Turris

[jason9090spezza]

Are people still "salty" about Spezza leaving...lol

The whole Turris thing was going to be inevitable (and was kind of obvious as well). He will be faced with much harder opponents.

And no, he will not be a better #1 center than Spezza
It's even questionable whether he will ever become a full-fledged #1 center like Spezza. I'd be surprised if he ever gets a point-per-game season.

I say if he can become a guy like Kesler, or a downgrade Bergeron, its a success. He's more fitting in that #2 role behind someone that can score (which the Senators doesn't have as of now).

 

[Othello*]

Are people still "salty" about Spezza leaving...lol

The whole Turris thing was going to be inevitable (and was kind of obvious as well). He will be faced with much harder opponents.

And no, he will not be a better #1 center than Spezza
It's even questionable whether he will ever become a full-fledged #1 center like Spezza. I'd be surprised if he ever gets a point-per-game season.

I say if he can become a guy like Kesler, or a downgrade Bergeron, its a success. He's more fitting in that #2 role behind someone that can score (which the Senators doesn't have as of now).

It doesn't matter if he's better then Spezza. Spezza was a cancer to this team

 

[Burrowsaurus]

I think for Sens to win a cup 3 things need to happen.

1) We need to make 1 more Bobby Ryan trade. 3 for 1 trade.

2) Zibanejad/Lazar to play 50-60 point excellent all-around games

3) Anderson/Lehner to play like a top 5-10 goalie in a playoff run.

All 3 are very possible. The only other thing is Cowen-Ceci need to be legit 2nd pair but I think they're already that now but can be even more which is just an added bonus.

I think karlsson being reliable defensively is more important that all those things. Our guy playing 30 minutes needs to stop opposing teams from scoring.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

I think karlsson being reliable defensively is more important that all those things. Our guy playing 30 minutes needs to stop opposing teams from scoring.

Have you watched the last 3 games or.... odd time to bring up this point.

Karlsson has been stellar defensively in last 3 games. Proof is in the fact that the Karlsson thread hasn't been active in a while.

Karlsson can be good defensively but those 3 I mentioned are bigger more questionable concerns.

 

[BigBush*]

I think karlsson being reliable defensively is more important that all those things. Our guy playing 30 minutes needs to stop opposing teams from scoring.

So keep doing what he's doing? Pretty tough spot for Karlsson. Shut down the other team and get flamed for not generating enough offence and not bein "explosive" enough, or generating a ton of offence and not playing a good enough defensive game.
He's the last thing this team has to worry about

 

[Burrowsaurus]

So keep doing what he's doing? Pretty tough spot for Karlsson. Shut down the other team and get flamed for not generating enough offence and not bein "explosive" enough, or generating a ton of offence and not playing a good enough defensive game.
He's the last thing this team has to worry about

A teams franchise star player is always someone to worry about. When they stop going. The team stops going.

"Keep doing what he's doing" oh man. I thought he's been definitely decent the past few games. But not enough to sing his praises. Still needs to be better. All other star players are held in high regard and a high standard. Why should it be any different for karlsson. A lot of you refuse to criticize him like all other stars get criticized. Yet you all want to group him with all the other stars when praising him.

 

[Minister of Offence]

Are people still "salty" about Spezza leaving...lol

The whole Turris thing was going to be inevitable (and was kind of obvious as well). He will be faced with much harder opponents.

And no, he will not be a better #1 center than Spezza
It's even questionable whether he will ever become a full-fledged #1 center like Spezza. I'd be surprised if he ever gets a point-per-game season.

I say if he can become a guy like Kesler, or a downgrade Bergeron, its a success. He's more fitting in that #2 role behind someone that can score (which the Senators doesn't have as of now).

I'm thrilled we dealt spezza regardless of what happens this year. Had to happen, and if it meant a bigger return, perhaps it should have happened sooner.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Are people still "salty" about Spezza leaving...lol

The whole Turris thing was going to be inevitable (and was kind of obvious as well). He will be faced with much harder opponents.

And no, he will not be a better #1 center than Spezza
It's even questionable whether he will ever become a full-fledged #1 center like Spezza. I'd be surprised if he ever gets a point-per-game season.

I say if he can become a guy like Kesler, or a downgrade Bergeron, its a success. He's more fitting in that #2 role behind someone that can score (which the Senators doesn't have as of now).

Ottawa, 13th overall in the league, payroll $55.8 million
Dallas, 24th overall in the league, payroll $67.4 million

How's Dallas doing in the playoff race, btw?

Now shoo, little troll.

 

[Super Cake]

People really need to forget about Spezza. We were not going to win the cup with him. By the time we are ready to compete, Spezza would be too old to be useful.

