Rumor: Trades/Proposals: This Offseason can we transition from the "Wasted Years" to living in the Golden Y

[The Nuge]

I mean at the end of the day isn't Jones gone regardless? Either in trade or to Seattle?

not necessarily. A guy like Kassian/Archi/Khaira might make more sense. Seattle will easily have 6 better dmen available

What I haven't seen much of (or any) on this thread, is if we did get Keith, what would that do to our protected list for the expansion draft?

It seems most here think Jones will get picked up by Seattle. If he's a part of a Keith trade, then who do we realistically lose? Kassian?

If we did do some kind of trade where we send Jones and 50% of Kostco or Neal, then exposed Keith, who Seattle takes, then it would be us losing Jones (who would have been gone anyway), plus getting rid of 50% of a bad contract for free.

Or am I out to lunch lol

The biggest impact would be not being able to protect Klefa just in case they decided to gamble he’ll get healthy

 

[LTIR]

There's no way Laggesson or Russell should be ahead of Jones at this point and Samorukov and Broberg are one and two years away respectively.



Yeah there's a reason for that. People see a guy who makes some mistakes and they fixate on those especially when they end up in the back of the net (like that one game where he made a bad pinch at the red line that lead to a GA that everyone blamed on him and not the three other players who had chances to stop it).

And why should Jones be ahead of Lagesson or Russell again?
Jones was given a fair shot to take a 2nd pairing spot and run with it but failed big time.

Whatever he learned over last offseason ruined his game and he would have struggled in the AHL as well.
Lagesson was ruined by Tippett with all those 12min icetime games (half games )and random scratchings despite looking very good with Larsson ..
Russell was better than both but there is no convincing hfoil oil of anything re Russell so I won't argue.

Jones was never a top prospect and never was projected to be a top 4 Dman. The best thing he's got going for him is his last name without it he would be a no namer middle pairing Dman in AHL.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

And why should Jones be ahead of Lagesson or Russell again?
Jones was given a fair shot to take a 2nd pairing spot and run with it but failed big time.

analytics bro

 

[belair]

This is how I see him too. Has the tools, but no toolbox.

I see Jones' top, top end potential as a #4D on an average team paired with a guy that's way better than him. Don't see him possibly anchoring a d pair on his own that is at all respectable in the top 4.

Petry on the other hand was showing clear signs of being a top end defenseman, and was already an NHL top 4 pretty clearly by the time he was traded. The f*** up there was MacMoron walking his deal to UFA because he didn't like him. Meanwhile in that UFA season he started to blossom into a player that had real quality (I recall him taking over a game in Montreal in his last season that we won in OT), but had no trade value because he played for a shit team and was UFA.

These aren't remotely comparable situations. Petry largely was already a top 4 quality D when we traded him. Jones is still barely an NHLer.

Petry is horrific example for any of our current young defensemen. He was a player with multiple seasons carrying a very significant workload on a very poor defensive team with very poor goaltending. It's hard to look good in that situation.

Considering the team's history of failing to internally develop quality NHL defensemen, it's not surprising to see fans overvaluing very average players though.

 

[LTIR]

analytics bro

When a coach can't even trust you to play 14mins per game then you don't need much more analysis.

Nurse wasn't even on top PP unit so that makes it even worse. Jones was responsible for burning out Nurse. Russell was fine.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

When a coach can't even trust you to play 14mins per game then you don't need much more analysis.

Nurse wasn't even on top PP unit so that makes it even worse. Jones was responsible for burning out Nurse. Russell was fine.

oh I agree, but the stats guys will tell you different

 

[Del Preston]

Caleb Jones gets lost on the ice like no other defenseman on the team. I've lost count of how many times an opposing forward somehow snuck behind him either at the offensive blue line or in the neutral zone. End the madness.

 

[Soundwave]

I mean Petry was inconsistent and a stomach turning -25 in 59 games with not a ton of offense to show for it either (a year after finishing -22) his last season here.

He wasn't a lock to be a top 4 D at that point at all.

It's all great to yell about "draft and develop!!" but it's like those people that scream they want a puppy and then want to bail out when the puppy shits all over the floor and they have to clean it up. That's part of having a puppy too.

Young D frustrating the f*** outta you is kinda part of the process unfortunately.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Petry is horrific example for any of our current young defensemen. He was a player with multiple seasons carrying a very significant workload on a very poor defensive team with very poor goaltending. It's hard to look good in that situation.

Considering the team's history of failing to internally develop quality NHL defensemen, it's not surprising to see fans overvaluing very average players though.

Petry or Keith?

 

[Oilhawks]

I mean Petry was inconsistent and a stomach turning -25 in 59 games with not a ton of offense to show for it either (a year after finishing -22) his last season here.

He wasn't a lock to be a top 4 D at that point at all.

It's all great to yell about "draft and develop!!" but it's like those people that scream they want a puppy and then want to bail out when the puppy shits all over the floor and they have to clean it up. That's part of having a puppy too.

Young D frustrating the f*** outta you is kinda part of the process unfortunately.

Yup, but at least the team he was on was a tire fire as well. Caleb Jones is playing on a much better team

 

[CycloneSweep]

I mean Petry was inconsistent and a stomach turning -25 in 59 games with not a ton of offense to show for it either (a year after finishing -22) his last season here.

He wasn't a lock to be a top 4 D at that point at all.

It's all great to yell about "draft and develop!!" but it's like those people that scream they want a puppy and then want to bail out when the puppy shits all over the floor and they have to clean it up. That's part of having a puppy too.

Young D frustrating the f*** outta you is kinda part of the process unfortunately.

Petry was being used as a top pairing d and struggled. Jones is being used as a bottom pairing d and struggling.

Very very different situations.