Rumor: Trade Rumours and Proposals Thread: Still No Deal

[Paralyzer008]

Ellis is nowhere near good enough to improve the Oilers D. He is a classic small, sheltered middle pairing D man who would flounder if forced to play higher in the lineup as any D obtained by trading Eberle would need to be. Look at his ice time last year. Solidly behind each of Weber, Josi, and Jones in avg toi and within 2 seconds of Ekholm. Ekholm did not get 1 second of PP time last year. He is a slightly better version of MAB and that's it. We already have a log jam of 3-5 defensemen. If Eberle or another substantial mix of assets go, there'd better be a guy with legit top pairing potential. That is not Ellis.

I think Ellis is more of a Yak-return guy than an Eberle-return guy, but that being said, Ellis is not a MAB clone. Much more defensively able. Playing with Ekholm helps him quite a bit, but he's playing higher competition and more minutes than Jones this year.

He's a solid No.4. Would hope that's more of a Yak return.

 

[McWeber]

I guess I'm in the minority that thinks Ellis is a great player on a stacked blue line. I could see him being a suitable RH shot first pairing dman if not now then in a year or two. He's young cost controlled and isn't soft at all. May be a bit undersized but if he was Schultz's replacement it would still improve our "toughness". I admit I could be totally wrong but I see serious upside in him.

 

[SK13]

Ellis is a nice fit because the Oilers have a real right shot PP problem. He's not a bad defenseman, although he is HIGHLY sheltered on that team and I guess that's scary for a team like the Oilers.

 

[McMozesmadness]

This is my "all in" team:

Most of these would take place in the offseason:

TRADES:
R.N.Hopkins
M.Fayne
B.Yakimov
FOR
T.Hamonic
B.Nelson

N.Yakupov
FOR
A.Lowry
J.Lipon

J.Schultz
1st (16) EDM
FOR
K.Shattenkirk

BUYOUT:
- A.Ference

SIGNINGS:
UFA:
- T.Brouwer 2 x 5.5
- E.Gryba 1 x 900k
- C.Talbot 2 x 1.5m
RFA:
- B.Davidson 4 x 2.2m
- A.Lowry 4 x 2.5m
- A.Nilsson 4 x 3.0

FORWARDS:
T.Hall - L.Draisaitl - T.Brouwer
A.Lowry - C.McDavid - J.Eberle
B.Pouliot - B.Nelson - A.Slepyshev
M.Hendricks - M.Letestu - I.Pakarinen
L.Korpikoski - A.Lander

FIRST CALL-UPS
- K.Kessy
- J.Khaira
- J.Lipon

DEFENCE:
O.Klefbom - K.Shattenkirk
D.Nurse - T.Hamonic
B.Davidson - A.Sekera
E.Gryba

FIRST CALL-UPS
- G.Reinhart
- D.Simpson
- J.LaLeggia

GOAL:
A.Nilsson
C.Talbot
*Goaltending is still a "wait and see" area.

Caphit: 68.7

 

[Spawn]

Ellis is a nice fit because the Oilers have a real right shot PP problem. He's not a bad defenseman, although he is HIGHLY sheltered on that team and I guess that's scary for a team like the Oilers.

Ryan Ellis is a decent d-man. But he hasn't been a good PP player in the NHL. He's honestly not a better option than Schultz on the PP. They're both pretty bad PP performers.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

I watched the Dallas game tonight and even though STL shut them down Demers looked great. Looked like a guy who has figured it out. Highly doubt he makes it to FA but if he doe chia should be veeeerry interested.

I'd love to add Spurgeon, think we could get him for picks/prospects. Used to hate the idea because I thought he was too small, but the kid can play. His numbers are good, he's West tested and I think he would pair well with some of our options on the left side. Plus he's a hometown kid and I bet we could get him on a good value contract.

 

[SK13]

Ryan Ellis is a decent d-man. But he hasn't been a good PP player in the NHL. He's honestly not a better option than Schultz on the PP. They're both pretty bad PP performers.

Interesting.

It's arguably the ability that got him drafted in the first round. He may have been Canada's all time best PP QB on the back-end at the WJC.

 

[Up the Irons]

Very tough decision to make with RNH. He is nice insurance to have and no doubt he will go on a run at some point and help to team win games but his trade value is only going to keep dropping.

He's 22 right now so a good chunk of his value is probably based on his potential. A team might think that putting him in a different system could lead to a 70 point center. If we wait until he is 24, that potential won't be so appealing and his value will simply be that of a 50 point player.

If Seth Jones is on the table, I think you have to make that trade.

I agree.

 

[Up the Irons]

The Oilers can be one of the only teams in the NHL to be able to run 3 elite C's and still be able to afford it.

