Value of: Turris to the islanders

[ThirdManIn]

I thought that was the impression of turris, that it just wasn’t a good fit

Before the Turris trade the Predators were 8-5-2 and were basically even in terms of goal differential.

From November 11, his first game as a Predator, until the last game of the 2017 calendar year, they went 15-5-4 with a +21 goal differential.

He had a bad playoffs. It happens. He was great in the playoffs the year before. There's no reason to trade him nor is there reason to think he isn't a good fit.

 

[PWJunior]

Pretty sure the Isles are gonna surprise a lot of people who think they're rebuilding. They still have a solid core and Barzal is going to easily slot into Tavares' role.

While the door is open for everything to come together for a Cinderella run, the odds are probably on them being bad. If that does happen, the team is designed to sell big at the trade deadline.

With so much change on and off the ice this offseason, there are huge adjustments to be made. If they slip out of the gate and put themselves in a hole early, the talent isn't there to make up that ground. Losing your franchise player for nothing is a big blow. They need to add more high end talent and that will be via the draft.

A strong 2019 draft with multiple picks could set the Isles up for the long haul.

 

[Buf fan in Nash]

NAS would be loooking for an 1A/1B top 2 center rotation... what's do the NYI awnt for Barzal?

Come on... They just lost JT there is zero chance they are trading Barzal unless they get a huge overpayment. What do you realistically think the offer would be for Barzal? The guy just scored 85 points in 82 games on the second line in his rookie season.

 

[Patagonia]

Turris is not moving unless the Preds have a suitable replacement.

Duchene has long been rumoured to favour the team. So if there is any trade to be made it would likely depend on a replacement and the only players the Preds would have interest would be the Wingers.

 

[herzausstein]

Turris is not moving unless the Preds have a suitable replacement.

Duchene has long been rumoured to favour the team. So if there is any trade to be made it would likely depend on a replacement and the only players the Preds would have interest would be the Wingers.

Even then wouldn't it be better to trade off bonino for scraps and have a center group with Johansen, Duchene, turris instead

 

[Vipers31]

Pretty sure the Isles are gonna surprise a lot of people who think they're rebuilding. They still have a solid core and Barzal is going to easily slot into Tavares' role.

Who is going to slot into Barzal's role, though?

 

[Patagonia]

Even then wouldn't it be better to trade off bonino for scraps and have a center group with Johansen, Duchene, turris instead

Cap issues.

Duchene likely in the $8M range and Rinne not resigning. I think it'll be dependent on what the UFA demands by Duchene, but more than likely Turris will be moved for a better return than scraps.

 

[4thline]

Even before you factor in that it makes no sense for the Preds to trade him from a roster POV, there is no reason to trade him for less than they paid a year ago.

Beating a 2nd+Kamenev+Girard is going to take a decent bite out of any teams prospect pool.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

Had Tavares not waited til the last minute to let the Isles know he's leaving - or if the team hadn't decided to be dependent upon his statement as to whether he's staying or leaving - the NYI might have been able to go fishing for a guy like Stastny or Bozak. Theoretically speaking.

But as others here have said, it doesn't look like the Isles want a bonafide #2 center right now, even if a guy like Turris would be available.

The Isles are going in another direction and it's very possible that Lou had already started planning on life without Tavares fairly early after having taken over as the Isles' GM.

It seems to be a sound plan at the moment. If the team competes, he can shore up. If it doesn't, he can move pieces at the deadline. He has a group that's going to be tougher than the average customer and there's good reason to believe that the team will show more character than the past two seasons.

He's brought over Jan Kovar to create competition in camp while, in a best-case scenario, possibly having found a #2 center for the time being.

He's got a Brock Nelson here who is basically the same size and frame as Tavares, but has consistently underachieved while often looking disinterested. Does he bloom under Trotz?

Filppula and Cizikas are fine options for lower lines.

Naturally, there could be problems if several of these guys gets injured or disappoint terribly.

