GDT: UFC 261: Usman vs. Masvidal 2

[Perennial]

Ok but again where do you subjectively draw the line on whats a PED? Because people are taking stuff that improve their performance, both legally and illegally (if fighters making themselves more dangerous is something that actually concerns you)

and you didn’t refute anything I said months ago and you haven’t done it here either. Propose what you would do better to ensure that there is a true level playing field, otherwise this is just virtue signaling to me. Because anti-doping is a nice idea in theory and something everybody should want, it just doesn’t work and doesn’t do what you think it does. At least the way it’s practiced now. It’s almost like the idea of a utopia


you ESPECIALLY can’t fire somebody because they’re jacked with no failed tests- that’s just the dumbest, most authoritarian anti-fighter bullshit I’ve ever heard. That’s giving the death penalty on purely circumstantial evidence

So, if someone is obviously using PEDs to gain an advantage but hasn't been caught, the UFC should be fine risking the health of another fighter by matching them up with the cheater?

The sole reason to ban fighters from juicing is to protect their opponent...


With that said, I don't want to have this conversation with you anymore...

 

[16Skippy]

So, on the one hand you say I have no proof, and then on the other hand you say I'm basing it on her appearance...

Well, her appearance is the proof!

Come on man lol you're definitely reaching. You're comparing a photo where she's smiling, has make up, and the pic is probably airbrushed to a less flattering one where she's scowling. That's your proof she's on PEDs?

 

[Perennial]

Come on man lol you're definitely reaching. You're comparing a photo where she's smiling, has make up, and the pic is probably airbrushed to a less flattering one where she's scowling. That's your proof she's on PEDs?

 

[Perennial]

 

[CDJ]

So, if someone is obviously using PEDs to gain an advantage but hasn't been caught, the UFC should be fine risking the health of another fighter by matching them up with the cheater?

The sole reason to ban fighters from juicing is to protect their opponent...


With that said, I don't want to have this conversation with you anymore...

That’s because you’re making the dumbest argument of all time and know it’s a reach. No offense. I’m honestly just stunned by the stupidity of the argument. You’re literally looking at a photo and think that’s grounds for termination.

you don’t have anything to add to this conversation aside from “steroids bad“ so it’s not anybody’s loss that you don’t wish to continue it. There’s no real valuable thought put into it and yes it is incredibly strange to die on this hill with Jessica Andrade because of an airbrushed photo lol

 

[chicagoskycam]

Not to mention the UFC doesn’t have a leg to stand on if they disciplined her with no proof. They have a testing policy, blame that but I have news for you if you think she’s the only one. I think most of the athletes are probably bending and breaking the rules and we have this discussion before, the fighters that are more well off have the means to do it and get away with it.

If I had to bet Cyborg is definitely doping as well. There are negative consequences to PED’s like T as well, mostly with cardio and injuries.

 

[CDJ]

No to mention fighters are gonna look better when they hit a point in their career where they can train full time and secure premium supplement sponsorships. Like I looked it up and she worked at a pharmacy and was a truck driver. She wasn’t a full time fighter her whole life. So naturally when you can dedicate more time and money to fighting/training you’re going to improve your physique


And I’m not saying one way or the other that shes using for the record- it wouldn’t shock me if she does. It’s just a weird person to single out and call for their termination. And you absolutely cannot fire people based on photo comparisons, that’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard

 

[pistolpete11]

It doesn't seem very "nice" to masculinize yourself with PEDs in order to beat up women...

Well, it's not "nice" to punch people in the face at all, but this is a sport and there are rules. There is no evidence she is cheating (sorry posting pictures 10 years apart isn't evidence). They have an entire agency that tracks fighters all around the world and does random drug tests and they haven't caught her doing anything wrong in the 6 years they have been involved with the UFC. If they can't catch her then I'm not going to get worked up over it.

It seems you have your mind made up, though, and that's fine. I don't really care, but you're not going to change anybody else's mind without any real evidence either. So maybe we can drop the whole PED thing for...I don't know....ever, and get back to discussing the fights?

 

[pistolpete11]

I'm much more excited for the women's fights than the main event. It's great that Masvidal has a full camp and time to prepare but I don't see it going any differently. If anything, I think Usman has gotten even better since the first fight with more time spent with Wittman and that camp.

Weili vs. Rose is my favourite fight on this card. Two good strikers who will likely go forward and push the pace. I think Weili wins and might even get a stoppage because of her power but it could be a close one too.

Valentina vs. Andrade could be Valentina's first competitive fight in some time but I still don't like Andrade's chances as much as some others do. I don't think Andrade can bully and overpower Valentina and I believe she'll get picked apart at range.

Agree with @m9 about how long this card could end up being. The main card can easily be at least four decisions, including all three title fights.

My only sliver of hope with Usman-Masvidal is that Masvidal knows he's going to have to pull something out of his ass and as evidenced by the flying knee vs. Askren or the shuffle step against Till, he's capable of finding unique strikes that do severe damage. Usman does seem to have quite the chin, but he was staggered against Burns and Burns let him off the hook by backing off when he had him hurt. I don't think Masvidal would do that if he can land that shot.

