Tyler Bozak - Positive or Negative impact on the team?

[bunjay]

Waiting, for a response like that. bunjay took the bait.

If the pass got through, it was going to be an easy tap in for JvR. Take it easy on the hate. Just because it wasn't the most prettiest of goals, doesn't take away that he contributed.

He was trying to pass it directly THROUGH the defenseman. Which can work for you if you've got incredible skill like, say, Kessel. He threads that needle all the time. Bozak does not, because he lacks that skill.

On the JvR and Kessel goals (both off the rush). Bozak was below our redline or in front of our goal when the puck was transitioned up ice. This will happen a lot.

Right, and people will always talk abut how solid he is defensively. Is he really though? Do we really think that average defensive effort is some sort of rarity in NHL players without much offensive game?

Again, I note. 13 points in 5 games. Why fix what ain't broken?

Why fix what ain't broken? Why bother trying to improve anything? Why don't we still ride horses and read by whale-oil lamps? They worked just fine.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Prove it.

For people who like to make broad, generalizing statements without doing any research, it must suck to live in 2013.

Here's a novel idea, prove what I said is wrong. Since you are the one carrying on about Bozak this, Bozak that, Bozak everything in on this board.

 

[The Blue Devil]

One of the arguments from you regarding Bozak being a number one, is his lack of size as a prototypical # 1 C and how he does not have the ability to use it and provide more play on the boards and cycling. More of a puck possesion game. As far as Kadri possibly being an upgrade, Kadri himself hasnt proved to be a conistent top 6 center, and although time will likely allow that to happen, why put him as the number 1 when he has to be more consistent as a number 2? Posters here are quick to find any reason to get Bozak out of that hole. And until a significant ugrade presents itself, despite what posters say and wish, things are working on the first line with him there, but still want to change that because they dont like him. Amazing how some would prefer to put their biases and dislikes forward ahead of the team success.

How would that make any sense if I've advocated for Both Kadri and Grabo to be tried in that spot? But please do go on and also provide these said posts of mine.

I've also never said any of the 2nd bolded either, that's just you trying way to hard.

 

[The Blue Devil]

So just cuz you, supposedly, haven't seen the posts they don't exist? Thats mighty presumptuous of you. And I've already said I'm not going to dig up old posts that we both know exist.

Kind of hard to call you credible just by your word, especially if you're not willing to back it up with any proof.

 

[Babscocks]

Kessel can still manage to be a PPG with Bozak as his center and they're best buds so I chose positive for that alone.

Realistically Kessels going to get his 30-40 goals and 40-50 assists and hover right around 80 points. Does anyone really think with a highly skilled offensive center Kessel's production would improve that much? Maybe he would score a handful more goals but his point total wouldn't be increasing to 100 points, which rarely occurs nowadays to begin with.

 

[Ricky Bobby]

Bozak is playing as much as he has because Bolland needs to have his minutes kept in check to be effective because he plays a rougher more tiring style of game and because Kadri has been making too many errors on the defensive side of the game/high risk moves in the neutral zone and offensive that lead to bad turnovers so Bozak has been filling some of the time that Kadri would normally play.

Toronto lacks quality options at center which is why the Gardiner for a center rumor makes sense. Having an extra center on the roster is a very good quality problem to have (look at San Jose, LA, Philly for years, Boston, etc.) because it allows a coach to ride the hot hand/forces competition as well as helps when injuries occur like when Bozak went down in the playoffs last year.

It's still early in the season and we haven't had a busy schedule. Once we start to get into a busier part of the schedule Bozak will see his minutes kept more in check.

 

[Pi]

Some of you people are silly.

3 points in 5 games, one very important SH goal and he's got two wingers that are in the top 10 for shots.

Clearly he's doing what he's asked to do: pass the puck to the better players.

Bozak @ 4.2M is a bargain and he's easily a positive player for the Leafs. It frustrates me to no end that Kadri isn't on the 1st PP above him but that is something entirely different...can't blame Bozak if the coach wants him out there on the first PP (which by the way is top 10 in the league right now).

We have good PP, PK and ES right now and people are finding ways to blame Bozak? For what? Not scoring in the Avs game? He had one great chance and he didn't bury it...it happens.

 

[The Blue Devil]

Some of you people are silly.

3 points in 5 games, one very important SH goal and he's got two wingers that are in the top 10 for shots.

Clearly he's doing what he's asked to do: pass the puck to the better players.

Bozak @ 4.2M is a bargain and he's easily a positive player for the Leafs. It frustrates me to no end that Kadri isn't on the 1st PP above him but that is something entirely different...can't blame Bozak if the coach wants him out there on the first PP (which by the way is top 10 in the league right now).

We have good PP, PK and ES right now and people are finding ways to blame Bozak? For what? Not scoring in the Avs game? He had one great chance and he didn't bury it...it happens.

Should also note that there were about 3 goals scored(maybe more) when he wasn't even on the ice.

 

[Pi]

Should also note that there were about 3 goals scored(maybe more) when he wasn't even on the ice.

