Proposal: Trades

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

I’m not really interested in the team taking multi year cap dumps unless high end quality prospects are coming back. Flexibility is paramount with the landscape over the NHL the next couple years. We already have 16 draft picks in the first 2 rounds over the 4 year span of 2018-2021. Adding second round picks isn’t appealing at all for multi year cap dumps.

I wonder if there is any chance we could swing Veleno + for Cirelli

I'd maybe do Veleno+DETs 2nd for Cirelli say at 7 years $5.75 mil perhaps but not much more.

 

[Inspiration]

I'd maybe do Veleno+DETs 2nd for Cirelli say at 7 years $5.75 mil perhaps but not much more.

Cirelli is a Selke-caliber center in a league where young, top-6 centers are incredibly difficult to trade for - and the most you would be willing to give up is Veleno and a 2nd?

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Cirelli is a Selke-caliber center in a league where young, top-6 centers are incredibly difficult to trade for - and the most you would be willing to give up is Veleno and a 2nd?

Cirelli is the player that I hope Veleno can turn into in the NHL. If we can turn trading Veleno into Cirelli that's also a win.

Tampa is over a barrel and need to shed salary. That's a very generous offer all things considered.

Veleno is a guy that projects as a 2nd/3rd line center who is defensively responsible. 1st round, top 15 level talent in 2018 that fell to 30th. The 2nd would be either our 2nd (32 overall) or Edmonton's (42-48 overall).

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Cirelli is a Selke-caliber center in a league where young, top-6 centers are incredibly difficult to trade for - and the most you would be willing to give up is Veleno and a 2nd?

Yeah considering that Julien Brisebois is in no position to ask for the moon for him. Bare minimal offer sheet nabs him a 1st and 3rd round pick and i basically offered him a late 1st and 2nd round pick.

 

[Inspiration]

Brisebois is in a tough spot with Tyler Johnson, Yanni Gourde, and Alex Killorn. If he wants to trade Cirelli, he'll have ~30 teams interested. Multiple teams would easily beat a Veleno + 2nd offer.

Offer sheets only work if the player is willing to sign an offer sheet. And we have no evidence that Cirelli is willing to do that.

 

[BinCookin]

Here is an UPDATED VERSION of my Elaborate trade proposal:

Part 1: TB trades Y. Gourde + 2nd Round Pick to DET
Part 2: DET trades Y. Gourde to VGK for Fleury + 2nd Round Pick
Part 3: DET trades Fluery at 50% Retention to [Mystery Team 4] for a 2nd Round Pick.

Also here is why it works only as a 4 way deal.

VGK cant retain any money on Fluery, so they cant trade him with retention themselves. They Also need a 2nd line C. Gourde isn't elite, but hes way better than using 12M in Goalies.
TB wants to dump $$, also Gourde may waive to go to VGK.
[Mystery Team 4] will get Fleury on the cheap for 2 years.
DET gets 3 2nd round picks.

I lowered the Return for Detroit just to see where everyone stands, Obviously I would like to get as much as possible... which one of these teams should pay more or less??
Who would be the 4th Team? (Detroit could take a Goalie back for more Value etc etc)

That WAS for the Main board...

I would want a 1st from at least 1 of these teams myself.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Here is an UPDATED VERSION of my Elaborate trade proposal:

Part 1: TB trades Y. Gourde + 2nd Round Pick to DET
Part 2: DET trades Y. Gourde to VGK for Fleury + 2nd Round Pick
Part 3: DET trades Fluery at 50% Retention to [Mystery Team 4] for a 2nd Round Pick.

Also here is why it works only as a 4 way deal.

VGK cant retain any money on Fluery, so they cant trade him with retention themselves. They Also need a 2nd line C. Gourde isn't elite, but hes way better than using 12M in Goalies.
TB wants to dump $$, also Gourde may waive to go to VGK.
[Mystery Team 4] will get Fleury on the cheap for 2 years.
DET gets 3 2nd round picks.

I lowered the Return for Detroit just to see where everyone stands, Obviously I would like to get as much as possible... which one of these teams should pay more or less??
Who would be the 4th Team? (Detroit could take a Goalie back for more Value etc etc)

That WAS for the Main board...

I would want a 1st from at least 1 of these teams myself.

If all this worked out somehow & we ended up with (3) 2nds or (2) 2nds & a 1st, I'd wanna bundle them for an impact Top Pairing LD or Cirelli (or better) young 2-way 2C w/possible 1C upside..even if we have to add a Cholo+Hirose+b-level prospect Maestro? We'd still have enough picks + all the TDL deals should give us some 3rds/4ths/5ths & maybe a couple 2nds (LGD?, Ryan? Flip? Nemeth? DDK-like to get a late 1st for him/conversely our LD blueline looks rather thin going into 21-22). Nemeth, Flip & LGD likely hold the most value. Bernier is another possibility.