I don't mind if they pay Draisaitl, RNH and McDavid to run an incredible core.

This will allow us to run 3 awesome scoring lines like our foes in Chicago.

The next question is: Can you then afford a 6M winger?

You only can, in my opinion, if it's Taylor Hall. Or, for my money, a guy that plays hard every night.

Jordan Eberle is a solid complimentary player. If he's being paid 4-5M, you're really happy. At 6M though, if we need to spread that money somewhere else AND we need to deal for a D-man, he's the guy that's replaceable. Also, the guy rarely wins a battle on the boards.

You'd think a few free agents would sign for a bit cheaper and provide similar production here if they know they get to play with elite center talent.

Now, if you like Eberle, and you don't want to deal him, move Yakupov then. We can roll with Hall-Drai, RNH-Ebs, McD-vet winger tandems. Not the same salary reduction though.

except, RNH is not even remotely close to an elite C. he is an average 2C, or a very good, but overpaid 3C.

that's the whole thing about this RNH question; some people still see (or hope for) an elite player, while others (me included) don't see this elite talent.

I watched Calgary last nite. Godreau had breakaways, and several great chances, that he created. When was the last time you saw RNH get a break away? Or create a great chance? About all he does is steal pucks well, and creates maybe 1 chance a game because of it. Just watch him, most shifts he doesn't do a damn thing. He isn't remotely elite. He is Shaun Horcoff II, without the FA wins.

Is he hurt? Is he just having a down year? well, maybe. But, we've giving the benefit of the doubt in the past and got burned for it (Gagner). There are signs that what you see is what you get with RNH. He is small and thin, and not a speedster. What does that usually spell in today's game?

How about pouncing early and getting something of value before its too late?

 

[StoveTopStauffer]

except, RNH is not even remotely close to an elite C. he is an average 2C, or a very good, but overpaid 3C.

that's the whole thing about this RNH question; some people still see (or hope for) an elite player, while others (me included) don't see this elite talent.

I watched Calgary last nite. Godreau had breakaways, and several great chances, that he created. When was the last time you saw RNH get a break away? Or create a great chance? About all he does is steal pucks well, and creates maybe 1 chance a game because of it. Just watch him, most shifts he doesn't do a damn thing. He isn't remotely elite. He is Shaun Horcoff II, without the FA wins.

Is he hurt? Is he just having a down year? well, maybe. But, we've giving the benefit of the doubt in the past and got burned for it (Gagner). There are signs that what you see is what you get with RNH. He is small and thin, and not a speedster. What does that usually spell in today's game?

How about pouncing early and getting something of value before its too late?

He's either injured or simply in a slump. Guy was a lot better than this last year. Lets also not pretend that whole line Poo - Nuge - Eberle doesn't suck. Kind of odd how poorly they are playing to be honest, considering how effective that line was last season.

I don't expect him to put up big numbers but if he can do well enough to put up 55-60pts and get back his solid defensive game, he is hardly an average 2C. Overpaid maybe by like $1m but we had way more than that in worse places.

 

[Neatman]

except, RNH is not even remotely close to an elite C. he is an average 2C, or a very good, but overpaid 3C.

that's the whole thing about this RNH question; some people still see (or hope for) an elite player, while others (me included) don't see this elite talent.

I watched Calgary last nite. Godreau had breakaways, and several great chances, that he created. When was the last time you saw RNH get a break away? Or create a great chance? About all he does is steal pucks well, and creates maybe 1 chance a game because of it. Just watch him, most shifts he doesn't do a damn thing. He isn't remotely elite. He is Shaun Horcoff II, without the FA wins.

Is he hurt? Is he just having a down year? well, maybe. But, we've giving the benefit of the doubt in the past and got burned for it (Gagner). There are signs that what you see is what you get with RNH. He is small and thin, and not a speedster. What does that usually spell in today's game?

How about pouncing early and getting something of value before its too late?

Hopkins has been leaned on to play pk and heavy defensive minutes against the opposition's best. He also plays with guys who are no where near as defensively able as himself. Furthermore, he plays with defenseman that aren't very goof and often have trouble recovering and moving the puck.

I think he is overplayed and often is too tired to contribute offensively.

The fact that 20 games of Draisaitl playing well makes most of hfoil think RNHs is expendable goes to show you guys have learned absolutely nothing from our C depth issues in the past.

He's 22. How many 22 year olds play minutes like he does against top opposition. And he STILL scores at a reasonable level (especially considering we're looking at a small shot of the season in which he has had an obvious cold streak).

 

[Tarus]

except, RNH is not even remotely close to an elite C. he is an average 2C, or a very good, but overpaid 3C.

that's the whole thing about this RNH question; some people still see (or hope for) an elite player, while others (me included) don't see this elite talent.