I don't like him on the first PP either but Bozak isn't going to deny the opportunity to be on the first PP if the coach gives him the ice time..

Kadri with Kessel + Lupul/Jvr Phaneuf and Franson would make our PP top 5 in the league.

I can't wait for that PP unit.

 

[Preisst*]

Kind of hard to call you credible just by your word, especially if you're not willing to back it up with any proof.

I don't have to prove my credibility to you. To be clear what I said earlier is that there is a contingent of fans who are against Bozak for the simple reason that he is not a Big Name High Draft Pick who was hyped up pre-NHL. If you don't think such a contingent exists then good for you. I suspect that any person with a modicum of common sense would not argue this reality though. This is why I suspect you have misinterpreted what I said, as really it is not really arguable.

btw - this contingent is not 100% of the anti-Bozak fans. There are anti-Bozaks who have other reasons for female dogging about him.

 

[The Blue Devil]

I don't like him on the first PP either but Bozak isn't going to deny the opportunity to be on the first PP if the coach gives him the ice time..

Kadri with Kessel + Lupul/Jvr Phaneuf and Franson would make our PP top 5 in the league.

I can't wait for that PP unit.

It would be nice if Carlyle would give him the chance. I get the tough love approach, but sometimes a player just needs the right opportunity to prove himself, not to mention being on the 1st PP unit would probably give Kadri a pretty big confidence boost.

 

[Preisst*]

It would be nice if Carlyle would give him the chance. I get the tough love approach, but sometimes a player just needs the right opportunity to prove himself, not to mention being on the 1st PP unit would probably give Kadri a pretty big confidence boost.

I couldn't agree more.

 

[n1ck13]

I voted none/neutral. I believe that Bozak is a 2/3 C in the NHL, however, he is the least of the Leafs problems right now. Scotty Bowman always said he built his lines around pairs, then tried to find a third wheel that didn't mess up the other two. I think that is a little like what Carlyle is doing. The players that drive the top line are JVR and Kessel, not Bozak, but he doesn't mess it up either. It just seems weird because normally its not two wings that drive a line, but rather a center and a wing. However, quite a few center like/need to have the puck on their stick, Bozak doesn't. Kessel is the guy on the top unit who has the puck on his stick.

Another note, and this is pure opinion. I believe a lot of people blame Bozak for almost everything because of the Grabovski situation. They believed Bozak was taking away minutes that Grabbo could have played with Kessel. They believe that Grabbo would still be on this team if it wasn't for Bozak. First of all, Grabbo, never really played with Kessel during Carlyle or Wilson's tenure. Second of all, I think that Grabbo didn't fit Carlyle's style. He would have been bought out whether or not Bozak was re signed. The two events are totally unrelated.

 

[L Corncrick]

He's a good guy, very unselfish, hard worker. Some critics just want him to be a different person which is an unreasonable demand. I don't see any problems with the things that he can personally influence.

 

[ECanuck]

Where ever Bozak goes positive things happen. Take last game for example:

Bozak lost the draw clean. JVR goes and picks it up in the corner and we score.

Wipes out with the puck in the neutral zone. You'd think oh no! trouble for us! But no, we go up on a 3 on 1 break.

Then we get a 2 on 1 break on the same shift.

How can you say negative things. Only positives follow Bozak.

 

[ECanuck]

He's a good guy, very unselfish, hard worker. Some critics just want him to be a different person which is an unreasonable demand. I don't see any problems with the things that he can personally influence.

He might not score well but one thing he is awesome at is PK.

So, he is awesome at something.

He is a threat on the PK.

Good on Bozie.

 

[The Apologist]

It would be nice if Carlyle would give him the chance. I get the tough love approach, but sometimes a player just needs the right opportunity to prove himself, not to mention being on the 1st PP unit would probably give Kadri a pretty big confidence boost.

If Kadri could win a faceoff, he might just be there, by he's not very good at that area.

 

[Ratboy]

Positive... positive you guys are nuts. He's a decent enough player. Not an ideal #1, obviously, but not detrimental to the team. To think so is asinine.

 

[ECanuck]

Positive... positive you guys are nuts. He's a decent enough player. Not an ideal #1, obviously, but not detrimental to the team. To think so is asinine.

We know he isn't a number one center. He is smart and responsible enough to fill the position for now.

He has been exceptional on the PK. Has scored some big goals shorthanded.

Obviously, all our players have their flaws. As a team they do well though.

 

[Ratboy]

We know he isn't a number one center. He is smart and responsible enough to fill the position for now.

He has been exceptional on the PK. Has scored some big goals shorthanded.

Obviously, all our players have their flaws. As a team they do well though.

exarctly.

 

[4evaBlue]

Where ever Bozak goes positive things happen. Take last game for example:

Bozak lost the draw clean. JVR goes and picks it up in the corner and we score.

Wipes out with the puck in the neutral zone. You'd think oh no! trouble for us! But no, we go up on a 3 on 1 break.

Then we get a 2 on 1 break on the same shift.

How can you say negative things. Only positives follow Bozak.

