Speculation: Trade Rumours and Proposals Thread Part 18:Soli Smells Like He Needs a Shower Edition

[KlimasLoveChild]

Letang's emergence was quite a surprise.

Good teams also have depth at D. Oilers have neither elite talent nor depth.

Pitt had #2/3-like contributions from the likes of Gonchar/Whitney/Letang/Orpik over the course of the Pens becoming contenders.

The Oilers have Petry - the only guy I'd put in the same conversation as those guys. Hopefully Schultz/Klefa can step up, but I think they are one legit top pairing defenseman away.

The Russian Chris Pronger says hello

 

[Conkanen*]

We are 3-5 years away from seriously even being in the discussion for a Stanley Cup contender.

I think we need to just accept that.

Not even adding Shea Weber to this mix makes this a Stanley Cup contender overnight (factoring in what would have to be given up).

If we're smart we develop Schultz and Klefbom the right way and give them leeway to make mistakes.

This rebuild I see more like the way Vancouver built their team around the Sedins ... that was a pretty slow burn but they eventually did get their shot at the Cup (too bad for them they blew it).

A million times This.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

I think Rangers and Blue Jackets will have interest in Hemsky. Perhaps Buffalo and Phoenix also.

Not so sure the Jackets will anymore after acquiring Gaborik at the deadline. 13.5 mil is an awful lot to spend on 2 complimentary right wingers.

Hemsky should have been traded at the deadline.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

Poster on the main board says it's down to Edm/Min/Wpg.

No idea where he got this info, but I hope he is correct.

Tencer mentioned those as the teams on Oilers Now today

 

[aleshemsky83]

In regards to Tim Thomas, how good actually is he?

The guy was a journeyman for 10+ years (including a stint with the Oilers), then magically becomes an insanely good goalkeeper - when Chara is playing 25-30 minutes per night in front of him.

It definitely passed the eyeball test. He was also a great goalie in Europe do he had the credetials. That happens some times. Everybody knows the story of Johnny Bower and Marty St Louis. Two hall of famers

 

[Hemsky4PM]

Columbus need to sign Babrovsky and Anisimov. I don't see them wanting Hemsky at all.

I think Nashville, St. Louis and Florida are reasonable targets. Expect a 2nd rounder in return.

I would also be fine with flipping Hemsky for Halak.

 

[s7ark]

Tencer mentioned those as the teams on Oilers Now today

I think that info is from Russo, and he later said he'd seen those teams reported, and that he didn't mean to imply they were the only ones.

Jonathan Willis ‏@JonathanWillis 8h

No news yet on Raanta's choice, but @Russostrib names the #Oilers and #NHLJets as the other two teams in race with #MNWild for him.

Michael Russo Michael Russo ‏@Russostrib 7h

@JonathanWillis I just meant those were two teams I've seen reported. Don't know for fact those are only 2

Still, here's hoping MacT can get Raanta signed. It sounds like he could be a hidden gem. Belov was an encouraging start for MacT. I hope he can bring in another top Euro.

 

[Oil In My Veins]

Why wouldn't the Oilers just bring up Todd Nelson as an assistant coach? I heard on Gregor (I think) yesterday that some guys have a head coach mentality and others assistant mentality. Can we just take a head coach from another system and expect him to take a lesser role at a higher level?

I think you answered your own question, no?

Well then you don't make the deal. It's pretty simple, if you don't think Eberle and 7th overall is enough for a player who is VERY good but hasn't really done anything (no Norris nominations, etc), then perhaps fact is turning into Myth for this player.

This is the definition of "doing anything"?

 

[The Perfect Human*]

We are 3-5 years away from seriously even being in the discussion for a Stanley Cup contender.

I think we need to just accept that.

Not even adding Shea Weber to this mix makes this a Stanley Cup contender overnight (factoring in what would have to be given up).

If we're smart we develop Schultz and Klefbom the right way and give them leeway to make mistakes.