REBUILD:
When you've got Barzal, Lee, Bailey, Eberle, Leddy, and young contributors like Beauvillier, Pulock, and Pelech with a guy like Ho-Sang in the wings and Wahlstrom + Dobson likely ready for impact play in a year's time, you're not really in a rebuild.

Tavares' loss means shifting, no doubt. But it's a difference of culture we're seeing around the organization (would have taken place with Tavares here anyway) and if we're honest, the Isles spent a lot of time in run-of-the-mill no-man's land in recent seasons.

Of course, if a number of the guys who are being invested in fail, then the option is there to move some bodies, make a handful of picks next summer (including a center in the Top 10?), then go after a few big fish on the UFA market.

 

[seabass45]

The only time this deal could have been made would have been in a sign and trade for Tavares

I would have been totally into this.

 

[Stuzchuk]

Come on... They just lost JT there is zero chance they are trading Barzal unless they get a huge overpayment. What do you realistically think the offer would be for Barzal? The guy just scored 85 points in 82 games on the second line in his rookie season.

look at my comment 2 posts down

 

[pheasant]

I really don't like "value of" threads about players that have no reason to be traded.

It's pretty rare for a player who is a good fit with his team to be traded with no rhyme or reason and no hints from insiders beforehand. So why bother with a thread specifically for Turris?

 

[CodeE]

While the door is open for everything to come together for a Cinderella run, the odds are probably on them being bad. If that does happen, the team is designed to sell big at the trade deadline.

With so much change on and off the ice this offseason, there are huge adjustments to be made. If they slip out of the gate and put themselves in a hole early, the talent isn't there to make up that ground. Losing your franchise player for nothing is a big blow. They need to add more high end talent and that will be via the draft.

A strong 2019 draft with multiple picks could set the Isles up for the long haul.

A ding ding ding ding ding!

There's simply too much young talent to do a full rebuild. On the other hand - certain fans think of things in a black/white, buyer/seller, trade your vets for my garbage/trade for my vets and give me high end youth. In reality the Islanders are somewhere in the middle:

1. Buyers? Perhaps if the right offer comes along. If not, I'd prefer to buy on July 1st, 2019: hoping someone like Panarin slips through the cracks knowing we have the cap space to make a serious offer. But making serious offers for someone like Turris? Not worth it for us, not worth it for Nashville either.

2. Sellers? Depends where we are at the deadline, what contact we've had with UFAs. But as long as the days of Snow not trading Blake/Parenteau/Okposo/Tavares are over: if we're in a position to sell, Lou will sell.

 

[AveryStar4Eva]

It took Nashville forever to get two good centres I doubt they are going to trade one of them now. If they Islanders are in a playoff spot by the deadline then Duchene and Hayes are likely available.

 

[Soundgarden]

isles need a second line center and currently have no one with that type of potential in the prospect pool so what would it cost to get turris on the isles

You need to consider Nashville's wants and needs if you're going to be doing this.

The Islanders aren't contending and Nashville's window is wide open. Your question shouldn't be how can the Islanders get Turris, it should be why does Nashville suddenly get rid of their no.2 center after searching for years for competent center depth.

If Nashville traded Turris the only satisfying return would be a better center than him and the only the thing New York has that would qualify would be Barzal. Don't scoff though because your ask is equally absurd.

We don't want picks, wingers, defensemen, or goalies. no. 2 center or better.

 

[Riptide]

Pretty sure the Isles are gonna surprise a lot of people who think they're rebuilding. They still have a solid core and Barzal is going to easily slot into Tavares' role.

They play in one of the toughest divisions in the NHL. Last season they finished 3 pts ahead of NYR for 2nd last in the division. And other than NYR most of the rest of the teams have improved. So while they might not be the worst team in the division, it will probably be pretty close.

 

[seabass45]

You need to consider Nashville's wants and needs if you're going to be doing this.

A pretty big problem with this board in general tbh. Every time someone starts a thread on this board they should think about the other team's needs and motivations.