I love what Bozak brings to the table as much as the next reasonable person, but that play was all JVR. That is also the type of play we'll need to see from Clarkson and Lupul to help recover some lost draws. A few winger wins can go a long ways in the line earning Randy's confidence. Faceoff is mostly a test of determination and that responsibility should not stop with the center.

 

[tooncesmeow]

Kessel can still manage to be a PPG with Bozak as his center and they're best buds so I chose positive for that alone.

Realistically Kessels going to get his 30-40 goals and 40-50 assists and hover right around 80 points. Does anyone really think with a highly skilled offensive center Kessel's production would improve that much? Maybe he would score a handful more goals but his point total wouldn't be increasing to 100 points, which rarely occurs nowadays to begin with.

Henrik Sedin/Marc Savard/any playmaking center would easily boost Kessel's game. It's not even so much that he would notch more goals, but he'd probably be picking up more points in general and his goal total would remain high for the remainder of his career. Look at Nash, Gaborik, Kovalchuk when they were had no good centers to work off of, they were still great offensive players, but they didn't last long, by their late 20s they'd fall off. Kovalchuk persisted but he's on another level, but when he went to New Jersey he became a more dangerous player. A 1C helps pull people away from Kessel. The issue with Bozak is that his cost and what he provides don't match up. Kessel isn't going anywhere anymore, the best bud excuse shouldn't be used, it should be about what you bring to the team. Bozak is average everything. He's good on the 3rd line, or a 2/3 tweener, but there's better 3rd line centers out there (and they're hitting free agency in 2014). He's already 27, what you get is what you get, being content with Bozak isn't good enough when you realize that having Bozak won't get you a cup. It's not like Boston's situation where they have Krejci and Bergeron (both much better then Bozak and bring two dynamically different skillsets) he's just an average NHL player that doesn't really do much of anything.

 

[happyaccident]

Where ever Bozak goes positive things happen. Take last game for example:

Bozak lost the draw clean. JVR goes and picks it up in the corner and we score.

Wipes out with the puck in the neutral zone. You'd think oh no! trouble for us! But no, we go up on a 3 on 1 break.

Then we get a 2 on 1 break on the same shift.

How can you say negative things. Only positives follow Bozak.

Positives do follow Bozak and you've helped me figure it out. As you say, JVR jumped right on top of his lost faceoff, Rielly sped back when he coughed up the 2on1 and created a chance the other way, when Forsberg beat Mr. Defensive Prowess cleanly and took it to the net, Dion broke up the play and Gunnar sent it the other way.
Our players are so used to his ineptness that they are able to jump on his mistakes cleanly and actually make plays out of it. The opponents, erroneously believing he may actually make a play with the puck, are left a step behind. This is what they mean by fitting in to the system. By George, I've got it.

 

[Disgruntled Observer*]

If you can't crack 50 points playing on the 1st line with Kessel and 1st PP unit, then you probably couldn't crack 30 points on the 2nd line, and probably couldn't crack 1 point on the 3rd line.

He's not quite good enough for the nhl.

I think he's a negative impact on the team solely because our GM's seem to think a 'not quite good enough' nhl player is fine as our #1 and haven't actively been looking for a legitimate #1 center for the past 3 years.

 

[hockeyfanz*]

Henrik Sedin/Marc Savard/any playmaking center would easily boost Kessel's game. It's not even so much that he would notch more goals, but he'd probably be picking up more points in general and his goal total would remain high for the remainder of his career. Look at Nash, Gaborik, Kovalchuk when they were had no good centers to work off of, they were still great offensive players, but they didn't last long, by their late 20s they'd fall off. Kovalchuk persisted but he's on another level, but when he went to New Jersey he became a more dangerous player. A 1C helps pull people away from Kessel. The issue with Bozak is that his cost and what he provides don't match up. Kessel isn't going anywhere anymore, the best bud excuse shouldn't be used, it should be about what you bring to the team. Bozak is average everything. He's good on the 3rd line, or a 2/3 tweener, but there's better 3rd line centers out there (and they're hitting free agency in 2014). He's already 27, what you get is what you get, being content with Bozak isn't good enough when you realize that having Bozak won't get you a cup. It's not like Boston's situation where they have Krejci and Bergeron (both much better then Bozak and bring two dynamically different skillsets) he's just an average NHL player that doesn't really do much of anything.

How true. The belief that Bozie has some kind of special magic with one of the best wingers in hockey is laughable. Like saying Dave Semenko had some special magic with Gretzky. The Leafs already have better centers than Bozie on the 2nd 3rd and 4th lines..in McClement Bolland and Kadri..If Nonis lands that elusive #1 C....Bozak is extremely expendable. He is average at everything he does and is above average at faceoffs. He certainly doesnt make Kessel better or JVR or Lupul or anybody he plays with. He is nothing more than a guy who has made a career of riding on the coat tails of one of the best wingers in hockey. This is not a country club. This is not beer league hockey where one gets to play with their buddies. Time to get serious and take this team closer to the Stanley Cup and get Toronto a bona fide #1C and cut the love affair with college boy.