This rebuild I see more like the way Vancouver built their team around the Sedins ... that was a pretty slow burn but they eventually did get their shot at the Cup (too bad for them they blew it).

VAN's window was about 5 years with the Sedin's due to poor management and extremely late blooming of the Sedins considering they were that high of picks. You don't undergo 10 years of struggle for a small window of competition.

Meanwhile PIT/CHI have created 15yr windows for themselves by proper needs-addressing and management. LA has done the same thing, solid 10-12 year window.

You don't sit on the same 4-5 guys on an imbalanced team and wait for miracles, especially when one is top-10 in scoring and is in an early but likely long-term prime phase. You take advantage of that and surround them with required assets.

That Vancouver model disgusts me if that's the template for the Oilers.

EDIT: That early-2000's VAN team with the Sedin's clearly contended, but the Oilers don't have the vets that they had (Naslund, Ohlund, Jovo, Morrison, Bertuzzi). The 10yrs from 99-2009 if they'd only had the Sedin's around would have been tank city for that club. Hence 10yrs of struggle for a 5yr window

 

[The Perfect Human*]

This is the definition of "doing anything"?

LOL haven't you seen our kids' multiple Art Ross/Selke/Hart nominations?

 

[Up the Irons]

VAN's window was about 5 years with the Sedin's due to poor management and extremely late blooming of the Sedins considering they were that high of picks. You don't undergo 10 years of struggle for a small window of competition.

Meanwhile PIT/CHI have created 15yr windows for themselves by proper needs-addressing and management. LA has done the same thing, solid 10-12 year window.

You don't sit on the same 4-5 guys on an imbalanced team and wait for miracles, especially when one is top-10 in scoring and is in an early but likely long-term prime phase. You take advantage of that and surround them with required assets.

That Vancouver model disgusts me if that's the template for the Oilers.

EDIT: That early-2000's VAN team with the Sedin's clearly contended, but the Oilers don't have the vets that they had (Naslund, Ohlund, Jovo, Morrison, Bertuzzi). The 10yrs from 99-2009 if they'd only had the Sedin's around would have been tank city for that club. Hence 10yrs of struggle for a 5yr window

Great post.

 

[Mcnofool6110]

Let's get Raanta!!

 

[Mcnotloilersfan]

VAN's window was about 5 years with the Sedin's due to poor management and extremely late blooming of the Sedins considering they were that high of picks. You don't undergo 10 years of struggle for a small window of competition.

Meanwhile PIT/CHI have created 15yr windows for themselves by proper needs-addressing and management. LA has done the same thing, solid 10-12 year window.

You don't sit on the same 4-5 guys on an imbalanced team and wait for miracles, especially when one is top-10 in scoring and is in an early but likely long-term prime phase. You take advantage of that and surround them with required assets.

That Vancouver model disgusts me if that's the template for the Oilers.

EDIT: That early-2000's VAN team with the Sedin's clearly contended, but the Oilers don't have the vets that they had (Naslund, Ohlund, Jovo, Morrison, Bertuzzi). The 10yrs from 99-2009 if they'd only had the Sedin's around would have been tank city for that club. Hence 10yrs of struggle for a 5yr window

Love this post. There is nothing to wait for now. Surround these kids with grit and talent and let them go for it. No, we probably won't win it next year, but if we start being competitive next year, the kids will grow faster.

 

[PeakMcOil]

Don't know if it's been mentioned but perhaps MacT's comments on Dubnyk were meant for Raanta as well, I'm sure the guy wants a chance where he;s going to be able to play. I consider Backstrom to be a little more established as a goaltender and Pavelec to be about equal, surely something he'd consider when making his decision.

 

[Supermassive]

Let's get Raanta!!

I'll get the van, you bring the paper bag masks!

 

[The Nuge]

I'll get the van, you bring the paper bag masks!

That'd give it away. We've gotta somehow blame it on the Wild...