 

[Oddbob]

A 2nd round pick, maybe? That's a price I would happily pay.

Edi: I'm sure they're more interested in a Dman, but probably would still be interested in picks to help facilitate another trade.

Roslovic's value is not as high as a 2nd round pick. He is currently a 30 pt player, who is terrible in the faceoff dot.

 

[Henkka]

Think Vegas will go with strong 2 goalie combo, and will do other cap moves to solve the cap.

Could seem them trading for Bernier, if something.

Fleury + incentive <> Bernier.

Yanni Gourde has full NTC, don't see him going anywhere. It's that Killorn/Johnson/Cirelli/Sergachev/Cernak group who'll move. Guys who don't have full protection, or protection at all.

 

[ShippinItDaily]

Roslovic's value is not as high as a 2nd round pick. He is currently a 30 pt player, who is terrible in the faceoff dot.

I think his value is pretty close to that. His production is fine for his opportunity, he's got decent size and skating ability and he's a RH shot. He hasn't been good at faceoffs, but has only taken 402 in his career. His possession stats were also pretty good for the team he was on.

 

[Oddbob]

I think his value is pretty close to that. His production is fine for his opportunity, he's got decent size and skating ability and he's a RH shot. He hasn't been good at faceoffs, but has only taken 402 in his career. His possession stats were also pretty good for the team he was on.

It would be a waste of a 2nd for an ordinary level player at best.

 

[Claypool]

Offer sheets only work if the player is willing to sign an offer sheet. And we have no evidence that Cirelli is willing to do that.

Right, but he wants to sign an NHL contract at the end of the day. He'll be happy to negotiate a deal that he wants with another team then go back to Tampa to force their hand. Regardless of what happens he still gets his guaranteed money.

 

[ShippinItDaily]

It would be a waste of a 2nd for an ordinary level player at best.

It could be a steal. He is still young, getting better and hasn't got much opportunity yet on a team with a loaded top 6. I would easily pay a mid 2nd rounder for him. The only issue is that this team has so many forwards right now and would need to move somebody out after.

 

[Oddbob]

It could be a steal. He is still young, getting better and hasn't got much opportunity yet on a team with a loaded top 6. I would easily pay a mid 2nd rounder for him. The only issue is that this team has so many forwards right now and would need to move somebody out after.

How is he getting better? Two seasons ago he had 24 pts playing only 9+ minutes a game. This past season he had 29 pts while getting 14+ minutes a game.

 

[jkutswings]

How is he getting better? Two seasons ago he had 24 pts playing only 9+ minutes a game. This past season he had 29 pts while getting 14+ minutes a game.

What do you mean? It's a rock solid direct correlation of 1 additional point per minute of ice time. Clearly they just need to play him 60 minutes per game to watch his production go through the roof.

 

[Oddbob]

What do you mean? It's a rock solid direct correlation of 1 additional point per minute of ice time. Clearly they just need to play him 60 minutes per game to watch his production go through the roof.

Hey I like it, never thought of it that way. He would definitely get an increase in ice time on our team.

 

[ShippinItDaily]

How is he getting better? Two seasons ago he had 24 pts playing only 9+ minutes a game. This past season he had 29 pts while getting 14+ minutes a game.

Lol. At least use all the numbers. Two seasons ago he also played more games.

Better is also about more than just production. You were concerned about his faceoffs in an earlier post, those improved. His possession metrics have also improved. And doesn't it stand to reason that more ice time could very likely signal a sign of improvement as seen by his coaches?

 

[Oddbob]

Lol. At least use all the numbers. Two seasons ago he also played more games.

Better is also about more than just production. You were concerned about his faceoffs in an earlier post, those improved. His possession metrics have also improved. And doesn't it stand to reason that more ice time could very likely signal a sign of improvement as seen by his coaches?

6 games is nothing when you are talking about that low of ppg. He would have got maybe 1 or 2 more pts, and played a lot more. If he was improving, he should have hit 35-40+ pts as he had a lot of ice time for so little production. Also, I don't think he is considered some gem in other areas of the game, which would at least make the pts less important. 30 pt player is fine, if they are great in their own end, and I am not convinced that Roslovic is going to be a steal type of player.

 

[ShippinItDaily]

6 games is nothing when you are talking about that low of ppg. He would have got maybe 1 or 2 more pts, and played a lot more. If he was improving, he should have hit 35-40+ pts as he had a lot of ice time for so little production. Also, I don't think he is considered some gem in other areas of the game, which would at least make the pts less important. 30 pt player is fine, if they are great in their own end, and I am not convinced that Roslovic is going to be a steal type of player.

I'm not convinced he would be a steal either. But an already good middle six option who is only 23 and showing measurable improvement in certain areas of the game is a good target for a 2nd round draft pick that you one day hope can be that good. That is my argument. And I think with this team he is even a little bit more desirable than he would be for many others considering all the uncertainty around any internal options filling a #2 center role.