But we're in "puncher's chance" territory here which usually doesn't go well.

Also, it would be exciting going in the wrong direction for me, but if Usman poured it on Masvidal to make a point and finished him, that would be pretty huge. He's a massive favorite so the win wouldn't be that big of a deal, but Masvidal has never been stopped in the UFC/Strikeforce.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Well, it's not "nice" to punch people in the face at all, but this is a sport and there are rules. There is no evidence she is cheating (sorry posting pictures 10 years apart isn't evidence). They have an entire agency that tracks fighters all around the world and does random drug tests and they haven't caught her doing anything wrong in the 6 years they have been involved with the UFC. If they can't catch her then I'm not going to get worked up over it.

It seems you have your mind made up, though, and that's fine. I don't really care, but you're not going to change anybody else's mind without any real evidence either. So maybe we can drop the whole PED thing for...I don't know....ever, and get back to discussing the fights?

Those pictures were 10 years apart, what a fricken joke. I thought they were more recent, anyone that trains and eats right for a period of time can make significant changes to their body in 6 months to a year, women as well. The more you work for the muscle group, the more it will grow. She's been at it for a while so I'm not surprised.

I see a lot of women with significant back and shoulder muscles at my gym every day, I guess they are all on roids too.

 

[m9]

My only sliver of hope with Usman-Masvidal is that Masvidal knows he's going to have to pull something out of his ass and as evidenced by the flying knee vs. Askren or the shuffle step against Till, he's capable of finding unique strikes that do severe damage. Usman does seem to have quite the chin, but he was staggered against Burns and Burns let him off the hook by backing off when he had him hurt. I don't think Masvidal would do that if he can land that shot.

But we're in "puncher's chance" territory here which usually doesn't go well.

Also, it would be exciting going in the wrong direction for me, but if Usman poured it on Masvidal to make a point and finished him, that would be pretty huge. He's a massive favorite so the win wouldn't be that big of a deal, but Masvidal has never been stopped in the UFC/Strikeforce.

What's more likely? Usman finish or Masvidal win?

I think I'd say Usman with a finish, some sort of ground and pound TKO could happen.

 

[pistolpete11]

Those pictures were 10 years apart, what a fricken joke. I thought they were more recent, anyone that trains and eats right for a period of time can make significant changes to their body in 6 months to a year, women as well. The more you work for the muscle group, the more it will grow. She's been at it for a while so I'm not surprised.

I see a lot of women with significant back and shoulder muscles at my gym every day, I guess they are all on roids too.

Don't quote me on that

I just assumed it was from when she first got into the UFC vs. today and I estimated she's been in the UFC for 10-ish years.

 

[pistolpete11]

What's more likely? Usman finish or Masvidal win?

I think I'd say Usman with a finish, some sort of ground and pound TKO could happen.

Unfortunately, I agree, but if I had to bet, I'd say it goes the distance.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Sporting the new venom garb,

That's an action figure right there. Valentina would be the perfect Bond villain post UFC career.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

So, you're saying that cheating is okay so long as they don't get caught?

That's just irresponsible in combat sports when the health and well-being of others is at stake...

Is this your proof that shes using PEDs?

Laughable.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

So, on the one hand you say I have no proof, and then on the other hand you say I'm basing it on her appearance...

Well, her appearance is the proof!

I'm guessing you don't understand how genetics work.

 

[Perennial]

I'm guessing you don't understand how genetics work.

I'm guessing you don't understand how steroids work...

 

[Tobias Kahun]

I'm guessing you don't understand how steroids work...

I do.

And I know that video that you think helps prove your case, doesnt.

Some people have really good genetics for building muscle, nothing about her appearance say's shes using steroids to me.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Those pictures were 10 years apart, what a fricken joke. I thought they were more recent, anyone that trains and eats right for a period of time can make significant changes to their body in 6 months to a year, women as well. The more you work for the muscle group, the more it will grow. She's been at it for a while so I'm not surprised.

I see a lot of women with significant back and shoulder muscles at my gym every day, I guess they are all on roids too.

I'm guessing when he walks into the gym, everyone that's bigger than him must be on gear.

 

[CDJ]

Everybody made weight in under an hour

We cookin

 

[chicagoskycam]

Everybody made weight in under an hour

We cookin

I'm really pumped for this card.

 

[pistolpete11]

If you didn't watch the pre-fight presser, don't bother. Other than giving the governor of Florida and the mayor of Jacksonville an opportunity to boast about how they ignored COVID, the only surprising part was that Masvidal is starting his own bareknuckle boxing promotion. What could go wrong?

 

[Vincent Vega]

If you didn't watch the pre-fight presser, don't bother. Other than giving the governor of Florida and the mayor of Jacksonville an opportunity to boast about how they ignored COVID, the only surprising part was that Masvidal is starting his own bareknuckle boxing promotion. What could go wrong?

Did Masvidal say anything about violence?

 

[MD thaivuN]

I doubt Usman finishes Masvidal. The dude is elite at surviving danger. It's gonna be another Usman decision win.

 

[Sheppy]

Usman will stop Masvidal.