 

[Soundwave]

VAN's window was about 5 years with the Sedin's due to poor management and extremely late blooming of the Sedins considering they were that high of picks. You don't undergo 10 years of struggle for a small window of competition.

Meanwhile PIT/CHI have created 15yr windows for themselves by proper needs-addressing and management. LA has done the same thing, solid 10-12 year window.

You don't sit on the same 4-5 guys on an imbalanced team and wait for miracles, especially when one is top-10 in scoring and is in an early but likely long-term prime phase. You take advantage of that and surround them with required assets.

That Vancouver model disgusts me if that's the template for the Oilers.

EDIT: That early-2000's VAN team with the Sedin's clearly contended, but the Oilers don't have the vets that they had (Naslund, Ohlund, Jovo, Morrison, Bertuzzi). The 10yrs from 99-2009 if they'd only had the Sedin's around would have been tank city for that club. Hence 10yrs of struggle for a 5yr window

The thing is honestly I'm just not sure we can follow the Pittsburgh/Chicago template because their players may quite frankly be better than ours.

Not all high draft picks are equal, we don't have a Crosby or Malkin and honestly Patrick Kane may be more skilled than any individual we have as well. And then there's Toews.

Maybe if we opted to tank 1-2 years earlier maybe we are talking about a core of Stamkos + Tavares + Hall or something. Then I would agree a rapid ascent to the top of the NHL would be expected.

But Hall is our best player, whereas in the above scenario he'd probably be third best by probably a decent margin. That's a big difference.

Not to say our kids are bad, they're all going to be very good players, but like the Sedins, it may take a little while longer for them to develop.

LA's situation is a little bizarre to be honest, how often does a team trade two 20-something All-Star caliber centers, and they by some weird stroke of fate end up on the same team? Holmgren is a little crazy and Columbus got hosed on the Carter situation. That rapidly accelerated their window on top of the fact that they didn't even have to give up any of Kopitar/Doughty/Quick/Brown to get them.

It would be like circumstances shifting so that we ended up getting Shea Weber + Eric Staal or something and only giving back Paajarvi, no.7 pick, Gagner, Hemsky, and Petry or something. Yes, in that case our window would accelerate rapidly too.

 

[Soundwave]

Let's get Raanta!!

Intrigued by this guy.

 

[aleshemsky83]

I only heard of him a couple hours ago when I read his name on this page, havent even googled this Raanta guys stats yet.

 

[MetaOil1993]

I only heard of him a couple hours ago when I read his name on this page, havent even googled this Raanta guys stats yet.

He has some spectacular stats, I hope we land him.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

The thing is honestly I'm just not sure we can follow the Pittsburgh/Chicago template because their players may quite frankly be better than ours.

Not all high draft picks are equal, we don't have a Crosby or Malkin and honestly Patrick Kane may be more skilled than any individual we have as well. And then there's Toews.

Maybe if we opted to tank 1-2 years earlier maybe we are talking about a core of Stamkos + Tavares + Hall or something. Then I would agree a rapid ascent to the top of the NHL would be expected.

But Hall is our best player, whereas in the above scenario he'd probably be third best by probably a decent margin. That's a big difference.

Not to say our kids are bad, they're all going to be very good players, but like the Sedins, it may take a little while longer for them to develop.

LA's situation is a little bizarre to be honest, how often does a team trade two 20-something All-Star caliber centers, and they by some weird stroke of fate end up on the same team? Holmgren is a little crazy and Columbus got hosed on the Carter situation. That rapidly accelerated their window on top of the fact that they didn't even have to give up any of Kopitar/Doughty/Quick/Brown to get them.

It would be like circumstances shifting so that we ended up getting Shea Weber + Eric Staal or something and only giving back Paajarvi, no.7 pick, Gagner, Hemsky, and Petry or something. Yes, in that case our window would accelerate rapidly too.