I watched Calgary last nite. Godreau had breakaways, and several great chances, that he created. When was the last time you saw RNH get a break away? Or create a great chance? About all he does is steal pucks well, and creates maybe 1 chance a game because of it. Just watch him, most shifts he doesn't do a damn thing. He isn't remotely elite. He is Shaun Horcoff II, without the FA wins.

Is he hurt? Is he just having a down year? well, maybe. But, we've giving the benefit of the doubt in the past and got burned for it (Gagner). There are signs that what you see is what you get with RNH. He is small and thin, and not a speedster. What does that usually spell in today's game?

How about pouncing early and getting something of value before its too late?

Agreed, he's not an elite player, and really has never shown the potential to be elite either. Even the "he takes the tough defensive assignments" argument that people fall back on to justify his worth as a player is suspect, considering he's been up to this point the 25 minute a night guy who routinely gets punted around by opposing top lines, and a major contributor to Edmonton's recent run as the worst defensive team in hockey(by that i mean, the last few years). Even now, coaching issues are cleared up and guys like Hall who were routinely blamed for RNH's defensive woes now look good defensively, but the RNH line is still folding like a cheap tent; just like they were last year when the Oilers went on an unsustainable scoring run with no actual improvement in their ability to play defense or win games.

He's an adequate trigger man on a line that can create offense for him, but he lacks playmaking vision and the ability to do anything more than survive defensively against his opponents. It'll probably click at some point and he'll go on a 5 year run like Stephan Weiss did after his early career struggles, but it won't be as an elite player that many expected him to be.

Not that it's a bad thing, he's still a valuable NHL player, he's just not a really good one.

 

[Up the Irons]

Hopkins has been leaned on to play pk and heavy defensive minutes against the opposition's best. He also plays with guys who are no where near as defensively able as himself. Furthermore, he plays with defenseman that aren't very goof and often have trouble recovering and moving the puck.

I think he is overplayed and often is too tired to contribute offensively./l

that could be.

The fact that 20 games of Draisaitl playing well makes most of hfoil think RNHs is expendable goes to show you guys have learned absolutely nothing from our C depth issues in the past.

He's 22. How many 22 year olds play minutes like he does against top opposition. And he STILL scores at a reasonable level (especially considering we're looking at a small shot of the season in which he has had an obvious cold streak).

how many real 1Cs need to be giving excuses? That fact that we have to explain away shortcomings with excuses, without a disclosed injury, says something.

i just don't see this highend talent. I see an average 2C. but, like some have said, there might not be anything wrong with that, if we can afford it.

 

[frag2]

He's either injured or simply in a slump. Guy was a lot better than this last year. Lets also not pretend that whole line Poo - Nuge - Eberle doesn't suck. Kind of odd how poorly they are playing to be honest, considering how effective that line was last season.

I don't expect him to put up big numbers but if he can do well enough to put up 55-60pts and get back his solid defensive game, he is hardly an average 2C. Overpaid maybe by like $1m but we had way more than that in worse places.

I lol at that being brought up because he's on pace for...another 56 pt year

It's almost like it's his offensive ceiling

 

[frag2]

Agreed, he's not an elite player, and really has never shown the potential to be elite either. Even the "he takes the tough defensive assignments" argument that people fall back on to justify his worth as a player is suspect, considering he's been up to this point the 25 minute a night guy who routinely gets punted around by opposing top lines, and a major contributor to Edmonton's recent run as the worst defensive team in hockey(by that i mean, the last few years). Even now, coaching issues are cleared up and guys like Hall who were routinely blamed for RNH's defensive woes now look good defensively, but the RNH line is still folding like a cheap tent; just like they were last year when the Oilers went on an unsustainable scoring run with no actual improvement in their ability to play defense or win games.

He's an adequate trigger man on a line that can create offense for him, but he lacks playmaking vision and the ability to do anything more than survive defensively against his opponents. It'll probably click at some point and he'll go on a 5 year run like Stephan Weiss did after his early career struggles, but it won't be as an elite player that many expected him to be.

Not that it's a bad thing, he's still a valuable NHL player, he's just not a really good one.

I think he can be a good player if he actually sorts out his physical shortcomings. The fact he's playing in the West works against him. I mean stylistically, he does look like a really really poor man's Datsyuk at times but most of the time, he just looks like a junior player getting pushed around.

 

[Tarus]

I think he can be a good player if he actually sorts out his physical shortcomings. The fact he's playing in the West works against him. I mean stylistically, he does look like a really really poor man's Datsyuk at times but most of the time, he just looks like a junior player getting pushed around.