 

[Baby Ryan]

Are people still "salty" about Spezza leaving...lol

The whole Turris thing was going to be inevitable (and was kind of obvious as well). He will be faced with much harder opponents.

And no, he will not be a better #1 center than Spezza
It's even questionable whether he will ever become a full-fledged #1 center like Spezza. I'd be surprised if he ever gets a point-per-game season.

I say if he can become a guy like Kesler, or a downgrade Bergeron, its a success. He's more fitting in that #2 role behind someone that can score (which the Senators doesn't have as of now).

Turris is playing fine...would be much better with Bobby on his right wing though. Not a knock on Chiasson at all, guy is amazing.

The other centers are not meeting expectations, that's the problem.
Turris is far from the problem in terms of the performances of the centers.

And as far as I'm concerned, there were multiple times last year where Spezza was pitted against opposing teams bottom 6's, leaving the opposing teams top 6's for the Turris line and unfortunately GSN.

 

[Benjamin]

Are people still "salty" about Spezza leaving...lol

The whole Turris thing was going to be inevitable (and was kind of obvious as well). He will be faced with much harder opponents.

And no, he will not be a better #1 center than Spezza
It's even questionable whether he will ever become a full-fledged #1 center like Spezza. I'd be surprised if he ever gets a point-per-game season.

I say if he can become a guy like Kesler, or a downgrade Bergeron, its a success. He's more fitting in that #2 role behind someone that can score (which the Senators doesn't have as of now).

But Turris has been getting top lines, top d pairs and shutdown players for 2 years in a row now. Spezza only had that for the end of last season, over the same time period. Nothing changes for Turris. The player getting affected is Zibanejad.

Plus Turris is playing great.

 

[Burner Account]

Dropped him.

 

[Ouroboros]

Thanks for the update, man.

 

[Ice-Tray]

But Turris has been getting top lines, top d pairs and shutdown players for 2 years in a row now. Spezza only had that for the end of last season, over the same time period. Nothing changes for Turris. The player getting affected is Zibanejad.

Plus Turris is playing great.

This is not entirely true.

Lets be honest, Spezza has played against the top defenders on every team for the better part of a decade and has put up elite numbers. It is what it is. I'm not arguing that the trade was a bad move, that he should still be here, or that we would be better if he was. What I am saying is that he has consistently dealt with a much higher consistent level of competition than Turris.

Last year, Turris saw a high level of defenders because the line as a whole had our best wingers, had chemistry, and was scoring more (they were all playing great!). Once Spezza was healthy, this changed.

Spezza, with poor wingers, especially before Hemsky, still saw his share of top defenders because he is a player that has to be keyed on no matter who he plays with. Like him or lump him, he was an offensive star for us.

I'd argue that EVERYTHING has changed for Turris this year. Team's don't have any other lines to key their best defenders against, and his line isn't in the same universe of skill as the Pizza line. This means that he so much less time and space, because this team really has one effective scoring line (the kid line has been a secret for us so far). This is why McL has split up the scoring, so that the opposition can't throw their best 5 man unit out and shut us down completely.

In a perfect would we'd have a #1 centre who would push everyone down into their proper roles, and the wingers could be effectively spread out for scoring. As it stands, we have to make two scoring line out of one talent wise (at this point) and hope the kid line continues to fly under the radar.

Player development is the most important thing right now, since it will bare out the effectiveness of our rebuild. It's time to sit back and watch the show!

Edit: I agree that Turris has been playing well, in fact I think most of the team has. The truth is, we're not that good right now, and are playing a little above where our current skill and experience should have us I think.

 

[Burner Account]

Thanks for the update, man.

What if I was a woman?

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Edit: I agree that Turris has been playing well, in fact I think most of the team has. The truth is, we're not that good right now, and are playing a little above where our current skill and experience should have us I think.

Yup. For most nights, 90% of the team actually plays well, it's just we lack experience and top end talent to squeeze out more victories than losses.

Methot + top 3ish winger(instead of Michalek) makes this team in the thick of division battle, imo. We're missing a top 2 defensive threat and a top 3 LW threat to make us capable of winning almost every night, imo.

 

[Micklebot]

This is not entirely true.

Lets be honest, Spezza has played against the top defenders on every team for the better part of a decade and has put up elite numbers. It is what it is. I'm not arguing that the trade was a bad move, that he should still be here, or that we would be better if he was. What I am saying is that he has consistently dealt with a much higher consistent level of competition than Turris.

Last year, Turris saw a high level of defenders because the line as a whole had our best wingers, had chemistry, and was scoring more (they were all playing great!). Once Spezza was healthy, this changed.