I agree that the Penguins model cannot be matched as they have 2 of the league's 3 best players, but I don't at all think the Hawks model is unrealistic. RNH, Hall & Eberle bring all of the attributes Toews and Kane do. The things that separate the Hawks & Oilers is defense and depth. The core pieces are there (Toews/Hall, Kane/RNH, Hossa/Eberle, Sharp/Yakupov). The biggest piece needed for the puzzle is a Duncan Keith. Craig Button thinks Klefbom's biggest comparable is Seabrook. Obviously that could take a few years, and in a perfect world J. Schultz would turn into Keith. The biggest worry is that we may not have time for that.

Ideally, to follow the Hawks model:
Hall-RNH-Eberle
Gagner-(1)-Yakupov
Paajarvi-(2)-(3)
Hartikainen-(4)-(5)
Brown

1- Big C, doesn't have to be an offensive stud. Chicago uses Handzus/Bolland (Acquired via trade: Umberger? Kesler? Couturier? Ott? Lecavalier? Stastny? Grabovski?)
2- Monahan? J. Mitchell, Leino, Z. Smith
3- MacArthur, Stafford, Bickell, Latendresse, PM Bouchard, Stalberg, Torrrs
4- Lander? B. Boyle, Lapierre, Gaustad
5- Latendresse, PM Bouchard, Torres

Bottom 6 of two way forwards that can ship in offensively, half of them big players. NOT guys like Smithson(no offense), Belanger(no offense, toughness), Smyth(no offense, toughness).

Smid-(1)
(2)-Petry
Belov-J. Schultz
Klefbom

1- Big minutes eater, puck-moving defenseman
2- Veteran top-4 defenseman, very responsible defensively

I'm sure there's great forward candidates that I missed, this was all off the top of my head.

 

[dustrock]

Meanwhile PIT/CHI have created 15yr windows for themselves by proper needs-addressing and management. LA has done the same thing, solid 10-12 year window.

15year window? Pittsburgh lost to the Flyers last year. Morrow & Iginla will be put out to pasture soon. Crosby could be done at any time and Malkin seems to be getting hurt a fair bit as well. Then there's Fleury.

As far as Chicago goes, just ask Replacement . They have a great core but Toews struggles in the playoffs, Bolland isn't the same player, and Seabrook was getting benched.

Even LA I'm not convinced will be a power for a decade to come.

Still, good drafting and asset management by these organizations, I agree with you.

 

[The Perfect Human*]

15year window? Pittsburgh lost to the Flyers last year. Morrow & Iginla will be put out to pasture soon. Crosby could be done at any time and Malkin seems to be getting hurt a fair bit as well. Then there's Fleury.

As far as Chicago goes, just ask Replacement . They have a great core but Toews struggles in the playoffs, Bolland isn't the same player, and Seabrook was getting benched.

Even LA I'm not convinced will be a power for a decade to come.

Still, good drafting and asset management by these organizations, I agree with you.

A "window" is a period of time wherein you're considered an annual threat to contend for the cup. CHI has been one since 2009. PIT since 2008. LAK since last year. BOS since 2010. VAN from 2010 onwards. SJS since 2007. Etc.

 

[Oiltankjob Fail]

15year window? Pittsburgh lost to the Flyers last year. Morrow & Iginla will be put out to pasture soon. Crosby could be done at any time and Malkin seems to be getting hurt a fair bit as well. Then there's Fleury.

As far as Chicago goes, just ask Replacement . They have a great core but Toews struggles in the playoffs, Bolland isn't the same player, and Seabrook was getting benched.

Even LA I'm not convinced will be a power for a decade to come.

Still, good drafting and asset management by these organizations, I agree with you.

And with all this said the last 4 teams in playoffs are the last 4 cup winners go figure

 

[Hemsky4PM]

Would anyone be in favour of taking a calculated risk on Ville Leino?

He's probably going to be bought out by the Sabres. 2 years at 2.5M per year?