I doubt he gets all that much bigger or stronger, you see him these days and he's filled out his frame. He has issues beyond just his physical stature though, he's a bit of a timid player.

The lack of ability to win physical battles would be acceptable, if he brought the offensive dimension he was drafted for. Eberle's main worth as a small, soft winger is his ability as a dynamic puckhander, shoot, and scorer; RNH has yet to display any of those types of attributes at the NHL level to make up for his ineffectiveness in other areas.

 

[KenLinsemanFanClub]

I think he can be a good player if he actually sorts out his physical shortcomings. The fact he's playing in the West works against him. I mean stylistically, he does look like a really really poor man's Datsyuk at times but most of the time, he just looks like a junior player getting pushed around.

Datsyuk was 23 years old before he really started to show what he was in the NHL. Granted, he didn't come over until he was 21 but I think it's a little early to write RNH off as a 3rd line center. He may end up being stuck there on this team but he could have a very big impact on a lot of other teams in the league as a first or second line center. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him moved at the draft.

 

[oilwave]

This is my "all in" team:

Most of these would take place in the offseason:

TRADES:
R.N.Hopkins
M.Fayne
B.Yakimov
FOR
T.Hamonic
B.Nelson

N.Yakupov
FOR
A.Lowry
J.Lipon

J.Schultz
1st (16) EDM
FOR
K.Shattenkirk

BUYOUT:
- A.Ference

SIGNINGS:
UFA:
- T.Brouwer 2 x 5.5
- E.Gryba 1 x 900k
- C.Talbot 2 x 1.5m
RFA:
- B.Davidson 4 x 2.2m
- A.Lowry 4 x 2.5m
- A.Nilsson 4 x 3.0

FORWARDS:
T.Hall - L.Draisaitl - T.Brouwer
A.Lowry - C.McDavid - J.Eberle
B.Pouliot - B.Nelson - A.Slepyshev
M.Hendricks - M.Letestu - I.Pakarinen
L.Korpikoski - A.Lander

FIRST CALL-UPS
- K.Kessy
- J.Khaira
- J.Lipon

DEFENCE:
O.Klefbom - K.Shattenkirk
D.Nurse - T.Hamonic
B.Davidson - A.Sekera
E.Gryba

FIRST CALL-UPS
- G.Reinhart
- D.Simpson
- J.LaLeggia

GOAL:
A.Nilsson
C.Talbot
*Goaltending is still a "wait and see" area.

Caphit: 68.7

There is no way you get shattenkirk for cheaper than hamonic.

 

[Up the Irons]

Datsyuk was 23 years old before he really started to show what he was in the NHL. Granted, he didn't come over until he was 21 but I think it's a little early to write RNH off as a 3rd line center. He may end up being stuck there on this team but he could have a very big impact on a lot of other teams in the league as a first or second line center. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him moved at the draft.

not a chance as a 1C; maybe as a 2C.

 

[PinSeeker]

Statistically last time I looked he was 32nd in C scoring. Through a brutal slump or possible injury. He isn't right at the moment.
I'm not judging yet and those making definitive statements ought to do the same.

 

[Spawn]

I lol at that being brought up because he's on pace for...another 56 pt year

It's almost like it's his offensive ceiling

woah here. Let's not get out of hand

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

Statistically last time I looked he was 32nd in C scoring. Through a brutal slump or possible injury. He isn't right at the moment.
I'm not judging yet and those making definitive statements ought to do the same.

Statistically that's good enough for 2c

 

[PinSeeker]

Statistically that's good enough for 2c

Which is fine with me - an elite 2C statistically through a terrible stretch.Is that a problem?

 

[Bryanbryoil]

McLellan compares him to Pavelski. If that is his honest assessment of the player then we probably aren't trading him anytime soon. It does however mean that we could see him moved to the wing at some point.

 

[CaptainSexyPants]

except, RNH is not even remotely close to an elite C. he is an average 2C, or a very good, but overpaid 3C.

that's the whole thing about this RNH question; some people still see (or hope for) an elite player, while others (me included) don't see this elite talent.

I watched Calgary last nite. Godreau had breakaways, and several great chances, that he created. When was the last time you saw RNH get a break away? Or create a great chance? About all he does is steal pucks well, and creates maybe 1 chance a game because of it. Just watch him, most shifts he doesn't do a damn thing. He isn't remotely elite. He is Shaun Horcoff II, without the FA wins.

Is he hurt? Is he just having a down year? well, maybe. But, we've giving the benefit of the doubt in the past and got burned for it (Gagner). There are signs that what you see is what you get with RNH. He is small and thin, and not a speedster. What does that usually spell in today's game?

How about pouncing early and getting something of value before its too late?

I'm just.....I can't even..