Spezza, with poor wingers, especially before Hemsky, still saw his share of top defenders because he is a player that has to be keyed on no matter who he plays with. Like him or lump him, he was an offensive star for us.

I'd argue that EVERYTHING has changed for Turris this year. Team's don't have any other lines to key their best defenders against, and his line isn't in the same universe of skill as the Pizza line. This means that he so much less time and space, because this team really has one effective scoring line (the kid line has been a secret for us so far). This is why McL has split up the scoring, so that the opposition can't throw their best 5 man unit out and shut us down completely.

In a perfect would we'd have a #1 centre who would push everyone down into their proper roles, and the wingers could be effectively spread out for scoring. As it stands, we have to make two scoring line out of one talent wise (at this point) and hope the kid line continues to fly under the radar.

Player development is the most important thing right now, since it will bare out the effectiveness of our rebuild. It's time to sit back and watch the show!

Edit: I agree that Turris has been playing well, in fact I think most of the team has. The truth is, we're not that good right now, and are playing a little above where our current skill and experience should have us I think.

We don't need a #1 center to push everyone down, Zibanejad playing to the way they thought he could would be enough. To me, anyways, the Mac-Tur-Ryan line would be fine if our second line was producing. They tried Ryan-Zibanejad-Chiasson, which if it worked would have been great, but 3 right handed shots didn't work. I wouldn't mind seeing Hoffman with Zibanejad and Chiasson, they've tried that for about 15 mins, but it could be worth another shot, though I'd hate to break up the kid line.

 

[Ice-Tray]

We don't need a #1 center to push everyone down, Zibanejad playing to the way they thought he could would be enough. To me, anyways, the Mac-Tur-Ryan line would be fine if our second line was producing. They tried Ryan-Zibanejad-Chiasson, which if it worked would have been great, but 3 right handed shots didn't work. I wouldn't mind seeing Hoffman with Zibanejad and Chiasson, they've tried that for about 15 mins, but it could be worth another shot, though I'd hate to break up the kid line.

I didn't mean it as a slight to Turris, I love the way he plays. If we were able to push him down to the second line due a #1 centre, we'd be a much better team, not because Turris is bad, but because we would have added a #1 line centre.

Zib has to play somewhere, as do the rest of the kids, but he is not ready to be an actual 2nd line centre. The guys who are doing the heavy lifting will have to continue to do so. Our rookies NEED to be sheltered and inched along for their long term development. This means that Zib will have to centre a line that should be a third line, but due to our place in the development cycle, is playing as a second line.

We have 3 established top 6 guys right now, so this is what should be expected. If Zib can work on his intensity, conditioning, defensive play, and pick up a permanent position on the PP it will be a solid year of development. We should not be looking for him to put up points while drawing second line defenders despite being a thrid line.

The other problem is the mac-turris-ryan line has all of our top six scorers on it, which makes us even easier to shut down as a team. McL HAS to try and split them up in order to get some favourable match ups on the ice during the game. The flip side is that we severly diminish the abilities of the top line by splitting them up, but with doing so leaves us with a second line that isn't a threat.

 

[Derivation]

Is Turris suffering due to the absence of Spezza and the increased pressure of top dog, or is he snake bit and playing poorly?

 

[Sun God Nika]

Is Turris suffering due to the absence of Spezza and the increased pressure of top dog, or is he snake bit and playing poorly?

Mix of both Turris has always been streaky, and the only time I remember him producing consistently without Spez in the line up was the 2013 playoffs, He will get back to his level of play but I won't expect him to play like he did last season untill Zibby ascends him/we get a number 1C

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

Is Turris suffering due to the absence of Spezza and the increased pressure of top dog, or is he snake bit and playing poorly?

Both I'd say.

 

[HavlatMach9]

turris is a strong #2 center, and his line doesn't have 1st line wingers to overcome other team's top d pairings

i could never find it in me to criticize Turris with the role he's been given and the $ he gets

 

[dingbatz]

Is Turris suffering due to the absence of Spezza and the increased pressure of top dog, or is he snake bit and playing poorly?

I think it's a bit of both. Check out this article, it somewhat dispels the myth that Spezza faced the tougher competition last year: http://www.tsn.ca/yost-the-challenge-of-replacing-jason-spezza-1.95227

I'm hoping that with some better puck-luck, and with Zibanejad playing well on his new line, Turris will heat up.

 

[HSF]

turris isn't a number 1 center he just isnt good enough or strong enough to face top guys

 

[Karlsson2Turris*]

If Ryan was on his line he would have way more points.