen or read the context? Not liking the fact they are leaving themselves an out. Where there's smoke......

TBJ Raleigh/Durham @TriangleBIZJrnl
Carolina Hurricanes president: Team will remain in Raleigh for now http://fb.me/37uHfWbaZ

Mike Sundheim @MikeSundheim
.@TriangleBIZJrnl Possibly the most irresponsible headline I have seen in 15 years on this job.

 

[DaleCooper]

That's hilarious. Here's the writer trying to defend himself: http://t.co/pd70NzKIAf

The New York Rangers are not moving to Rhode Island... for now. Who knows what could happen in 500 years!

 

[cptjeff]

It's a bit of a different market, but I've seen the transformation winning can make in the D.C. area with the Capitals. It used to be more difficult to find Capitals gear even in sports related stores, and there is definitely more of a presence for that kind of thing even in non sports stores. Local sports radio up here rarely touched on the Caps back when they were awful, but now they have some hockey segments here and there. Not a huge presence, but more than they had before. I definitely run into more people that have a passing interest in it after all these years of playoffs. And while I don't frequent bars and the like too much, I see the game on at restaurants and such plenty now compared to before. Throw in some marketing like Rock the Red, and it's night and day from what it was years ago. So I think it's a combination of both. From an outsiders perspective, I don't get the idea that we market enough, but it's hard to market but so much when your team blows like we have for years now. And we've never seen what a string of playoffs could do for the market.

Yeah, the Caps are a big deal here these days. I liked how last year, after the Caps failed to make the playoffs, the media was blowing up about it for weeks. And all of them kinda tacked on a sentence or two of, 'oh yeah, the Wizards made the playoffs and might actually put a run together' at the end of all the feature length Caps coverage.

As a hockey fan, that was nice to see. Football and baseball are definitely still bigger deals, but there's no question that the Caps are #3 and the Wizards #4 these days. Sustained winning and a marketable superstar will do that to a franchise.

 

[tarheelhockey]

That's hilarious. Here's the writer trying to defend himself: http://t.co/pd70NzKIAf

I actually kind of feel for the writer, as it sounds like someone else wrote the headline and he isn't calling them out for it.

The most interesting part of that interview is the last 3 or 4 minutes when they get into the breakdown of revenue between ticket sales and television. That's not easily accessible information AFAIK.

 

[Anton Babchuk]

i'm buying the team

with all my money

30 million

 

[Joe McGrath]

I actually kind of feel for the writer, as it sounds like someone else wrote the headline and he isn't calling them out for it.

The most interesting part of that interview is the last 3 or 4 minutes when they get into the breakdown of revenue between ticket sales and television. That's not easily accessible information AFAIK.

Yeah writers take the hit for headlines they never write. Kinda sucks.

 

[VAcaniac]

Yeah, the Caps are a big deal here these days. I liked how last year, after the Caps failed to make the playoffs, the media was blowing up about it for weeks. And all of them kinda tacked on a sentence or two of, 'oh yeah, the Wizards made the playoffs and might actually put a run together' at the end of all the feature length Caps coverage.

As a hockey fan, that was nice to see. Football and baseball are definitely still bigger deals, but there's no question that the Caps are #3 and the Wizards #4 these days. Sustained winning and a marketable superstar will do that to a franchise.

Are you sure about that? I remember in the spring every station was like "keep it tuned here for the latest on our wizards." No one had even known they existed days earlier...

I remember in 2005 when the only game the Caps sold out was against the Hurricanes, even with Ovechkin on the team.

 

[DaleCooper]

I actually kind of feel for the writer, as it sounds like someone else wrote the headline and he isn't calling them out for it.

The most interesting part of that interview is the last 3 or 4 minutes when they get into the breakdown of revenue between ticket sales and television. That's not easily accessible information AFAIK.

He didn't write the headline, but it was more or less taken from the last sentence in the article which he did write.

On Thursday, Waddell addressed some of those rumors and repeated that the team would remain in Raleigh and under Karmanos' ownership at least for now.

 

[Sens1Canes2]

Well, the "for now" certainly applies to Karmanos' ownership of the team, as he's made no secret of his desire to sell off at least part of his stake.