 

[LamorielloAndSon]

They play in one of the toughest divisions in the NHL. Last season they finished 3 pts ahead of NYR for 2nd last in the division. And other than NYR most of the rest of the teams have improved. So while they might not be the worst team in the division, it will probably be pretty close.

The metro isn’t good any more

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

They play in one of the toughest divisions in the NHL. Last season they finished 3 pts ahead of NYR for 2nd last in the division. And other than NYR most of the rest of the teams have improved. So while they might not be the worst team in the division, it will probably be pretty close.

You could be right, but I kind of disagree in general.

Philly still doesn't have goaltending.
NJD will be hard-pressed to top last season as much went well for them at once.
The Rangers are still the weakest group on paper and we have good reason to believe that management doesn't really "want" to contend at this juncture.
Everyone will be gunning for Washington, which also lost its championship head coach.
Pittsburgh remains a serious contender that needs to bounce back a bit after Washington finally beat them.
Carolina is eternal the team on the way up that nonetheless continues to have no viable goaltending.
Columbus is a very solid outfit, but enters the season with a Tavares-style UFA headache in Panarin, who may not be interested enough to succeed there.

In other words, there's enough friction in this group to allow for a tough and defensively-oriented Islander team that should still feature 6 45+ point scorers to land in the middle of things - and perhaps even slot in with the last playoff spot.

I do think that the work Mitch Korn and his guys do with Lehner and Greiss may ultimately be the biggest difference for this team.

Aside from that, I think Trotz will be throwing a group of guys onto the ice who take a great deal of pride in what they do and who they're playing with.

 

[tony d]

I like the fit of Turris on the Islanders but you got to wonder if the Islanders have anyone to send back to the Preds for Turris that would interest the Predators.

 

[seabass45]

I like the fit of Turris on the Islanders but you got to wonder if the Islanders have anyone to send back to the Preds for Turris that would interest the Predators.

We don't. HOWEVER... if Nashville is interested in one of Nelson, Lee, or Eberle at the deadline, we might be able to do business. But that's completely separate.

 

[LeapOnOver]

No they aren’t

If we aren't rebuilding then we straight up suck. At least rebuilding gives us an excuse. You really are a masochist!

 

[Roof Daddy]

Can't see a deal happening straight up, but maybe in a 3 way for Duchene at the deadline (assuming he's unwilling to extend with the Sens).

To NSH: Duchene (with ability to negotiate extension before deal), NYI 2nd

To NYI: Turris

To OTT: Beauvillier, NSH 1st

 

[Soundgarden]

Can't see a deal happening straight up, but maybe in a 3 way for Duchene at the deadline (assuming he's unwilling to extend with the Sens).

To NSH: Duchene (with ability to negotiate extension before deal), NYI 2nd

To NYI: Turris

To OTT: Beauvillier, NSH 1st

Aside from Tolvanen, Nashville's prospect pool is bad and upgrading Turris to Duchene is a luxury move.
Duchene is set to become a UFA after this year anyway, if we really wanted Duchene we'd probably wait to try and sign him first and then move Turris out after.

We already locked Turris up long term and Duchene will probably be making more than $6mil in free agency though. It all just seems unnecessary.

 

[Roof Daddy]

Aside from Tolvanen, Nashville's prospect pool is bad and upgrading Turris to Duchene is a luxury move.
Duchene is set to become a UFA after this year anyway, if we really wanted Duchene we'd probably wait to try and sign him first and then move Turris out after.

We already locked Turris up long term and Duchene will probably be making more than $6mil in free agency though. It all just seems unnecessary.

I agree with all your points, but are you really giving up much in this scenario? The NSH 1st should be 24-31, the NYI 2nd in the 37-44 range. You basically upgrade from Turris to Duchene by moving 10(ish) spots back and probably adding 1-1.5 mil in cap space (assuming Duchene is willing to sign, thought I heard he is a big country fan and likes Nashville).

At the end of the day, maybe it is better to keep Turris, but I’d have to think another playoff performance like last year and the story may change. I personally think Duchene can drive his own line a bit better.